This bakery will hire anyone • Hacker News Board

Re: This bakery will hire anyone

#21

Post by zf00002 » Sat, Mar 07, 2015, 8:42 PM UTC

Red_Tarsius wrote: post #6

tl;dr -> Despite my doubts, Brady makes an interesting argument for open hiring and the social duties of an employer in traditional businesses. Here's the meat of the article: > “Low-wage workers tend to have a fair amount of turnover — if you make investments in a workforce it’s very difficult to judge if they are going to stay,” Brady said. “So companies try to make as low an investment as possible — and that means…

I worked a minimum wage cashier job for a convenience store that had 3 rounds of interviews. During the 2nd interview I had to sit there while the hr manager called each of my references and verified info. I was not expecting this and one of my refs was on a family vacation in Puerto Rico. This ended up being a gigantic hassle and afterwards he told me that he wouldn't be a reference anymore.

Anyway, I couldn't believe the amount of crap I had to go through to get a minimum wage job for some extra money.

Re: This bakery will hire anyone

#22

Post by chrischen » Sat, Mar 07, 2015, 8:46 PM UTC

I think some of this applies to tech hiring as well. There's only so much accuracy a tech interview can have, yet so much weight is given to it. In the end one person who's rejected at Google may end up at Dropbox, and would all the interview hand-waving have been necessary? I'd love to see studies if more intensive interview processes actually produce better quality hires.

Re: This bakery will hire anyone

#23

Post by ryanbrunner » Sat, Mar 07, 2015, 8:49 PM UTC

jsnk wrote: post #14

jim_greco wrote: post #9

The lack of second chances we give in America to some of our most unfortunate means that even non-violent offenses can have lifelong consequences. It's shameful.

I think the cost has some influence over employers making a decision to hire an ex-con. If a store can hire someone for minimum wage without any conviction records, why would they hire someone with conviction records when they can't pay any lower than the minimum wage?

You're assuming that a conviction record is the only variable. Chances are, you're not going to have 2 applicants who are otherwise identical save for a felony conviction (the fact that one of them has a felony conviction almost guarantees there's probably a lot of other differences between them as well).

Re: This bakery will hire anyone

#24

Post by nostromo » Sat, Mar 07, 2015, 8:51 PM UTC

I think more employers would do this if firing was easier.

It's perhaps counterintuitive that making firing cheap, easy, and without large liabilities could reduce our unemployment rate substantially. We should reduce the risk of employers taking a chance on people.

Re: This bakery will hire anyone

#25

Post by Red_Tarsius » Sat, Mar 07, 2015, 8:51 PM UTC

zf00002 wrote: post #21

Red_Tarsius wrote: post #6

tl;dr -> Despite my doubts, Brady makes an interesting argument for open hiring and the social duties of an employer in traditional businesses. Here's the meat of the article: > “Low-wage workers tend to have a fair amount of turnover — if you make investments in a workforce it’s very difficult to judge if they are going to stay,” Brady said. “So companies try to make as low an investment as possible — and that means…

I worked a minimum wage cashier job for a convenience store that had 3 rounds of interviews. During the 2nd interview I had to sit there while the hr manager called each of my references and verified info. I was not expecting this and one of my refs was on a family vacation in Puerto Rico. This ended up being a gigantic hassle and afterwards he told me that he wouldn't be a reference anymore. Anyway, I couldn't belie…

Sorry you had to go through that. 3 rounds for a cashier job is crazy; it wasted the time and money of that bad manager, as well as each one of the applicants.

Country wise, multiple interviews for no-skill jobs seem an economy sinkhole.

Re: This bakery will hire anyone

#26

Post by icebraining » Sat, Mar 07, 2015, 8:52 PM UTC

cubano wrote: post #15

As someone with several drug related felonies on my record, I can do nothing but applaud the efforts of this CEO, although on a different level I wonder if any adult working a minimum wage job isn't living a very bleak existence anyway, and in fact isn't being exploited for having a brain disorder we currently call "addiction" The problem with people who let drugs seriously affect their life is that...they let drugs…

Interesting article, thanks. As a Portuguese, and having been close to someone who was addicted to heroin, I know that besides clinics, we also had houses in the countryside where there were small communities where people trying to recover could stay for a few months, with very regular visits by specialist psychologists helping them. I don't know how effective they were or if they still exist, but it seems to jive with this idea of establishing human connections.

Re: This bakery will hire anyone

#27

Post by addicted44 » Sat, Mar 07, 2015, 8:52 PM UTC

Geekette wrote: post #12

Interesting, quote that stood out:"Someone without an arrest may simply be a person who has never gotten caught". That only 40% of business owners would consider hiring a ex-criminal also makes one wonder how many employers in general tend to lump all ex-cons in the same basket when assessing potential business risk (e.g. serial murderer vs thief/drug dealer, 1x vs multiple offender, etc).

And keep in mind that 40% SAY they will hire. As seen in polls about racism (even anonymous polls) the actual number is probably a lot lower.

Re: This bakery will hire anyone

#28

Post by unethical_ban » Sat, Mar 07, 2015, 8:54 PM UTC

jsnk wrote: post #14

jim_greco wrote: post #9

The lack of second chances we give in America to some of our most unfortunate means that even non-violent offenses can have lifelong consequences. It's shameful.

I think the cost has some influence over employers making a decision to hire an ex-con. If a store can hire someone for minimum wage without any conviction records, why would they hire someone with conviction records when they can't pay any lower than the minimum wage?

You're assuming that someone with a conviction is worse than someone without. One point in the article is that you don't know! The person who has no conviction might not have been caught.

Look at the sociopaths and murderers who sometimes have millions or billions, and are in control of thousands of jobs. They're just smarter about getting away with things.

Furthermore, you suggest that if only we didn't have those strangling minimum wage laws, businesses would hire convicts for less than minimum wage. But sticking ex-cons into wage slavery is exactly the opposite of what the business described wants! They want to maximize their positive impact on their community, not just get out the most from their employees for the least investment.

Re: This bakery will hire anyone

#29

Post by gadders » Sat, Mar 07, 2015, 8:54 PM UTC

Stratoscope wrote: post #20

cubano wrote: post #15

As someone with several drug related felonies on my record, I can do nothing but applaud the efforts of this CEO, although on a different level I wonder if any adult working a minimum wage job isn't living a very bleak existence anyway, and in fact isn't being exploited for having a brain disorder we currently call "addiction" The problem with people who let drugs seriously affect their life is that...they let drugs…

Thank you both for the courage to post this, and for the link to Johann Hari's article. It is a real eye-opener. (If anyone is tempted to skip it because of the HuffPo link, take my word for it, this is well worth reading.)

Don't skip it because it's HuffPo, skip it because it's Johann Hari. He's a plagiarist and a cyber stalker.

http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Johann_Hari

Re: This bakery will hire anyone

#30

Post by addicted44 » Sat, Mar 07, 2015, 8:55 PM UTC

rayiner wrote: post #11

jMyles wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why do felons and addicts belong on the same list?

Why do felons belong on a list?

It's a list of groups of people who are traditionally ignored by most companies, but are hired by this one. If Harvard grads were traditionally unemployable, but employed by this bakery, they would also be on the list along with felons, immigrants and addicts.