Earlier quoted context omitted.
Ha, I'm one of the ten thousand for both the XKCD and this post. Lucky me!
You mean, for the whole XKCD? Not just this issue, but the whole thing? I envy you so hard right now. (Unless you were going to be productive today).
The 500-mile email (2002)
131–140 of 145 posts
Re: The 500-mile email (2002)
#132Earlier quoted context omitted.
The FAQ answers this question. Basically; it was a long time ago, and the point of the story isn't in the detail. :) http://www.ibiblio.org/harris/500milemail-faq.html
Harumph. :/ Yes, I'm a terrible story-teller for this reason. To me, the details (especially in making sure the numbers line up with reality) are important.
Post-mortems are a case where you must have both story and correct details: lack the first, and you won't create change because the people who need to know in order to implement the required recommendations won't read the whole thing (or retain it later); lack the second, and really, how can anyone trust your recommendations?
Here, I was just trying to quickly bang out a funny anecdote. The things that stuck in my mind I could use to reverse-engineer numbers. I did this because—at the time I worked the incident—I was working with real numbers, so the story needed them for verisimilitude, to give a sense of what I was wrestling with. If I'd had any clue this mail would have taken on such a life of its own, I would have been more careful with them and gotten a tech reviewer and copy editor before posting.
This gets posted on some forum or another several times a year; for a long time I had a Google Alert on it and would hop in threads whenever it happened, since it always followed a common pattern:
1. Someone posts a link to the story, but not my canonical copy with a link to the FAQ.
2. More trusting and/or less-technical respondents upvote or forward or Like or +1 or quasisuperplauditize or whatever the medium has until it gets notice from...
3 ... less trusting and/or more-technical types, who expose the "flaws", most of which are covered in the FAQ.
4. Someone thinks to do a Google on "500 mile email", which returns as the top two results my canonical copy and the FAQ, and posts a link.
5. Most people lose interest while a few continue to squabble over ever-finer details.
Depending on at what point I jumped in, I could affect the speed of the above cycle, but it never changed the cycle itself. The fun of the story is following me through my own emotional cycle I felt when I worked the issue, starting with the initial "no way" to "you're having me on, right?" to "maybe...", to "dear God, this is actually happening", to "I must be going crazy", and finally to "Eureka!"
My intervention in the above cycle really wasn't adding that much to the enjoyment of the story, so I stopped doing it. (I'm not sure it's adding anything today, either, but Hacker News is an important enough forum for people I respect and care about that I thought I'd break vow and rejoin the fray this once.)
Re: The 500-mile email (2002)
#133Re: The 500-mile email (2002)
#134Earlier quoted context omitted.
I was looking for another famous sysadmin story, where the guy who also happens to be a top Linux developer (so maybe Alan Cox?) rescues a deeply broken Linux system where even glibc is no longer accessible by manipulating inodes in a running process. Or something. Over the years, my Google-fu has failed me. Any clue? :)
http://www.lug.wsu.edu/node/414 is what you are looking for.
For one thing, I'm pretty certain the story involved recovering a deleted file's inode via some other running process's FDs.
Re: The 500-mile email (2002)
#135Earlier quoted context omitted.
works exactly as in the blog post in fedora.
And Debian. For Mac, try brew install gnu-units and then run gunits.
I suspect that a lot more can convert millilightseconds to miles out-of-the-box now at least in part because of the popularity of this story over the past 13 years.
Re: The 500-mile email (2002)
#136If only every bug report that I received had been processed by a geostatistician... Usually I get a "hey, I can't get X to work". One of three responses from me usually fixes it: "Is your computer on?", "are you online?", and "try hitting refresh". I am actually surprised the sysadmin in this scenario thought it was a bad thing that the statistics department did their research and presented a well documented error.
On the other hand, there's the word document with nothing but a screen shot showing half of a useless error message.
Re: The 500-mile email (2002)
#137Earlier quoted context omitted.
