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Google seems to have broken email forwarding

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Re: Google seems to have broken email forwarding

#141

Post by linkregister »

wpietri wrote: post #37
jmount wrote: post #5

Obviously good email (deep in a conversation) being declared "spam" has been a problem with my business for some time also. I figure Google takes all email in a 2 step process (either intentional or accidental) 1: get a good fraction of the world on GMail 2: intermittently declare any non GMail mail spam ( greatly lowering the utility of non GMail). This isn't about any mass mailings or even mailing lists. This is ab…

I've run my own mail server since before Google (yes, there was a time...), and I'm having similar problems. Right now I'm in the middle of a job hunt, and email from me (even to people who have already emailed me) is ending up in spam folders. It is infuriating. It is also apparently unfixable. Regular people cannot inquire as to why mail is not getting through. And amazingly, even having friends at Google does me n…

I know this may sound extortionist, but one solution is to use an email-as-a-service, like Mailgun, Sendgrid, or Mandrill. All of these services offer the first few thousand emails free. They perform spam filtering on outgoing mail so they are trusted by Email Service Providers (ESPs).

(Full disclosure: I'm an employee of Mailgun)

Re: Google seems to have broken email forwarding

#142

Post by [deleted] »

wpietri wrote: post #37
jmount wrote: post #5

Obviously good email (deep in a conversation) being declared "spam" has been a problem with my business for some time also. I figure Google takes all email in a 2 step process (either intentional or accidental) 1: get a good fraction of the world on GMail 2: intermittently declare any non GMail mail spam ( greatly lowering the utility of non GMail). This isn't about any mass mailings or even mailing lists. This is ab…

I've run my own mail server since before Google (yes, there was a time...), and I'm having similar problems. Right now I'm in the middle of a job hunt, and email from me (even to people who have already emailed me) is ending up in spam folders. It is infuriating. It is also apparently unfixable. Regular people cannot inquire as to why mail is not getting through. And amazingly, even having friends at Google does me n…

[deleted]

Re: Google seems to have broken email forwarding

#143

Post by linkregister »

linkregister wrote: post #141
wpietri wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've run my own mail server since before Google (yes, there was a time...), and I'm having similar problems. Right now I'm in the middle of a job hunt, and email from me (even to people who have already emailed me) is ending up in spam folders. It is infuriating. It is also apparently unfixable. Regular people cannot inquire as to why mail is not getting through. And amazingly, even having friends at Google does me n…

I know this may sound extortionist, but one solution is to use an email-as-a-service, like Mailgun, Sendgrid, or Mandrill. All of these services offer the first few thousand emails free. They perform spam filtering on outgoing mail so they are trusted by Email Service Providers (ESPs). (Full disclosure: I'm an employee of Mailgun)

Ideally, we'd all be able to send and receive email on our own servers, but due to the fact that the vast majority of email traffic is indeed spam, it is an unfortunate reality that the big ESPs have to be extra-cautious about it. Additionally, they need to make the decision whether email is spam or not instantaneously, so mining customers' previous emails is not an option without dramatically increasing the size of their infrastructure for this task.

It is possible to send email from your own server; you need to follow onerous industry-standard practices, like using a dedicated, known IP that has a certain amount of increasing email volume, known as "IP warming". After a few months of constant interaction with an ESP, your sender score improves. Unless you're sending massive amounts of email, the cost-benefit ratio isn't in your favor to use this method.

Re: Google seems to have broken email forwarding

#144

Post by larrymcp »

TeMPOraL wrote: post #135
microtonal wrote: post #131

Earlier quoted context omitted.

it's hard to me to recommend anything other than GMail to people There are other companies that offer e-mail services, without the embrace, expand, and extinguish strategy that Google seems to follow these days.

I haven't checked the new Outlook recently; maybe it's good. But all others that I know offer subpar service and honestly, look like crap. UX is important. For example, I cringe whenever someone makes me to use Roundcube-based webmail.

Yeah Roundcube's look definitely needs some help. Last year I did choose Roundcube for our webmail, but I spent several days altering its appearance so that it would look semi-professional.

