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“Today we moved into our new Facebook building”

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Re: “Today we moved into our new Facebook building”

#241

Post by correctbattery »

JohnBooty wrote: post #233
correctbattery wrote: post #211

Earlier quoted context omitted.

One reason I rent a two bedroom apartment is so that I can have an office at home.

Having some sort of dedicated home office space is soooooo key. Otherwise there's almost no boundary at all between work life and home life. It becomes hard to mentally get into "work mode" when the work day starts and it's hard to fully out of "work mode" when the work day is over. Over the years I've found that the vast majority of work-from-homers share this opinion. Almost unanimously.

You are seriously underestimating hoe awesome it is to code in bed under blankets on a cold winter day with a cup of hot chocolate beside you.

Re: “Today we moved into our new Facebook building”

#242

Post by JohnBooty »

apinstein wrote: post #192
TYPE_FASTER wrote: post #153

Earlier quoted context omitted.

YES. I was thinking the same thing. The last building I was in was converted from an old industrial space. There were noise cancelling devices in the ceiling. You couldn't hear the person sitting across the table from you.

Noise canceling? Got a link? I am aware of white noise machines but not noise-canceling. Presently building out a new office and would love to see details.

I'm not an acoustical engineer but my understanding is that noise canceling devices are usually passive - think of the oddly shaped foam panels you see in recording studios: https://www.google.com/search?q=anechoic+chamber&source=lnms...

Or, in an extreme example, the ones you see in anechoic chambers: https://www.google.com/search?q=anechoic+chamber&source=lnms...

The foam devices serve to both absorb sound energy, and to scatter the remaining sound energy at a variety of angles, where much of it will collide with other reflected sound waves and cancel out.

I needed some acoustic foam for a small project at home and found this place. They seemed pretty affordable (and had lots of colors) compared to other places, though I'm far from an expert and I was only buying ~$40 of foam so I didn't exactly spent too much time comparison shopping: http://www.foambymail.com/acoustical-foam-products.html

Re: “Today we moved into our new Facebook building”

#243

Post by TillE »

PMan74 wrote: post #117
legohead wrote: post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The key takeaway from that to me is to at least have an office. Keep it open most of the time for communication, close it when you need privacy. The whole "easier to collaborate with others" with an open floor plan is just excuse. I communicate better over text chat anyway.

> I communicate better over text chat anyway. I don't know you of course but I really doubt that text chat would ever surpass the effectiveness of face to face communication.

Text makes it much easier to share a link, refer to something in the code, etc. It's not ideal for in-depth discussions, but it can often be better for handling typical questions.

Re: “Today we moved into our new Facebook building”

#244

Post by Tiksi »

calinet6 wrote: post #140
rifung wrote: post #133

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"The introverts would prefer a quiet working space (and they're usually the best workers)" Uh what? I'm an extreme introvert but don't see any reason to believe introverts are usually the best workers. I am not even that convinced that introverts would prefer a quiet working space any more than extroverts do. After all, just because someone is extroverted doesn't mean they have an easier time concentrating in a noisy…

Extrovert here, former introvert (yeah, it's not fixed). I appreciate the defense against what is at the very least a statement of extreme arrogance by the GP. I love a quiet workspace, and I also enjoy an open office plan. There's a need for the advantages of both environments—the ease of collaboration and the focused heads-down time—which is why this is such a difficult discussion to have.

>Extrovert here, former introvert (yeah, it's not fixed).

Off topic, but how did you "convert"? Was it a conscious effort or did it just seem to happen? I ask mostly because I had a period of a few years where I felt like I leaned closer to extroversion, but now I'm pretty firmly an introvert, and I'd like to be able to push it back to the other side, but can't quite figure out how exactly to do that.

As far as office plans go, as an introvert I really don't mind working in loud, distracting environments. I've gotten blocking out the outside world down to a science, and I'm pretty hard to distract unless someone is specifically talking to me, but I've found that an office with a door doesn't really stop that anyways. My ideal office is probably some variation of what I have at my current job, half-cubicles (4 pushed together) with 1-5 other people nearby. It's isolated enough, but still lets us collaborate and see other people enough to keep the madness at bay.

