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Ask HN: Anxiety is limiting my enjoyment of a wonderful career. Can you relate?

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Re: Ask HN: Anxiety is limiting my enjoyment of a wonderful career. Can you relate?

#61
I don't usually have enough knowledge on most of the subjects on Hacker News to make a useful comment, but I can absolutely relate to your situation.

I'm a freelance developer with two steady retainers, I have a wonderful partner, and I play in an up-and-coming rock band; I'm doing very well, from an outside perspective. However, for the past few months, I was unable to refill my antidepressant prescription during my transition to CoveredCA (or, at least wasn't sure how to do so, derp), which led me back into a pretty bad case of my depression, anxiety, and obsessive/compulsive behavior.

When I don't take my medication, I can hardly think straight for more than a few minutes at a time before I'm thrust into a really mentally exhausting power cycle of automatic negative thoughts, which usually results in intense physical discomfort and a generally unpleasant demeanor. I get rude and withdrawn, and often binge on comfort foods and mind-numbing television to deal with the fact that I feel absolutely no pleasure in life.

Fortunately, I figured out my medication situation and I'm feeling a lot better. A little embarrassed about some of the work that I produced during that time, but that's life!

I've found that in addition to medication, CONSISTENT exercise and diet and >7 hours of sleep are necessities for me, and if you aren't doing those before the medication, you should give it a try to see if it's enough for you to function well. It's really hard to do this when you don't have a regular routine, as I've come to discover, but you just sort of have to start forcing yourself to be on a schedule of some sort, or plan for when your schedule is going to be somewhat erratic.

Also, seeing a therapist is super beneficial, and I frankly think most people would benefit from seeing one. It really helps you to realize that your "crazies" aren't that crazy, and it's okay to have irrational thoughts and acknowledge them.

Re: Ask HN: Anxiety is limiting my enjoyment of a wonderful career. Can you relate?

#62
One thing I notice is that I can be basically ok one day, and the next day I suddenly have been feeling terrible all week. I have a pretty selective memory about how I felt yesterday--if today is bad, I feel like yesterday was too, even if it wasn't. When I think about that deliberately and carefully, I can sometimes tell whether the correct response is to hang on another day or hour until I feel better, or try to modify my situation.

You might also consider 'firing yourself' for a couple minutes a day. Just take a couple minutes and imagine that you've lost your job. Even walk out of the building. Nothing in there is your responsibility anymore. Observe how that makes you feel. See if you can use those feelings to identify your next move--my suspicion is that you won't actually want to quit, but you could very well discover one particular responsibility or situation that is causing a disproportionate amount of your stress.

Finally, it's ok when you feel paralyzed and can't do anything to make your situation better. Try not to beat yourself up more; instead, just notice everything you can about the situation and your feelings. There will be another time when you feel like you can do something, and the observations you make will guide you then.

Re: Ask HN: Anxiety is limiting my enjoyment of a wonderful career. Can you relate?

#63
post #45
post #21

Used to be anxious, now I'm not. This stuff may or may not apply to you. Take it as one anecdotal experience. First, are these in line?: * Sleep * Diet * Exercise * Meditation/relaxation time Whenever I feel anxious now, I notice I've let one or more of those slide. Anxiety resolves when I fix them. Second, I used to be anxious for the following reasons: * I was socially awkward with few friends. * I was bad at readi…

I know this is a bit off topic and a touch on the personal side(feel free to not answer) but I am curious how you taught yourself to read body language? Did you use books or trial and error, or??

The first step was learning to make eye contact. If you're not looking at people, you're not even getting the chance to read them. I just didn't look much at people for the first 21-22 years of my life.

I remember reading a bunch of articles about "how to make eye contact". I was on sites aimed at people with aspergers, as they're a niche most likely to actually need that kind of advice.

Then you practice. And occasionally get feedback from people. Everything will be awkward as first, but do something long enough and it becomes a habit. The feedback is important, so your new habit is actually a good one.

Then I read some books on body language, and I got this DVD by Paul Ekman about microexpressions. I've since read some stuff suggesting that may be bunk, but the DVD was still valuable because it showed me what a bunch of different expressions represented, and gave me feedback if I was correctly classifying them. (There's a big book of facial expression coding that lists expressions standard across cultures: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Facial_Action_Coding_System)

Then I combined the two. Talking to people, looking at them, and noticing their expressions. A bit one was looking for laugh lines by eyes. If someone is genuinely amused, their eyes will smile in a way that they won't if they're just mouthing a smile.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Smile#Duchenne_smile

After that, it was just practice. Talk with people, pay attention, see if the results match what you thought. (For instance, if you thought someone enjoyed themselves, and then they want to hang out again, then you were probably right)

Over time, by paying attention, and using feedback to assess my judgments, I was able to build an intuition for reading people, one that I believe is quite accurate. People often are surprised that I know what they're thinking or when they're upset by something.

Most of the small annoyances of life melted away. A lot of interpersonal grief just evaporates if you can read the people you're dealing with, and respond appropriately. For instance, I have zero complaints about store personnel, in person. They're all wonderful! Over the phone, I can't see them, and stuff can still get frustrating.