Writing stories for a technical audience is tricky. I've been doing it for going on 10 years now, and I'm still not very good at it. A critical rule, however, is to omit detail, (a reader is unlikely to question an explanation they make up themselves) and most importantly, to omit details you know to be wrong . (It is impossible to nitpick a statement that is never said) An odd feature of our campus network at the ti…
Reminds me of the old saying, "it's better to stay silent and be thought a fool, than to open your mouth and confirm it." It's also a reason why short business emails are better than longer ones. You can always go more in depth. It takes skilled restraint to touch on only the most relevant details without losing the larger point.
Re: The 500-mile email (2002)
#138> And also being a good system administrator, I had written a sendmail.cf [...] Say what? Nobody writes a sendmail.cf from scratch, unless they are crazy. > ... that used the nice long self-documenting option and variable names available in Sendmail 8 rather than the cryptic punctuation-mark codes that had been used in Sendmail 5 Good system administrators stick to conservative, portable subsets of configuration and…
But I think your criticisms seem a little uninformed (or possibly over-informed by later practice to the point where you aren't considering this in the context of mid-1990's practice). Let's see...
> > And also being a good system administrator, I had written a sendmail.cf [...]
> Say what? Nobody writes a sendmail.cf from scratch, unless they are crazy.
I didn't say "from scratch". I used the m4 macros to create a cf, like everyone did at the time. Using the default file would only work if you still used email programs that read raw mbox files, had no email lists, and needed no interesting aliasing or vacation script behavior. Oh, and ran in an environment where it was reasonable to assume someone's canonical email address could be found via the equivalent of "echo "${USER}@${HOST#.}".
Very few production systems could get away with that; writing a sendmail.cf was standard practice. And with m4, you usually spoke of "writing" a file where today we'd call it "configuring" a file; either way it was taking boilerplate and replacing bits with things that were right for your situation. I assume you wouldn't have had an issue with my writing that I'd "configured" the sendmail.cf. That's all I did.
> > ... that used the nice long self-documenting option and variable names available in Sendmail 8 rather than the cryptic punctuation-mark codes that had been used in Sendmail 5
> Good system administrators stick to conservative, portable subsets of configuration and scripting languages, rather than bleeding edge stuff.
Hmm, you either weren't administering SunOS in the mid-90's or you're forgetting some details. SunOS still came with Sendmail 5 years* after best practice was to use Sendmail 8. Check out the O'Reilly Sendmail book of the time's pagecount: it was longer than the prior and the later versions because it had to document both. I'm not entirely certain SunOS (as opposed to Solaris) ever was upgraded to Sendmail 8 in the distribution; obviously the people using SunOS still so late were change-averse.
"Bleeding edge" != "the version that all but the most conservative holdouts are using". Also, remember that this was the same period we were doing the rsh/rlogin conversion to SSH. Sendmail 5 still had known security issues that were fixed in Sendmail 8. We were used to replacing system components when what the OS vendor was shipping us was literally dangerous to run.
And Sendmail 8's Sendmail 5 compatibility mode was simply there for testing; it was never intended to be used production long-term, so using a least-common-denominator sendmail.cf wouldn't have been "conservative and portable"; it would have been risky, bordering on malpractice.
> Since SunOS came with Sendmail 5, the upgraded Sendmail 8 should have been installed in some custom location with its own path so that it coexists with the stock Sendmail, and is not perturbed if the OS happens to upgrade that. > A good syadmin would stick that in some /usr/local/bin type local directory, and not overwrite /usr/bin/sendmail.
Again, either you didn't run this installation in the mid-90's or you're forgetting some details. /usr/lib/sendmail (notice the "lib"! Your referring to "/usr/bin/sendmail" suggests to me you definitely weren't running SunOS 4 or have forgotten details; sendmail was never in /usr/bin) couldn't be left alone, as other tools hardcoded that path. The actual executable was there, so symlinking couldn't be used to get around that.
Re: The 500-mile email (2002)
#139Another email incident at Microsoft worth reading [1]. [1] http://blogs.technet.com/b/exchange/archive/2004/04/08/10962...
Re: The 500-mile email (2002)
#140Earlier quoted context omitted.
It was a seriously accurate bug report. If only all users were so thoughtful.
> If only all users were so thoughtful. But then it sent him off in a direction not worth going. He literally started to map out how far emails would go if they succeeded. The whole time the error was in the timeout instead.