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Sexism in Tech: Don’t Ask Me Unless You’re Ready to Call Someone a Whistleblower

medium.com

11–20 of 407 posts

Re: Sexism in Tech: Don’t Ask Me Unless You’re Ready to Call Someone a Whistleblower

#11
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deviancy_amplification_spiral

You can't simply cry abuse and magically learn data structures and algorithms. You can't tweet or sue (well, suing require hard evidence) your way to gainful employment as an engineer. You also don't need social support to study programming, it's a hobby you can master regardless of what you look like. How did you manage

Thomas Sowell said (pertaining to an article on using the nuke in Japan, but he uses it to test liberal media-hype later):

Much of the self-righteous nonsense that abounds on so many subjects cannot stand up to three questions:

1. Compared to what? 2. At what cost? and 3. What are the hard facts?

Re: Sexism in Tech: Don’t Ask Me Unless You’re Ready to Call Someone a Whistleblower

#12
post #5

I'm really sad this got downvoted off the front page (this article is only one hour old with 9 points, things 3 hours old with 9 points are still on the page). It's cool if not everybody is interested in talking about this, but I feel like the entire point of this article was that making whistle-blowers harder to hear is not good for society.

I found it on the front page.

Re: Sexism in Tech: Don’t Ask Me Unless You’re Ready to Call Someone a Whistleblower

#13
post #5

I'm really sad this got downvoted off the front page (this article is only one hour old with 9 points, things 3 hours old with 9 points are still on the page). It's cool if not everybody is interested in talking about this, but I feel like the entire point of this article was that making whistle-blowers harder to hear is not good for society.

It didn't get downvoted; medium.com is in a class of websites that get mildly penalized by default pending moderator review. Not a great solution, but the alternative is reams of blogspam and fluff making the front page just because so much of it gets posted. We remove the penalty from solid articles (and typically reset the clock on them to restore a fair time window for upvotes), but it sometimes takes a while before that happens.

In the long run we intend to have the community do most of this, but finding and implementing the right mechanisms for that is a lengthy process.

Re: Sexism in Tech: Don’t Ask Me Unless You’re Ready to Call Someone a Whistleblower

#14
post #7
post #3

The title with punctuation: Sexism in Tech: Don’t Ask Me Unless You’re Ready To Call Somebody a Whistleblower I found it intersting, but there is a part I couldn't really understand. Does she define rape as an aggretion and not just grey area sex? Because as I understand it it would fall under criminal charges, not 'sexism', most of the time there would be physical/tangible proofs attached to it, and the police arres…

It's dangerous to go down the path of talking about "real rape", which is kinda where you seem to be going with this. Most rape is not "real rape" according to the rapist. Most rape is date rape; the rapist finds a target who is too intoxicated to meaningfully consent (and wouldn't consent when sober), or the rapist is in a position of power over their target (such as a manager with an employee), or they simply don't…

I honestly had a similar question in mind. The phrases "raped by a colleague — not just once, but several times over months" and "female colleagues told me later that he raped some of them, and in much the same way my attacker had raped me." got me confused. Rape is defined as "unlawful sexual intercourse", is there a movement towards broadening that definition to encompass other kinds of sexual assault? Or am I being too naive?

Re: Sexism in Tech: Don’t Ask Me Unless You’re Ready to Call Someone a Whistleblower

#15
post #5

I'm really sad this got downvoted off the front page (this article is only one hour old with 9 points, things 3 hours old with 9 points are still on the page). It's cool if not everybody is interested in talking about this, but I feel like the entire point of this article was that making whistle-blowers harder to hear is not good for society.

