Ask HN: How do you deal with professional jealousy and getting older? • Hacker News Board

Re: Ask HN: How do you deal with professional jealousy and getting older?

#181

Post by eloisius » Wed, Apr 08, 2015, 1:08 PM UTC

tastyface wrote: post #155

vijucat wrote: post #64

> It's been getting better. It's not, it's getting worse. You are in a cycle of slave-driving yourself. You remind me of Jiddu Krishnamurthi's assertion that "Influence acts strongest when you don't realize that it is acting". I would venture that most of your accomplishments are a result of being told what you should do, what you should be. You will NEVER have the energy that the people whom you compare with have. B…

OP here. Believe me when I say that there's nothing more I'd rather do than what I'm doing right now. Not even in question. I love programming, I love the project I'm working on, and I love the ideas that are waiting to be worked on in my future. My heart fills with joy when I think about holding those finished products in my hands. When I get into the flow, I can zone out for days and work on my projects with hardly…

I always look for behavioral solutions first, because they are often easier to execute than quasi-philosophical changes of outlook, and IMO are often underestimated in their effectiveness.

Have you tried waking up early? I find that I will similarly veg out from 5pm onward. For the past few months I've been faithfully getting out of bed at 5:45 every morning (with the help of a clock radio). The peace hours between 6 and 9 are my favorite part of the day now.

I have 3 hours to myself to work on projects, work on a MOOC, do a self-check and orient myself to deal with the day.

Re: Ask HN: How do you deal with professional jealousy and getting older?

#182

Post by theandrewbailey » Wed, Apr 08, 2015, 1:08 PM UTC

mattmanser wrote: post #158

fit2rule wrote: post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, definitely this! If you're in your 20's and feeling like your "whole life" is wasted/lame/you're a loser .. well, have kids. It'll change your whole outlook, hopefully before you hit 30. Kids are awesome. They teach you that, at 20-something, you're not actually that experienced. You don't actually have a lot of time on the Earth. 20-something year olds - you're still kids. There's 3 or 4 more decades ahead of y…

What confuses me is how every person I know with kids complains their life is over, they don't do a lot, they have no control, they have no time for themselves and their life is basically over. And this is a mid-30s guy with a lot of friends with kids. And yet having kids is wonderful. I joked to my friend it is like Stockholm Syndrome. You have no choice. You made your bed and must now live in it. Of course you are…

Relevant: http://theoatmeal.com/comics/kids

Re: Ask HN: How do you deal with professional jealousy and getting older?

#183

Post by maroonblazer » Wed, Apr 08, 2015, 1:09 PM UTC

tastyface wrote: post #155

vijucat wrote: post #64

> It's been getting better. It's not, it's getting worse. You are in a cycle of slave-driving yourself. You remind me of Jiddu Krishnamurthi's assertion that "Influence acts strongest when you don't realize that it is acting". I would venture that most of your accomplishments are a result of being told what you should do, what you should be. You will NEVER have the energy that the people whom you compare with have. B…

OP here. Believe me when I say that there's nothing more I'd rather do than what I'm doing right now. Not even in question. I love programming, I love the project I'm working on, and I love the ideas that are waiting to be worked on in my future. My heart fills with joy when I think about holding those finished products in my hands. When I get into the flow, I can zone out for days and work on my projects with hardly…

It sounds like you have two problems: one long-term and one short-term.

Long-term problem: Comparing yourself to others. When done in modest amounts this can be a huge source of inspiration. But taken too far and it becomes a sure path to anxiety. Beyond that threshold the only person you should be comparing yourself to is the "you" from yesterday.

Short-term problem: Sounds like you have an addiction to distraction. I suffer from this also and just started reading this[0]. Too early into it to tell if it will help but so far it looks promising. I've also found the Pomodoro technique helpful.

[0]http://www.amazon.com/The-Distraction-Addiction-Information-...

Re: Ask HN: How do you deal with professional jealousy and getting older?

#184

Post by d3m » Wed, Apr 08, 2015, 1:12 PM UTC

1) Remember that tech news is biased towards that kind of people. They are the "ideal", young "wizkids", the ones that fit the narrative. The fact that you don't hear about 30 or 40-something entrepeneurs/engineers with great ideas that make a difference and/or make millions doesn't mean they don't exist.

2) You need to understand that there is always going to be somebody better, more talented and/or more hardworking. Remember to play the market, assess yourself objectivly, understand your strengths, understand the context, see the real problem, know where to push and get good at timing your pushes. Don't bruteforce, be sophisticated, precise and elegant. And most importantly, understand that the alternative to "The Constant Grind" is NOT being a couch potato. Remember that beating yourself accomplishes nothing. Be prepared to accept that if the procastination is too deep maybie, just maybie, you might just be lying to youself when you say you "love" what you are doing.

3) Read Patrick Mckenzie's blog: http://www.kalzumeus.com/

Re: Ask HN: How do you deal with professional jealousy and getting older?

#185

Post by riazrizvi » Wed, Apr 08, 2015, 1:19 PM UTC

vijucat wrote: post #64

> It's been getting better. It's not, it's getting worse. You are in a cycle of slave-driving yourself. You remind me of Jiddu Krishnamurthi's assertion that "Influence acts strongest when you don't realize that it is acting". I would venture that most of your accomplishments are a result of being told what you should do, what you should be. You will NEVER have the energy that the people whom you compare with have. B…

and while you are working it out, go back to work. It will likely take many years and you'll lose all your extra cash. I speak from experience.