It turns out that people usually aren't jerks. We just react in predictable ways to other people. So if you do something irritating, or ignore someone's discomfort, they'll get irritable. And then you'll get irritable.

But if you can spot the small signs, you can make adjustments, and everything goes smoothly. (To be clear, I'm talking about smoothing minor friction, not being a doormat. But minor frictions cause 80% of social grief!)

So:

  1. Theory
  2. Trial and error
  3. Feedback
  4. Revision, repeat #2

Re: Ask HN: Anxiety is limiting my enjoyment of a wonderful career. Can you relate?

#64

I know you said you're not seeking a therapeutic recommendation, but if you were my friend then I would buy you a beer and gently recommend seeing a therapist. I saw one for a year after I got divorced, and she was extremely helpful in teaching me how to get out of negative-feedback thought loops, which sounds like it might be useful for you, too. I was originally nervous about signing up for a lifetime of having som…

I do appreciate the suggestion, and I wholeheartedly agree that therapy can be a powerful tool. As can medication! I've had mixed success with both. I wanted to take that off the table for this particular discussion, as a thread filled with "seek professional help" didn't seem like it'd be a useful one for the community (or for me).

I disagree that it's not useful to the community. Seeing a lot of people recommend therapy, and a lot of people admit to getting it, can help remove the stigma and convince people to finally get help.

Re: Ask HN: Anxiety is limiting my enjoyment of a wonderful career. Can you relate?

#66
post #21

Used to be anxious, now I'm not. This stuff may or may not apply to you. Take it as one anecdotal experience. First, are these in line?: * Sleep * Diet * Exercise * Meditation/relaxation time Whenever I feel anxious now, I notice I've let one or more of those slide. Anxiety resolves when I fix them. Second, I used to be anxious for the following reasons: * I was socially awkward with few friends. * I was bad at readi…

"* I was bad at reading body language." This was such a huge issue for me. Being so observant, it's easy to judge someone based on body language and tone. Yes we can gain valuable information from this observation but we should not assume those observations are correct. I find it very easy to assume my assumptions are correct and this often creates situations where there are none. Thanks for sharing.

Just curious, you mean you observe a lot of stuff, but judge it wrongly?

That's interesting. I wrote about my learning process in a comment on this thread. I always looked for real world feedback to assess my judgments, and over time was able to train my intuition to be more accurate.

Re: Ask HN: Anxiety is limiting my enjoyment of a wonderful career. Can you relate?

#67
I've been (still am to a degree) in a very similar position. I also self-diagnosed myself with generalized anxiety.

I've starting working at a job about a year ago, a job that theoretically would be very close to what I would be doing in my spare time. And yet, I have the same problem, something is inhibiting my ability to focus, concentrate on problem solving, to provide solutions, and I'm fairly sure that thing is anxiety. I constantly feel very tired.

I don't really know what I could do, I've noticed that the problem tends to fade after exercising thoroughly (century mountain-bike ride or similar endeavors), but I'm still struggling with it on a day-to-day basis, and constantly think of quitting.

It certainly doesn't help that I'm also attending CS university, which doesn't leave me with enough time to fix my problems.

So you're definitely not alone in this.

Re: Ask HN: Anxiety is limiting my enjoyment of a wonderful career. Can you relate?

#68

I am diagnosed with Pure-O OCD and can relate to the constant fear. It's terrible and difficult to explain to someone. It sucks and sometimes I had to go home from work because the ruminating overwhelmed. I've had coworkers notice that I seem very distracted and take it personally until I tell them what's going on. The fears ranged from being an imposter to various other health concerns that weren't related to work i…

I also have a Pure-O diagnosis, and I totally know what you mean by having a hard time explaining it - it's such a painful conundrum. Glad that you're doing CBT - being able to catch those obsessions and let them dissipate by acknowledging them is super key to getting through it.

Glad you're seeing improvement!

Re: Ask HN: Anxiety is limiting my enjoyment of a wonderful career. Can you relate?

#69
I used to have this anxiety sometimes too but there's a few things that help me deal with it:

* Remember that other people have these same feelings. You're not alone and it's normal.

* Anyone who would think badly of you just for not knowing one simple thing is an asshole and was just looking for an excuse to be a dick. The problem is with them, not you.

* Nobody can know everything. Even the person you most admire and respect professionally has areas where you know more than them.

* Work hard, strive to improve your knowledge and skill set. This is all anyone can do.

Re: Ask HN: Anxiety is limiting my enjoyment of a wonderful career. Can you relate?

#70
post #40

I am in the same position. I am CTO of a startup in London. On paper, everything is wonderful. These past few months the company has quadrupled in size. We're in swanky offices. My commute is short - from the apartment that I own with my girlfriend who I love. Anxiety is a constant demon hanging over me. I fell it every day. Not only that but feelings of deep self-loathing. Sometimes it paralyses me. I can't work for…

Are you getting enough sleep and exercise? Meditation? The brain is a muscle like any other.

Plenty. I am on a tight sleep schedule, I sleep well mostly. I run 80-100 km a week. I don't meditate. I tried Headspace for a week, but it didn't do much for me.
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