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Leap: Your daily commute redesigned

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Re: Leap: Your daily commute redesigned

#61

Post by SilasX »

r00fus wrote: post #33
baddox wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> In many cases, taking the bus is only slightly faster than walking. I live in Soma, within one block of stops on several ostensibly good bus routes, but I still find that I need to be going at least 2 miles (sometimes even 3, depending on the destination) for it to be faster to bus than to walk. This obviously wouldn't be the case if any of said bus routes stuck even remotely to the stated schedule, or if traffic w…

> This obviously wouldn't be the case if any of said bus routes stuck even remotely to the stated schedule, or if traffic was at least somewhat predictable. These are symptoms of the same problem. In France (at least in Grenoble where I worked for a year) there are dedicated bus lanes (dedicated lights for those lanes). Without those, buses are subject to the same issues caused by traffic. I agree with the commenter…

San Francisco has those too, like on the Geary/O'Farrell corridor, though not on every bus route.

Re: Leap: Your daily commute redesigned

#62

Post by JimboOmega »

anishkothari wrote: post #52
asimjalis wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have used buses in SF. They are unreliable. Sometimes a bus just never shows up, regardless of what the schedule says. Then two buses show up at the same time. This has happened to me several times.

> Then two buses show up at the same time. This has happened to me several times. This is called bus bunching, here's an explanation. http://www.wbez.org/series/curious-city/why-buses-arrive-bun...

I know someone who works at Muni (and generally will answer all my random muni questions).

Bus bunching is, as that article notes, kind of inherent to the system.

And the obvious solutions (like leapfrogging) drive people crazy. Actually, a lot of Muni's problems relate to "people get really upset when you do the obvious fix". Like reducing the number of stops... good luck with that!

Re: Leap: Your daily commute redesigned

#63

Post by JimboOmega »

remarkEon wrote: post #58

California Vehicle Code, §22500: No person shall stop, park, or leave standing any vehicle whether attended or unattended, except when necessary to avoid conflict with other traffic or in compliance with the directions of a peace officer or official traffic control device, in any of the following places: [...] (i) Except as provided under Section 22500.5, alongside curb space authorized for the loading and unloading…

There was a lot of fussing and moaning over tech buses using Muni stops, but that got resolved legally (even if people aren't all happy about it).

You should bear in mind that for a lot of similar startups (e.g., Uber) there's a sort of "we'll sort the legal stuff out later" attitude that, so far, has tended to work out well for them..

Re: Leap: Your daily commute redesigned

#64

Post by pjlegato »

joshavant wrote: post #35
pjlegato wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Privately run, regularly scheduled bus services open to the public, called "jitneys," are already illegal in San Francisco.[1] Leap and similar services seem to be ignoring this law. They were banned in the 1970s as Muni's service degraded, to shield it from competition. [1] http://missionlocal.org/2014/06/up-until-the-1970s-muni-had-...

That's interesting, considering, for many years, I've seen this bus around San Francisco with 'jitney bus' literally printed on the side: http://images.nymag.com/travel/weekends/20090910sanfransisco...

That guy is the last holder of an old jitney license. The ban was enacted by not issuing any new licenses. People who already had them were allowed to keep operating.

http://www.sfgate.com/news/article/A-One-Man-Traffic-Buster-...

http://www.yelp.com/biz/jess-losa-jitney-97-san-francisco

Re: Leap: Your daily commute redesigned

#65

Post by pjlegato »

girvo wrote: post #40
pjlegato wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Assumes facts not in evidence; there is no reason to suppose that a class-based explanation is correct when the much simpler explanation of "not having to leave an hour early to work around Muni's terrible service quality" adequately explains the situation.

A class-based explanation and Muni being a terrible service "ripe for disruption" are not mutually exclusive. You can't, however, argue that a private bus service that requires a smartphone and costs 3x what regular public transport does doesn't have interesting effects on who can and can't use it.

Smartphones may have been highly class correlated in 2006, but they're not now. You can get one prepaid for around $30 at any cell phone shop. 77% of those 18-29 with an annual income under 30k own a smartphone.[1]

Atrocious public bus service impacts the poor much more than those who are better off: someone with a salaried professional job who comes in late a couple of times a week due to Muni will usually not even register on the organization at all, whereas someone making minimum wage on a time clock will likely be fired for that -- and thus strongly motivated to pay extra for a transportation mechanism that is likely to arrive on time.

[1] http://www.pewinternet.org/2013/06/05/smartphone-ownership-2...

Re: Leap: Your daily commute redesigned

#66

Post by baby »

andy318 wrote: post #17

Anyone know Leap's arragement with their drivers? Their TOS makes it seem like the Uber for buses. From Terms of service - "LEAP DOES NOT PROVIDE TRANSPORTATION SERVICES, AND LEAP IS NOT A TRANSPORTATION CARRIER. IT IS UP TO THE DRIVER OR VEHICLE OPERATOR TO OFFER TRANSPORTATION SERVICES WHICH MAY BE ARRANGED THROUGH USE OF THE SERVICES"

Isn't it a way to get out of all legal issues so they can test if their start up works? I mean they only have one small route in one city, at this point it's more a test than a real big company.

Re: Leap: Your daily commute redesigned

#67

Post by baby »

rguzman wrote: post #2

I can't shake the feeling that the existence of leap and that it seems compelling are symptoms of deeply flawed urban planning.

I think the "you can see where the bus is and how many seats are left in" is a really good way of doing public transportation.

Re: Leap: Your daily commute redesigned

#68

Post by JimboOmega »

themagician wrote: post #51
aianus wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ok, I'll bite, why on earth does a bus driver deserve $70,000 a year and a pension? There are billions of people in the world who would kill to do that job for $35,000 and no benefits.

Because we've decided as a society that paying people a decent wage is a good idea. The same can be said for a lot of jobs, including so-called "software engineers." You can pay people in Romania $300/day instead of paying someone in SF $1,800 a day.

Dang. $1,800 a day? I've been missing out.

Re: Leap: Your daily commute redesigned

#69

Post by JimboOmega »

themagician wrote: post #10
JimboOmega wrote: post #3

A privatized intracity bus service? Somewhat interesting. But how can this compete with heavily subsidized, existing public bus service - without hitting all the same pitfalls that it does? (Like buses getting steadily less "express" as time goes on)?

It competes by doing things like not complying with existing regulation, laws, or unions. It's an "app" and thus except from all regulation. So they don't pay a driver $70,000/yr and give him or her a pension. They can pick stops based on profitability, not access. They carry the bare minimum of liability insurance because if anything happens they can just close up shop. They don't have to comply with the Americans w…

I wonder if there are other, undiscovered industries that can be "1099ified" for profit. Maybe construction?

Maybe medical? Actually, I would appreciate an app that let me consult with a doctor without having to actually schedule an appointment and go to the office - just to determine simple stuff like "does this need stitches?".

Granted, that's an area I'd be a lot less tolerant of someone who isn't complying with any regulation or laws.

Re: Leap: Your daily commute redesigned

#70

Post by [deleted] »

themagician wrote: post #51
aianus wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ok, I'll bite, why on earth does a bus driver deserve $70,000 a year and a pension? There are billions of people in the world who would kill to do that job for $35,000 and no benefits.

Because we've decided as a society that paying people a decent wage is a good idea. The same can be said for a lot of jobs, including so-called "software engineers." You can pay people in Romania $300/day instead of paying someone in SF $1,800 a day.

[deleted]
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