Re: Ask HN: How do you deal with professional jealousy and getting older?

#186

Post by oilman » Wed, Apr 08, 2015, 1:20 PM UTC

benjamincburns wrote: post #177

tastyface wrote: post #155

Earlier quoted context omitted.

OP here. Believe me when I say that there's nothing more I'd rather do than what I'm doing right now. Not even in question. I love programming, I love the project I'm working on, and I love the ideas that are waiting to be worked on in my future. My heart fills with joy when I think about holding those finished products in my hands. When I get into the flow, I can zone out for days and work on my projects with hardly…

Reading the OP and this comment I can't help but think "hmm, sounds like me when I'm unmedicated." I'm a very ambitious and motivated person. I love stupid hard, nitty gritty problems. I've been writing code since I was 8. I landed my first coding job when I was 16 (working for the USAF Research Laboratory, no less). I'm now 29. Growing up I was always driven by my interests. If I wasn't interested, I wasn't going to…

This sounds A LOT like myself. I've never really considered going to a psychiatrist or neurologist, I thought my experience was somewhat normal. Do you mind elaborating some about what sort of medication/condition are you talking about?

Re: Ask HN: How do you deal with professional jealousy and getting older?

#187

Post by rickcusick » Wed, Apr 08, 2015, 1:21 PM UTC

ganeumann wrote: post #67

FourthProtocol wrote: post #16

I'm 45, and have about 60 unfinished side protects in my /Dev folder. I've also just reached the feature complete milestone on my first side project that will actually ship. After working on it, or a variation of it for SEVEN YEARS. Your question made me smile. Are you having fun? I'm having lots of fun, and have had throughout my career. There was a time in my 20's where I felt exactly the way you do. Don't sweat it…

I'm 48. More productive in the past ten years than ever before. I used to feel the way you do, in my twenties. A lot of it was just jockeying for position among a group of high-achiever friends--trying to be the alpha in a group of alphas--and some of it was having been the big fish in the small pond of my immediate peers and finally being thrown into the big pond. But none of that really matters. Don't plan for the…

>> But we all start back at 0 when we do something new. We progress faster the second and further times around.

Great comment. It alludes to 'iterating on yourself'. It's difficult when you feel like you're competing with others, rather than working to satisfy your own essential self.

Re: Ask HN: How do you deal with professional jealousy and getting older?

#188

Post by eludwig » Wed, Apr 08, 2015, 1:21 PM UTC

If you are convinced that you are doing what you want to be doing, then you need to respectfully disregard the inner voices that are impeding your ability to work in the present effectively.

In the creative world, these voices are sometimes referred to as "witches." Everyone has this. They are not always about procrastination and failing either. People can also get insane "visions of grandeur" voices too! You may have thoughts about being the greatest programmer that has ever lived or the best writer ever. That type of thing. These thoughts are the flotsam and jetsam of the creative process. Icky foam. (Okay, no more ocean metaphors)

The mistake is listening to them. They are not helpful and are just impediments to working in the present. Think of them as intrusive guests that will leave if they are ignored. Let them rise and fall without worrying too much about it. Worrying about them can start a vicious cycle that is also an impediment.

The only place that work happens is today, now. This is the same for everyone. Even the people that you admire have to work in the present.

Re: Ask HN: How do you deal with professional jealousy and getting older?

#189

Post by cozuya » Wed, Apr 08, 2015, 1:22 PM UTC

fit2rule wrote: post #75

monk_e_boy wrote: post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm 40. I had a nice open source project that went well (it's a bit dated now) ... but my regret is not having my kids younger. The work. projects, start ups and all those dreams still live on. But having kids is a lot of fun.

Yes, definitely this! If you're in your 20's and feeling like your "whole life" is wasted/lame/you're a loser .. well, have kids. It'll change your whole outlook, hopefully before you hit 30. Kids are awesome. They teach you that, at 20-something, you're not actually that experienced. You don't actually have a lot of time on the Earth. 20-something year olds - you're still kids. There's 3 or 4 more decades ahead of y…

Kids aren't for everyone. Part of self actualization is not tying the value of your self worth onto the shoulders of someone else and that includes children. Have kids for your own reasons, not because you're bored or because you think its the thing that people do.

Re: Ask HN: How do you deal with professional jealousy and getting older?

#190

Post by eranation » Wed, Apr 08, 2015, 1:27 PM UTC

As someone who's 37 all I can say is don't worry. I had a few years like that. I got a renaissance love to code and an inner motivation only at age 30 (I'm coding since I'm 20, but I was a mediocre enterprise java grunt) Only now I started my master degree, open source projects, learning tons of new languages and instead of watching tv I watch MOOCS or read technical books or write in my blog or work on one of my side projects. I get unsolicited emails from Google, Facebook, Twitter, Apple, Amazon, Linked-In (sadly no greencard yet but I also love my existing job too much to move) Bottom line, relax, when I was 26 I swore I will never code again, but things change when you grow up. I would kill to have all the free time I had when I was 26. (I am married wnd have two kids) but even at my old age, you can still be passionate about tech, still be more than relevant, and you don't have to compare yourself to anyone but yourself.