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Best way to handle interviewer asking me out on a date after tech screen?

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Re: Best way to handle interviewer asking me out on a date after tech screen?

#121

Post by forgottenpass »

ditonal wrote: post #16

You know, I'm all about being laid back and rejecting traditional corporate culture, because you can be serious without a suit. But you still need the "be serious" part, which somehow got lost between all the ping pong tables and beer on tap. I actually think a big chunk of the industry encourages unprofessionalism, because professionals do really obnoxious things like negotiate compensation. I really hope that the t…

The problem is that sacrificing the optics of "professionalism" is a dual edged sword.

The norms of professionalism are rightly considered arbitrary, but which norms are considered "professionalism" and which are "things people don't do" is not a universal constant.

I really hope that the tech scene can hold on to the fun parts of what makes it special, while getting rid of terrible things like this.

How do we as people, teams, businesses, industries, etc decide which norms of "professionalism" are OK to break. The interviewer asking for a date is pretty obvious to almost all of us (except that interviewer apparently), but how do we navigate the more middle ground? One person's "fun part" is another person's reason to feel excluded.

Alcohol at the office Friday afternoon is traditionally unprofessional but norms in tech mean it's largely accepted here, but your post takes issue with it.

It's gonna be a little bit ugly, especially in a culture that's tightly wound about policing eachother's behaviors. OR It's going to be a slightly more agreeable set of arbitrary norms.

Re: Best way to handle interviewer asking me out on a date after tech screen?

#122

Post by beenpoor »

pyrocat wrote: post #67
jarin wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'll take the risk of being buried along with beenpoor, but I should point out that asking someone out once is not harassment. Harassment is asking them out repeatedly after being turned down (i.e. it is known to be unwelcome). Not making any excuses for what interviewer guy did at all, that was still pretty slimy.

So making sexual advances in a professional setting is A-OK, as long as you only do it once per person?

@pyrocat - You are making assumptions here that there was any quid pro quo involved. She was already rejected for the job. And then she was asked on a date. What was unethical and unprofessional was that he did it while being in a position of an interviewer.

Re: Best way to handle interviewer asking me out on a date after tech screen?

#123

Post by ddoolin »

genofon wrote: post #104
woof wrote: post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>please don't speculate Come on... >He is clearly abusing his position of power What power? He's both unprofessional and socially inept, but he holds no power over her at that stage.

> What power? He's both unprofessional and socially inept, but he holds no power over her at that stage. he can still hire her EDIT: changed citation

That is some serious speculation! There is no way you could possibly know if he has that power just from what she wrote.

Re: Best way to handle interviewer asking me out on a date after tech screen?

#124

Post by jackmaney »

300bps wrote: post #102
jackmaney wrote: post #88

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because he needs to face consequences for his behavior. He's a massive liability to his company.

Because he needs to face consequences for his behavior. Does he? Is "facing consequences" the only way for someone to learn? If I "faced consequences" for every stupid thing I've done in my life time I'd probably have spent the last 30 years in jail. Because at the age of 42, I've done a ton of dumb, inappropriate and just plain stupid things in my life. Most of the time, someone has explained to me that what I did w…

> Is "facing consequences" the only way for someone to learn?

No. Most people learn the basic lesson of not hitting job candidates up for dates (and other related ethical issues) either during orientation in their first job or--even before that--when learning about the harm caused by abuses of power.

> Repeated bad behavior, on the other hand... Of course you need to escalate at that point.

From reddit OP's description, it seems likely that the interviewer has done this sort of thing before.

Re: Best way to handle interviewer asking me out on a date after tech screen?

#125

Post by bearclough »

beeworker wrote: post #95
jackmaney wrote: post #88

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because he needs to face consequences for his behavior. He's a massive liability to his company.

What if he's a 10x engineer? He's a massive PR liability because of our insane outrage culture, but he's a very valuable asset for, you know, his actual job.

This comment leaves me queasy in the stomach.

Just because someone is good at their jobs shouldn't excuse inappropriate behavior. It lessens everyone else on the team and those seeking employment. Look at professional sports just because they're 10x ers should they get away with their transgressions. Or, because they are so good should they be held to higher standards.

Re: Best way to handle interviewer asking me out on a date after tech screen?

#126

Post by woof »

ddoolin wrote: post #93
zorpner wrote: post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Boy, you're really going out of your way to defend some guy you don't know who already admitted that what he did was wrong.

Because there's more at stake here than just "some guy who admitted he was wrong." People are jumping on this as yet another example of how horribly "male" the entire industry, how hostile it is to females, etc.

Exactly.

If this was my daughter I'd tell her that he's an socially inept idiot she should avoid. He is not the "industry" and probably not even representative of his company.

If he pulled a stunt like this at a later stage (ie. under negotiations) I'd tell her to call a lawyer!

Re: Best way to handle interviewer asking me out on a date after tech screen?

#127

Post by mikeash »

x0ra wrote: post #76
mikeash wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Real men do not abuse a position of power to pressure women into accepting a date.

Maybe he just liked her...

I like lots of women, that doesn't mean it's appropriate to ask all of them on a date.

Re: Best way to handle interviewer asking me out on a date after tech screen?

#128

Post by ddoolin »

pyrocat wrote: post #109
zak_mc_kracken wrote: post #94

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not sexual advances. It's not in a professional setting. Not saying that what he did is OK (it's not) but let's keep our facts straight.

It's making an advance for the eventual goal of sex. How is that not a sexual advance? How is an email chain between interviewee and interviewer, discussing your interview results, not a professional setting?

People go to GREAT lengths for the "eventual goal of sex" all the time without it being labeled a sexual advance, including striking up what may seem like friendly conversation even though you may never have the slightest idea that their end game was actually to screw you (among many other things). Arguably the majority of anything that people do is for the eventual goal of sex.

The e-mail "later that evening" was not discussing the interview results. It was a later email, presumably on his own.

Re: Best way to handle interviewer asking me out on a date after tech screen?

#129

Post by bearclough »

ihsw wrote: post #5

* Say no. * Forward copies of emails to the company's leadership/HR department. * Keep printed copies of the emails handy in case he decides to retaliate with lawyers. * Keep your own legal counsel on speed-dial. * Move on with your life. There's not much you can do from a legal standpoint, with regards to grievance/redress. Escalating the situation through contacting his boss/HR carries a risk, even though you have…

Lawyers are expensive something a recent graduate probably doesn't have easy access to.

Re: Best way to handle interviewer asking me out on a date after tech screen?

#130

Post by vec »

300bps wrote: post #102
jackmaney wrote: post #88

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because he needs to face consequences for his behavior. He's a massive liability to his company.

Because he needs to face consequences for his behavior. Does he? Is "facing consequences" the only way for someone to learn? If I "faced consequences" for every stupid thing I've done in my life time I'd probably have spent the last 30 years in jail. Because at the age of 42, I've done a ton of dumb, inappropriate and just plain stupid things in my life. Most of the time, someone has explained to me that what I did w…

"Face consequences" doesn't necessarily mean "get fired". In this case it may be as simple as his boss pulling him aside to explain exactly how stupid what he did was. It may mean being pulled off the interview team and replaced with someone who's better at that task.

It's worth noting that neither we nor the original interviewee know whether this is repeated bad behavior or not. It might've been a one-time slip-up, or he might be serially abusing his position. We can't know, but his boss can and probably does. Go ahead and report to the folks who are in a position to make an intelligent decision.

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