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Hidden backdoor API to root privileges in Apple OS X

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Re: Hidden backdoor API to root privileges in Apple OS X

#191

Post by darkarmani »

moey wrote: post #11

With physical access, one has been able to create admin accounts for as long as I can remember. - Start up the Mac whilst holding down ⌘-S. This boots the Mac into Single-User Mode and provides a method of interacting with OS X via the command-line, with full root privileges. - Then check the filesystem to ensure there are no problems: "/sbin/fsck -fy" - Then mount the filesystem for it to be accessible: "/sbin/mount…

> With physical access

What malware requires physical access? This is a local privilege escalation to root. It's only local because you need an account on the machine to make it work, but it can be bootstrapped to a remote exploit.

Re: Hidden backdoor API to root privileges in Apple OS X

#192

Post by pXMzR2A »

jotux wrote: post #183
borgia wrote: post #143

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Yet many comments here are saying that people should just upgrade while it might solve the problem for some, there are ones who can't upgrade machines at will. It's dumbfounding how people here are simply shrugging this off and posting "So what? Just upgrade. Simples" type comments. This isn't acceptable. I know many people in creative industries alone who can't just upgrade immediately any time something comes out…

>It's dumbfounding how people here are simply shrugging this off and posting "So what? Just upgrade. Simples" type comments. Zero people is dumbfounding to you? Because that's how many people are saying that.

> Zero people

Reread the comments.

Re: Hidden backdoor API to root privileges in Apple OS X

#193

Post by jarfil »

TeMPOraL wrote: post #75
diminoten wrote: post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They'll care when their mouse starts moving by itself.

They'll just think "oh god, I have viruses!" and call whoever is the family's "computer whiz". The very concept of "this system is not secure" is something that ordinary user does not understand. Source: I'm a family "computer whiz" :/.

Many people still think that "Macs don't get viruses". Having that faith shattered can drive more than one away from the product.

Re: Hidden backdoor API to root privileges in Apple OS X

#194

Post by rotten »

borgia wrote: post #143
po1nter wrote: post #69

OT but I have to say that the amount of Apple apologists in these comments is mind blowing. HN reader of all people should be the ones urging Apple to issue a fix for a very serious bug such as this one. Yet many comments here are saying that people should just upgrade while it might solve the problem for some, there are ones who can't upgrade machines at will.

>Yet many comments here are saying that people should just upgrade while it might solve the problem for some, there are ones who can't upgrade machines at will. It's dumbfounding how people here are simply shrugging this off and posting "So what? Just upgrade. Simples" type comments. This isn't acceptable. I know many people in creative industries alone who can't just upgrade immediately any time something comes out…

I have 3 macs. One of them is an older iMac. I can't put enough RAM in it to run Mavericks (which is a memory hog). It is a perfectly good computer, there is no reason to upgrade from Lion.

The next one is a 3 year old Mac Mini. I upgraded to Yosemite and it performs TERRIBLY. It has 16G of RAM. I've tried everything. Yosemite just sucks. The machine is now much slower than the 6 or 7 year old iMac with only 4G or RAM. If it was practical to back out to Mavericks I would.

The last one is a 2 year old Macbook. I rely on it for my job. There is no way I'm going to risk the crappy Yosemite performance to upgrade. I'll live with the security flaw.

Here is what I now know about Apple: They will not support you for the lifetime of the product. They consistently release buggy code these days. Unless you are willing to shell out more money for new hardware every time they come out with something new, you will be stuck "as-is (with bugs)" until you get rid of it.

No more Apple anything for me. I'm thinking I'll switch the Mac Mini to Ubuntu if I can get it to work there. I'll use the iMac until it doesn't work any more, and when my Macbook is ready for an upgrade (in another year or two), I'll be trading in that still-Mavericks based system for a Linux laptop or maybe I'll go back to Windows.

Re: Hidden backdoor API to root privileges in Apple OS X

#195

Post by PopsiclePete »

mattdotc wrote: post #182
PopsiclePete wrote: post #168

Earlier quoted context omitted.