I started with their new theme called "Larry" and then corrected the fonts, colors, graphics, and certain element sizing decisions.

Re: Google seems to have broken email forwarding

#146

Post by fifthesteight »

jmount wrote: post #11
jmount wrote: post #5

Obviously good email (deep in a conversation) being declared "spam" has been a problem with my business for some time also. I figure Google takes all email in a 2 step process (either intentional or accidental) 1: get a good fraction of the world on GMail 2: intermittently declare any non GMail mail spam ( greatly lowering the utility of non GMail). This isn't about any mass mailings or even mailing lists. This is ab…

Already downvoted below zero (about 2 seconds). I'll stand by what I said/implied: it is hard to co-exist with Google systems (and apparently also with pro-Google shills/apologists). I know this post violates HN standards, but I didn't think the parent did.

I've found that this community is beyond unwelcoming, bordering on toxic. I no longer see the merit in contributing, and furthermore I find that reading these comment threads has become less and less valuable.

Re: Google seems to have broken email forwarding

#147

Post by shiggerino »

clogston wrote: post #129
shiggerino wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It would also be nice if you could disable spam filtering entirely and run your own client-side.

> It would also be nice if you could disable spam filtering entirely and run your own client-side. It's horribly convoluted but it /is/ possible to do so: http://webapps.stackexchange.com/questions/69442/how-to-disa... I've been running it this way for about 18 months now after having a few important emails get gobbled up by their spam filter.

It's as if they intentionally want to force their filter on you. Not that there's anything wrong with a server-side spam filter. One that puts a polite X-Spam-Score header so you can adjust the sensitivity client-side.

Re: Google seems to have broken email forwarding

#148

Post by npsimons »

marcosdumay wrote: post #113
npsimons wrote: post #93

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Don't do this. Seriously, don't. It's one thing if you never asked to get additional emails or you can't opt out, but if you signed up for it, at least put in the same amount of effort to get out of it first. If that fails, sure, then start marking as spam. Otherwise, you're feeding false positives into the system, thereby degrading it on purpose.

Most Amazon email is spam. They send tons of promotional email to everybody that buys something there, with not even an opt-out option, and after you receive the emails, go to the opt-out link and uncheck it, they create new categories with you signed in by default. The GP is correct in marking amazon emails as spam, and I'll ask anybody that's considering stopping to keep marking it. That said, this is no excuse for…

I call bullshit. I'm a very regular Amazon customer, and I never ever receive anything but order and shipping confirmations from them (and the occasional interview offer). Can't remember if I did anything special (like uncheck a few boxes), but I'm very sure it's possible to not be spammed by them as my inbox is proof.

Re: Google seems to have broken email forwarding

#149

Post by johnduhart »

thaumasiotes wrote: post #136
nitrogen wrote: post #132

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Emails in response to you direct action (placing an order) are the very definition of solicited email.

No, emails that you ask to receive are the definition of solicited email. When was the last time the grocery store emailed you confirming that you'd just paid for your groceries?

> When was the last time the grocery store emailed you confirming that you'd just paid for your groceries?

Never because my grocery store isn't a website.

Re: Google seems to have broken email forwarding

#150

Post by npsimons »

throwawayaway wrote: post #121
npsimons wrote: post #93

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Don't do this. Seriously, don't. It's one thing if you never asked to get additional emails or you can't opt out, but if you signed up for it, at least put in the same amount of effort to get out of it first. If that fails, sure, then start marking as spam. Otherwise, you're feeding false positives into the system, thereby degrading it on purpose.

it should be opt in instead of opt out then shouldn't it? maybe you should be directing your passion at those who feel opt out is appropriate.

And that's why I said: "but if you signed up for it, at least put in the same amount of effort to get out of it first."

If you signed up, then you opted in. Don't be lazy and mark things you signed up for as spam. I'm not understanding how people get email from Amazon that aren't customers, and how customers can't turn off everything but confirmations, which I know is possible, because I have.

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