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Sabbath mode

en.wikipedia.org

131–140 of 175 posts

Re: Sabbath mode

#131

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And likewise, DE != Delaware.

Unsurprisingly there is a very large population that doesn't reside in the United States of America.

I got a US phone number via Skype, simply because so many of my American clients had no idea how to call internationally.

Similarly, for many of my US clients, I provide them with their first-ever opportunity to send a letter (i.e., my check) via international mail.

Re: Sabbath mode

#132
post #127
post #90

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I guess they do proper timezone detection?

They shouldn't need to. The issue is them accepting your order during their observance of the Sabbath. If you're in a different timezone and are still supposed to be observing the Sabbath (while the website's owners are no longer in their Sabbath window), they'll accept your order; you've violated the Sabbath, not them. (At least that'd be my interpretation based on my often-limited understanding; I'm not Jewish, so…

I'm not sure if their automatic system accepting the order is a problem. It shouldn't be (no people are involved in any of it from their side). However they serving someone who is violating Shabbos at the same time is a problem (for both them enabling the violation, and the violator). And that's timezone dependent.

See http://www.zomet.org.il/Eng/?CategoryID=199&ArticleID=53

Re: Sabbath mode

#133
post #120
post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Welcome to the world of Jewish law, in which it's considered acceptable to find ways around rules. For example: Jews aren't allowed to eat leavened food, known as "chamets," (e.g., bread) on Passover. We're also not allowed to own leavened products. What do you do with all of the food that you bought before Passover? In theory, you have to throw it out, which would be a huge waste of money. The solution is to sell th…

> Welcome to the world of Jewish law, in which it's considered acceptable to find ways around rules. Welcome to every religion. As a Catholic, I order pizza at 11:30pm on Good Friday and having probably wolfed down 2 slices by 12:01am after a day of fasting. I have Muslim friends who shift their hours around during Ramadan to sleep during more of the day.

That's a very reasonable point to make.

That said, I think the fundamental question here is whether such rule-breaking is endorsed by centuries of priests, or if it's just something people do.

In Judaism, the rabbis have codified such rule-bending for at least 2,000 years. And we have also been debating whether it's acceptable for as long. :-)_

Re: Sabbath mode

#134
post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This, by the way, is a huge problem for a German expat in IL (back in DE now) during Passover. Not only do they hide bread, there's a certain golden drink that is just as off limits in all the 'following' supermarkets and that's quite interesting. (I kid. Yes, you don't get bread and beer, in theory. Tel Aviv has lots of shops that aren't Jewish or don't care or .. so it's mostly a sight to be seen and a way to explo…

Look for gluten free beer, many are (or can be) kosher for Passover.

And that's supposed to follow the Reinheitsgebot [1]? :-)

1: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reinheitsgebot

Re: Sabbath mode

#135
post #128
post #104

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's true. But you can hire him full time.

I wonder how that would work, though. In general the accepted work week is Monday through Friday, so even if you did hire/pay the person on a weekly/yearly basis, you'd still have to specifically say to them that they're required to work on the weekend, and thus the Sabbath. I wonder if that's ok or not...

You don't need to tell them to work, just to be on-call :)

Re: Sabbath mode

#136
post #132
post #127

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They shouldn't need to. The issue is them accepting your order during their observance of the Sabbath. If you're in a different timezone and are still supposed to be observing the Sabbath (while the website's owners are no longer in their Sabbath window), they'll accept your order; you've violated the Sabbath, not them. (At least that'd be my interpretation based on my often-limited understanding; I'm not Jewish, so…

I'm not sure if their automatic system accepting the order is a problem. It shouldn't be (no people are involved in any of it from their side). However they serving someone who is violating Shabbos at the same time is a problem (for both them enabling the violation, and the violator). And that's timezone dependent. See http://www.zomet.org.il/Eng/?CategoryID=199&ArticleID=53

But it's also dependent on whether the user is Jewish or not, no? And how can the computer know that?

Re: Sabbath mode

#137
post #132

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not sure if their automatic system accepting the order is a problem. It shouldn't be (no people are involved in any of it from their side). However they serving someone who is violating Shabbos at the same time is a problem (for both them enabling the violation, and the violator). And that's timezone dependent. See http://www.zomet.org.il/Eng/?CategoryID=199&ArticleID=53

But it's also dependent on whether the user is Jewish or not, no? And how can the computer know that?

It is dependent, but it's easier to prevent all transactions in such case than trying to ask the user about it and rely on honest answer. Plus it would probably make it "moris ayin", i.e. the likelihood of violation to the observer which is a whole long subject on its own. I'm not an expert in the law however, so those who implement such systems would have to ask about it anyway.

Re: Sabbath mode

#138
post #114

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The opposite happens too. Look at where the rule against mixing milk and meat comes from. Such an enormous extrapolation from an ultra-specific line.

> Such an enormous extrapolation from an ultra-specific line. To be fair, cooking a calf in its mother's milk is pretty messed up, so going a bit overboard on that one isn't going to keep me up at night.

Well, not very. The usual agricultural practice for dairy cows is to take the calves away so that they're not consuming the mother's milk (because you want the milk; that's why you're keeping them in the first place). Female calves become more dairy cows, but male calves are pretty much useless, so you eat them.

So chances are you'll have prepared veal from the male calf at the same time as its mother is producing milk.

I've never been certain what this law was for. Most religious food practices stem from food hygiene laws; unclean animals are usually riddled with parasites, kosher and halal killing practices codify particular (safe) ways of slaughtering animals because otherwise people wouldn't do it properly --- but this one? Dunno.

Re: Sabbath mode

#139
post #133
post #120

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Welcome to the world of Jewish law, in which it's considered acceptable to find ways around rules. Welcome to every religion. As a Catholic, I order pizza at 11:30pm on Good Friday and having probably wolfed down 2 slices by 12:01am after a day of fasting. I have Muslim friends who shift their hours around during Ramadan to sleep during more of the day.

That's a very reasonable point to make. That said, I think the fundamental question here is whether such rule-breaking is endorsed by centuries of priests, or if it's just something people do. In Judaism, the rabbis have codified such rule-bending for at least 2,000 years. And we have also been debating whether it's acceptable for as long. :-)_

> rule-breaking

> rule-bending

These are different.

Re: Sabbath mode

#140
post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Welcome to the world of Jewish law, in which it's considered acceptable to find ways around rules. For example: Jews aren't allowed to eat leavened food, known as "chamets," (e.g., bread) on Passover. We're also not allowed to own leavened products. What do you do with all of the food that you bought before Passover? In theory, you have to throw it out, which would be a huge waste of money. The solution is to sell th…

This, by the way, is a huge problem for a German expat in IL (back in DE now) during Passover. Not only do they hide bread, there's a certain golden drink that is just as off limits in all the 'following' supermarkets and that's quite interesting. (I kid. Yes, you don't get bread and beer, in theory. Tel Aviv has lots of shops that aren't Jewish or don't care or .. so it's mostly a sight to be seen and a way to explo…

TLV — certainly. But TLV isn't like the rest of the country
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