FWIW, 10.10.0 for me was perfect. 10.10.1 broke my wifi. Anytime the computer woke up from sleep, I'd have to reset the wifi card so it could find my access point. After 10.10.2 came out, I got my second-ever full computer lock-up. I've had the same OS image since 10.5 (migrated and upgraded multiple time, obviously) and this was the second time my computer required a hard reboot. And this was while watching a video…

>Windows is out of the question after seeing what a factory OEM image comes with nowadays. Fair play. Research the manufacturer's policy if you're buying pre-built. If you build your own desktops, this is not an issue. >I'm not giving them money and spending 2 days formatting/reinstalling/seeking out drivers on slow Taiwanese servers just to make a half-usable computer. When's the last time you actually installed dri…

>Fair play. Research the manufacturer's policy if you're buying pre-built. If you build your own desktops, this is not an issue.

I can build my own desktop, but I can't build my own laptop. I use laptops exclusively for work.

>When's the last time you actually installed drivers on a fresh Windows install?

Less than year ago on my girlfriend's VAIO laptop, actually. Windows 7.

>Microsoft has made progress on supporting a lot of hardware drivers via Windows Update. Intel also has a great driver update tool that will scan your system and make recommendations.

Yes, it mostly works, and I'm aware of it, which is why I boldly told my girlfriend I'd take me "an hour or so" to "fix" her laptop issues. Famous last words. And I wasn't exaggerating about "slow Taiwanese servers" - I'm talking less than 100kb/sec transfer speeds. Welcome to 1996.

>2 days is rather exaggerated. Most browsers display PDF. If you absolutely need to read a PDF, Foxit Reader is free, as in beer. Yes, you'll have to uncheck some boxes to avoid their bundled software. Big deal.

It is a big deal, to me. I don't like being treated like an idiot, being on the look-out for hidden toolbars and spyware every time I double-click "setup.exe". Am I capable of doing it? Yes. Do I want to bother, for a fricking PDF viewer or a java runtime? Absolutely no way, never again. BTW, 19/20 people seem to just leave the default check-boxes checked, since they don't understand what they're being asked and just want a fricking PDF viewer.

And Foxit IMO is a PITA. Comes with its own auto-updater too. I have never seen a PDF viewer needing so many automatic updates, so often; big ones, too.

Why can OS X come with a nice, bundled, PDF viewer, and the capability to export to PDF from everywhere, and in Windows-land, I'm forced to install either spyware or shit-ware? Why? Why is Windows still stuck in 1997 in this regard?

>Yeah, windows isn't great for a lot of developers' needs. You really could have just left your argument at this rather than spouting off the rest of that FUD.

FUD? I deal with Windows issues from relatives on a weekly basis. What FUD? Am I imagining all of these issues? Spyware and adware infested boxes that come to a crawl as soon as the poor sap has more than 2 Chrome windows open because the OEM decided that 2 GB is enough for Windows 7 and also installed their own "Media Center Experience" which starts up on boot and is written in .NET WPF, eating whatever RAM there's left? That one wasn't on the VAIO, it was on her previous HP laptop, but point still stands.

Yeah, maybe for a power user who built their own computer from scratch and did a clean install and carefully vetted every package as it was installed, sure, yeah nice experience. I have a Windows gaming box that is super lean and mean and it took a lot of effort to get it to this state.

But I still find myself scratching my head in disbelief every time a windows user tells me they need a new computer cause their existing one "just got real slow lately" even though they never touched the OS. And I know why it's slow too, I know before I even open it, dreading what I'm going to see in the notification area.

P.S. She's a very happy OS X user now, FWIW. One HP and one VAIO laptop later and another Microsoft ex-customer never coming back.

Re: Hidden backdoor API to root privileges in Apple OS X

#196

Post by revscat »

baldfat wrote: post #153
evilduck wrote: post #138

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Most of those are people giving fairly reasonable benefit of the doubt, no apologism. But I suspect you're probably about as biased against Apple as the people you're assuming are biased towards Apple.

Oh your really off base.. I am MUCH MORE biased against Apple. You know those Linux users who hate on Microsoft? I am the Linux user who HATES Apple since I was first lied to by Apple in 1983 (Color Mac coming in the next year, wasn't till March 1987) (Color Mac will destroy Amiga 1000 in 1985) I have never seen Apple as being honest or making products for me as a nerd. So I live mostly in Linux nowadays.