[deleted]

Re: Sexism in Tech: Don’t Ask Me Unless You’re Ready to Call Someone a Whistleblower

#16
post #8
post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> * nor do I feel confident that reporting rape to our existing justice system would save me from further humiliation and other professional/personal consequences while providing safety* Has there ever been any evidence that charging a person of power of any crime comes with protection from collateral professional/personal consequences ? In my personal view, getting raped is enough violence that I wouldn't prioritise…

"In my personal view, getting raped is enough violence that I wouldn't prioritise my professional or personal comfort over getting justice. I am also considering that if some place would refuse me a job because I got someone charged for a criminal offence, perhaps that's not a place I'd like to work for in the first place." This kind of language is clearly coming from a place of privilege...someone who has never expe…

[deleted]

Re: Sexism in Tech: Don’t Ask Me Unless You’re Ready to Call Someone a Whistleblower

#17
post #3

The title with punctuation: Sexism in Tech: Don’t Ask Me Unless You’re Ready To Call Somebody a Whistleblower I found it intersting, but there is a part I couldn't really understand. Does she define rape as an aggretion and not just grey area sex? Because as I understand it it would fall under criminal charges, not 'sexism', most of the time there would be physical/tangible proofs attached to it, and the police arres…

I'm sorry, could you define what you mean by "grey area sex"?

Re: Sexism in Tech: Don’t Ask Me Unless You’re Ready to Call Someone a Whistleblower

#18
post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's dangerous to go down the path of talking about "real rape", which is kinda where you seem to be going with this. Most rape is not "real rape" according to the rapist. Most rape is date rape; the rapist finds a target who is too intoxicated to meaningfully consent (and wouldn't consent when sober), or the rapist is in a position of power over their target (such as a manager with an employee), or they simply don't…

I honestly had a similar question in mind. The phrases "raped by a colleague — not just once, but several times over months" and "female colleagues told me later that he raped some of them, and in much the same way my attacker had raped me." got me confused. Rape is defined as "unlawful sexual intercourse", is there a movement towards broadening that definition to encompass other kinds of sexual assault? Or am I bein…

"is there a movement towards broadening that definition to encompass any kind of sexual assault?"

Not that I'm aware of (and I'm relatively familiar with the feminist activist community and current feminist writing). I read it to mean she was raped by a colleague, not that she was sexually assaulted by a colleague, though either would be inexcusable and should be subject to the person being fired. But, again, in a workplace that is hostile to women, dismissive of women's words, and in which the person doing the raping or sexual assaulting or harassing is in a position of power over the women being raped, assaulted, or harassed, it can go on for a long time before someone is willing to throw away their career to make a public accusation, which is exactly what this article is about and why I think it's valuable.

There are, clearly, a lot of men in our industry who have literally no idea that this stuff is happening. Zero awareness to the point their instinctive response is to deny that it is true, or to attempt to redefine the words to mean something more palatable.

So, let me be clear: You've read an article about someone's experience in the workplace as a woman, and you're first response is effectively to say, "This cannot be true."

The author of this article is not the only woman to discuss these issues or to experience this kind of behavior in the workplace, particularly in tech though it is true in many industries. As long as the response of men in this industry is to read these experiences and immediately deny the words and counter-accuse the woman of lying, exaggerating, or "being dramatic", the problems will never go away.

Re: Sexism in Tech: Don’t Ask Me Unless You’re Ready to Call Someone a Whistleblower

#19
She was raped several times over several months? What on earth?

Why isn't this being reported to the police? There is a whole department of law enforcement (funded by our money) that deals precisely with issues of violence. Just use it instead of blogging about your troubles.

Re: Sexism in Tech: Don’t Ask Me Unless You’re Ready to Call Someone a Whistleblower

#20
post #17
post #3

The title with punctuation: Sexism in Tech: Don’t Ask Me Unless You’re Ready To Call Somebody a Whistleblower I found it intersting, but there is a part I couldn't really understand. Does she define rape as an aggretion and not just grey area sex? Because as I understand it it would fall under criminal charges, not 'sexism', most of the time there would be physical/tangible proofs attached to it, and the police arres…

I'm sorry, could you define what you mean by "grey area sex"?

Hard to define, but easy to give examples for. Here's one:

Man drunk. Woman drunk. Man woman have sex.

Technically, both of them raped each other. But this is pretty far from what you'd call rape, even if it is legally considered that. This is "grey area sex".

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