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California Is Drilling for Water That Fell to Earth 20,000 Years Ago

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61–70 of 73 posts

Re: California Is Drilling for Water That Fell to Earth 20,000 Years Ago

#61
post #56

Reminds me of the film "Interstellar" with dust storm. And this is already happening every year in Beijing and its neighboring towns. Does this "bad" human cultural behavior push our scientific researcher further? It certainly does for the 200 yrs of technological advances.

Well desertification is a very interesting problem. But basically there is natural desertification and there is accelerated desertification caused by the growth of population (misuse of lands, overuse of farm lands, deforestation, rapid growth of population, etc). In northern part of China, the government and locals plant trees to slow down and even able to recover lands from desertification. But the progress is slow...

although South America is still full of trees, scientists are already seeing rapid desertification because we are destroying the nature.

Re: California Is Drilling for Water That Fell to Earth 20,000 Years Ago

#62
post #43
post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, because California already imports water from all over the place. Water shortage isn't a problem unique to California. It's only a matter of time before the rest of the country starts to feel the same pressure that Californians are feeling. Reducing water use now will give us time.

My water supply is provided seasonally from melting snow and rainfall. I highly doubt much of that water is trucked the thousand or so miles to California. Using this seasonally supplied water today won't mean that we have less in the future. Not unless we are hoarding it all, but our reservoirs are only so big anyway, if they were filled to the brim, and that water weren't being used, it'd just be dumped down the ov…

Alfalfa uses more California water than nuts. Maybe cut out the cheeseburgers first.

Re: California Is Drilling for Water That Fell to Earth 20,000 Years Ago

#63
post #44
post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My water supply is provided seasonally from melting snow and rainfall. I highly doubt much of that water is trucked the thousand or so miles to California. Using this seasonally supplied water today won't mean that we have less in the future. Not unless we are hoarding it all, but our reservoirs are only so big anyway, if they were filled to the brim, and that water weren't being used, it'd just be dumped down the ov…

Water is a global resource. If your water isn't exported right now doesn't mean it won't be in the future. A huge amount of the US is dependent on groundwater reservoirs. When those reservoirs run out, they'll need to import water from places that don't depend on groundwater or (more likely) move. You may be able to take long showers now, but if we as a nation (or even species) are going to get through the long term…

You are not entitled to another region's water. If you want somebody elses water, you should be prepared to pay dearly for it.

If that other region happens to be running low on water as well then that water may not be for sale. If that is the case, you should prepare to pay very dearly for it. Countries have been broken up, and wars waged, over far less.

Re: California Is Drilling for Water That Fell to Earth 20,000 Years Ago

#64
post #10
post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That is a good summary. A friend of mine is looking at putting a passive desalinator on the ocean floor off the coast of Monterey. Basically its a pipe with the permeable membrane surrounding the submerged collector. The pipe carries fresh water to the surface and as you pump out fresh water, the pressure of the ocean at depths of up to 1000 meters pushes in more water through the membranes, desalinating it in the pr…

How does the membrane stay clean of marine growth?

there is very little marine growth at 1000 meters depth. A bigger concern would be marine snow: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marine_snow

Re: California Is Drilling for Water That Fell to Earth 20,000 Years Ago

#65
post #61
post #56

Reminds me of the film "Interstellar" with dust storm. And this is already happening every year in Beijing and its neighboring towns. Does this "bad" human cultural behavior push our scientific researcher further? It certainly does for the 200 yrs of technological advances.

Well desertification is a very interesting problem. But basically there is natural desertification and there is accelerated desertification caused by the growth of population (misuse of lands, overuse of farm lands, deforestation, rapid growth of population, etc). In northern part of China, the government and locals plant trees to slow down and even able to recover lands from desertification. But the progress is slow…

Our appetite for beef is causing the destruction of forests. If we could tone down our meat consumption, we stand a chance to save tue environment.

Re: California Is Drilling for Water That Fell to Earth 20,000 Years Ago

#66
post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Water is a global resource. If your water isn't exported right now doesn't mean it won't be in the future. A huge amount of the US is dependent on groundwater reservoirs. When those reservoirs run out, they'll need to import water from places that don't depend on groundwater or (more likely) move. You may be able to take long showers now, but if we as a nation (or even species) are going to get through the long term…

I remember hearing about Germany where they were so good at conserving water, that it became a bad thing: http://www.spiegel.de/international/germany/germany-s-eco-tr... The problem was: sewage systems need excess water to work, and since Germans were so diligent about saving water...well, that was a problem. Of course, the obvious solution is just to pump some of the saved water back into the sewage system, but that…

That is no wonder, because the Germans seem to be extremist with this. We have had similar problems in Finland: my local water utility had to flush some clean water straight to the sewage system, because people started saving water and sewage lines started to clog up.