Re: “Today we moved into our new Facebook building”

#245

Post by cc439 »

I believe that this whole "open office" concept is driven by the idea that an observed worker is a "productive" worker and that it's actually true to a certain extent. Sure, you may be less productive in an open office when you're actually bearing down on something but the management is assured that you're doing something work related within the boundaries of the company's cultural definition of "productive".

It's an old-school, assembly line style of thinking. An open floorplan gives the impression of vulnerability, you won't goof off on HN or reddit when you know somebody could be looking. A loss in crunchtime productivity may be worth it if the employees would otherwise spend 2 hours a day wasting time privately. The culture determines the amount of time spent socializing in plain view but the open office completely kills any attempt to spend company time on non-work activities in private.

I work outside the tech bubble but even with my limited experience, I know that the more company provided distractions (a 9 acre park, free snacks in the breakroom, etc), the less you'll be allowed to actually do anything but work.

Re: “Today we moved into our new Facebook building”

#246

Post by drewg123 »

JohnBooty wrote: post #160

I would literally switch jobs (and perhaps careers, if every company was like this) if forced to work in an open office like this. I cannot work that way; I can't focus. I realize that I'm adding nothing constructive to this thread; I don't care. Maybe some manager somewhere will see this and a hundred other anecdotal opinions and think twice about open offices. I am the opposite of a prima donna. I just want to work…

I work as a fairly senior SWE at Google, coming off 20+ years with private offices (some of that time full-time remote), and I agree with everything you said. I knew it would be hard going into the job. I actually get up at 5am so I can have a few quiet hours at my desk before the rest of the folks show up & it turns into a total zoo.

Re: “Today we moved into our new Facebook building”

#247

Post by staticfish »

apinstein wrote: post #192
TYPE_FASTER wrote: post #153

Earlier quoted context omitted.

YES. I was thinking the same thing. The last building I was in was converted from an old industrial space. There were noise cancelling devices in the ceiling. You couldn't hear the person sitting across the table from you.

Noise canceling? Got a link? I am aware of white noise machines but not noise-canceling. Presently building out a new office and would love to see details.

I'm pretty certain he means noise dampening, and you knew that.

Re: “Today we moved into our new Facebook building”

#248

Post by staticfish »

bbarn wrote: post #239

My least and most favorite topic rears it's head again. The open floor plan. Here's what I've come to think is about perfect: The open floor plan, with +-3 hour start/end time to your 8 hour work day (from say, 8:30-5), with optional hour lunch (paid or unpaid depending on policy/culture). Think about it.. there are definitely collaboration benefits to be had with the open floorplan. The contrast to that is always th…

Why should people that would like some quiet time (which is needed for all of us) have to come in at non-standard hours. That sucks.

I think the bigger issue is how we've all been duped into how the open-plan offices "work" from MBA dicks.

Re: “Today we moved into our new Facebook building”

#249

Post by qq66 »

JohnBooty wrote: post #160

I would literally switch jobs (and perhaps careers, if every company was like this) if forced to work in an open office like this. I cannot work that way; I can't focus. I realize that I'm adding nothing constructive to this thread; I don't care. Maybe some manager somewhere will see this and a hundred other anecdotal opinions and think twice about open offices. I am the opposite of a prima donna. I just want to work…

As a counterpoint, I recently moved from an open-plan office to a private office at Microsoft, and I definitely prefer the open plan. I feel more energized in an open plan, and I now make it a point to walk around the halls and drop in on people who are open to it (green status light on the door).

Re: “Today we moved into our new Facebook building”

#250

Post by PebblesHD »

woah wrote: post #157
moe wrote: post #81

a single room that fits thousands of people. What a nightmare. These "glass palace" offices may work for bankers or marketing teams. For programmers you could just as well plant their desks into the middle of a mall.

I've worked in open plan offices my entire career. I actually don't even like having the same desk every day. If I really want some isolation I work from home. No big deal. I'd rather take the extra money or other office perks over the boring cubicle you all seem to want.

The problem is that in an office such as mine, we don't get a constant work space and don't have the option of working from home. Not well thought out from a management point of view.
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