At least you're honest about it. Most who feel similarly will coat it in a thin veneer of pretend equal-handedness and categorically deny any emotional investment.

Re: Hidden backdoor API to root privileges in Apple OS X

#197

Post by greedo »

hyc_symas wrote: post #174
greedo wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm currently running 10.10.3 on a Mac Pro 1,1, at almost 9 years of use. Of course 10.10 isn't supported by Apple, but it works just fine, and with the combination of an SSD and cheap RAM, I imagine I can get another 3-4 years out of this desktop barring a hardware failure that pushes me to a new system.

... and now that you've posted that, I fully expect a mysterious hardware failure to suddenly manifest....

The good thing is that eBay is flooded with cheap old Mac Pros, so parts won't be hard to come by.

Re: Hidden backdoor API to root privileges in Apple OS X

#198

Post by PopsiclePete »

com2kid wrote: post #173
PopsiclePete wrote: post #168

Earlier quoted context omitted.

FWIW, 10.10.0 for me was perfect. 10.10.1 broke my wifi. Anytime the computer woke up from sleep, I'd have to reset the wifi card so it could find my access point. After 10.10.2 came out, I got my second-ever full computer lock-up. I've had the same OS image since 10.5 (migrated and upgraded multiple time, obviously) and this was the second time my computer required a hard reboot. And this was while watching a video…

> Windows is out of the question after seeing what a factory OEM image comes with nowadays. I'm not giving them money and spending 2 days formatting/reinstalling/seeking out drivers on slow Taiwanese servers just to make a half-usable computer. And then, after all that, spend another 2 days installing various adware infested shitware to get a fricking PDF viewer. Microsoft Signature PCs solve this problem. :) http://…

Don't know how many of these are at, say, Costco. Which is where many people shop.

I'm never buying a Windows laptop, so it doesn't affect me, but I'm still the resident "family IT specialist". And I know, I just know I'm going to be asked lots of questions I don't have the patience for, as these poor bastards wonder why their computers are slow, all because the shitty OEM wanted to make a few cents off pre-installed shitware.

It doesn't affect me directly, I don't touch Windows laptops unless I'm wearing gloves, but the principle of the thing pisses me off. You're being treated without respect, basically.

It's like a car manufacturer selling you a car with a "feature" that takes away 50 HP to play a jingle every time you turn on your headlights, all because the got paid $7.34 by the jingle manufacturer.

Re: Hidden backdoor API to root privileges in Apple OS X

#199

Post by jotux »

pXMzR2A wrote: post #192
jotux wrote: post #183

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>It's dumbfounding how people here are simply shrugging this off and posting "So what? Just upgrade. Simples" type comments. Zero people is dumbfounding to you? Because that's how many people are saying that.

> Zero people Reread the comments.

Please link to a comment that says something remotely close to, "So what? Just upgrade. Simples"

Re: Hidden backdoor API to root privileges in Apple OS X

#200

Post by semi-extrinsic »

vcxzxcv wrote: post #180
PopsiclePete wrote: post #168

Earlier quoted context omitted.

FWIW, 10.10.0 for me was perfect. 10.10.1 broke my wifi. Anytime the computer woke up from sleep, I'd have to reset the wifi card so it could find my access point. After 10.10.2 came out, I got my second-ever full computer lock-up. I've had the same OS image since 10.5 (migrated and upgraded multiple time, obviously) and this was the second time my computer required a hard reboot. And this was while watching a video…

>Linux is almost there. It's a crap shoot for me Just get Ubuntu Certified Hardware. They have over 500 models of laptops they certify. I have never had a kernel update break wifi. I don't know about all the other stuff, but most distributions store old kernels and allow you to boot back into the old kernel pretty easily. Don't know if this is an option on OS X.

Hell, I run Arch Linux on a number of laptops and workstations, and the only time I've had a kernel upgrade break anything was the wifi on my wife's old netbook some time around 3.12, and that was Broadcom's fault. So I downgraded to 3.11 (didn't even need network access for that), and a few months later on 3.14 it was working again.

Most of the upgrade pain I've had has been caused either by the migration to systemd or by the decision to unify /usr/bin, /bin, /usr/sbin and /sbin into one folder.

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