You can get around this problem partially by designing the sewage system to deal with this (handles better a larger portion of solid matter in the wastewater, includes pipelines for flushing fresh water through it).

Still, too much frugality is not a good thing. We nowadays use washing machines and dishwashers that are built to German specification.

The washing program is a compromise of water amount, temperature, duration, and mechanical wear during the wash. We now have machines where the water amount and temperature are prioritized. Thus the washing program takes a long time, and it puts a lot of mechanical wear to clothes.

This is OK for Germany, where water is somewhat scarce. You have one city pulling its water from the Rhine, purifying it, using it, and putting the managed wastewater back to the Rhine, then the next city a few kilometres downstream does the same, and then the next. The purification is an expensive process.

But we don't have that; we have a pipe from a lake that contains already-drinkable water in abundance, and it needs just a bit of cleansing of solid matters before delivering to consumer pipes, and it is better than in Germany. Then, after using this water, the wastewater needs to be managed, regardless of where the clean water came from

But now the bottom line is, we save water that we wouldn't need to save, then we flush sewage pipes with fresh water, and when I put my clothes to my Miele, I wait for two hours to wash the cotton program, and wear out the clothes too soon because the washing machine rubs and whirls them half-dry.

Re: California Is Drilling for Water That Fell to Earth 20,000 Years Ago

#67
post #9

All of this reminds me of a trip I took about 10 years ago to Palm Desert. Even then I was stunned by opulence of their water use and the utter disregard for sustainability. It's a city built in the desert that regularly reaches 100+ degrees, and yet every house had a bright green grass with sprinklers running constantly. One of the main attractions was their huge amounts of golf courses, that were of course always k…

I guess it makes sense, a third of the population is 65+, they won't be around when the consequences of their unconscionable actions really hit. Oddly enough, I live in a university town in the Midwest, in a neighborhood with quite a few elderly residents. I've noticed quite a few elderly people driving hybrid cars.

This is probably due to that elderly people tend to be more wealthy, so they can afford a more expensive car. And hybrids are often nice.

Re: California Is Drilling for Water That Fell to Earth 20,000 Years Ago

#68
post #56

Reminds me of the film "Interstellar" with dust storm. And this is already happening every year in Beijing and its neighboring towns. Does this "bad" human cultural behavior push our scientific researcher further? It certainly does for the 200 yrs of technological advances.

The dust storms are not just in Beijing and neighbouring towns; it is a geological phenomenon which has been happening on a geological time-scale, over millions of years. All of the North China Plain, home to many many millions of people, is a result of silt land blowing from the dry Asian inland - Gobi Desert - and then being washed down by the Yellow River, forming an alluvial plain.

The dust storms are not nice, but they are not really man-made, although man's actions may have worsened them a little (and now man is trying to help out a little bit, although once again, what you can do about is quite small in scale).

Re: California Is Drilling for Water That Fell to Earth 20,000 Years Ago

#69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I remember hearing about Germany where they were so good at conserving water, that it became a bad thing: http://www.spiegel.de/international/germany/germany-s-eco-tr... The problem was: sewage systems need excess water to work, and since Germans were so diligent about saving water...well, that was a problem. Of course, the obvious solution is just to pump some of the saved water back into the sewage system, but that…

That is no wonder, because the Germans seem to be extremist with this. We have had similar problems in Finland: my local water utility had to flush some clean water straight to the sewage system, because people started saving water and sewage lines started to clog up. You can get around this problem partially by designing the sewage system to deal with this (handles better a larger portion of solid matter in the wast…

You should invest in some washing bags if you haven't already. We have the same problem with our chinese washing machine.

Re: California Is Drilling for Water That Fell to Earth 20,000 Years Ago

#70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That is no wonder, because the Germans seem to be extremist with this. We have had similar problems in Finland: my local water utility had to flush some clean water straight to the sewage system, because people started saving water and sewage lines started to clog up. You can get around this problem partially by designing the sewage system to deal with this (handles better a larger portion of solid matter in the wast…

You should invest in some washing bags if you haven't already. We have the same problem with our chinese washing machine.

We have some, but they are an additional hassle and I'm not sure they help overall. Certainly good for bras and similar stuff.
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