My Girlfriend Dissociated and Forgot Who I Was • Hacker News Board

Re: My Girlfriend Dissociated and Forgot Who I Was

#161

Post by JimmyM » Thu, Mar 05, 2015, 11:21 AM UTC

MrJagil wrote: post #42

vinbreau wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Agreed. I've lost three friends over the years to schizophrenia. I knew them all well before, during and after. Their minds are simply broken, their reality is not the same as ours. One believed he was a ninja protecting the world, another saw himself as the hero of a WWIII future, the third wanted to bind his spirit with alligators to grow his spiritual totem. DID sounds very, very different.

How so? Genuinely trying to understand, as DID was formerly characterized as multiple personality disorder, and the way you describe your friends seem like it would fit (i.e. a dissolved idea of identity). I know 3-4 people with schizophrenia, and none of them displayed the kind of wild delusions you're describing (though I am not discounting them! Don't get me wrong). In my experience schizophrenia manifests itself…

There are different forms of schizophrenia, such as paranoid schizophrenia, catatonic schizophrenia and hebephrenic schizophrenia, in which some or most of the symptoms associated with schizophrenia are not present.

Paranoid schizophrenia is most well-known, and is associated with delusions (such as GP comment outlined).

Schizophrenia in general is associated with severe anxiety and depression, explaining your friends' experiences.

Note that I'm not even close to the remotest possible thing to a doctor, and have no special insight - most of my 'knowledge' about schizophrenia should be treated with caution at best.

Re: My Girlfriend Dissociated and Forgot Who I Was

#162

Post by hga » Thu, Mar 05, 2015, 11:53 AM UTC

mirimir wrote: post #154

That is an incredibly moving story, and it's wonderful how well it turned out. But the author acted irresponsibly. As soon as he realized that his friend was dissociating, in the taxi, he should have called 911/999/whatever and informed the driver of the situation. If this had been a stroke or heart attack, that would have been the obvious move. Why not for dissociation?

The girlfriend gave him very specific instructions about what to do if/when it happened, and reinforced them just before it happened with "Promise me that whatever happens, you will not let go".

I cannot imagine any scenario in which involving the authorities would have improved the situation and not violated her instructions, which he implicitly if not explicitly had agreed to follow. Most specifically "not let go", and getting her back to familiar surroundings, which per the account and others' accounts is important in stabilizing these events when they go that far.

Re: My Girlfriend Dissociated and Forgot Who I Was

#163

Post by baby » Thu, Mar 05, 2015, 12:35 PM UTC

Squarel wrote: post #145

baby wrote: post #90

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think you are mixing MDMA and LSD here.

Definitely not. Unless the usual method of taking LSD is via pill form. But I hear MDMA does not induce hours of hallucinations either, so perhaps LSD does come in pill form with logos on it.

LSD or MDMA are not pills. LSD is a liquid, usually poured on a piece of paper/stamp, and MDMA is a crystal, usually broken into a powder.

Re: My Girlfriend Dissociated and Forgot Who I Was

#164

Post by halfcat » Thu, Mar 05, 2015, 12:46 PM UTC

m_mueller wrote: post #107

mst wrote: post #21

You ... get used to it. Familiarity, is, as mentioned, the key - narrating the location and why it should be familiar and when they moved there and ways they can prove it's theirs (e.g. keys fitting the front door) tend to help quite a bit. A dissociated mind still wants to believe it should be where it is and that that makes complete sense, it just doesn't have the data available. Eventually, with luck, you can get…

Wouldn't something like polaroids be a good strategy, you know, like in Memento? When she forgets everything, have her grab photos from her bag, one together with every person she trusts, one of her in front of her building, one of her in front of a street sign for her neighbourhood. Also, a pocket mirror if she really forgets who or even what she is.

Imagine if today, someone walked up to you and started telling you who you really were. They even have pictures to prove what they are saying is true. You have no memory of any of it. Are you going to believe them?

My wife has these episodes. Evidence-based and logic-based approaches are very ineffective. If I can convince her to go for a ride in the car, and we drive around the city she has lived in her entire life, and drive by the house she grew up in, schools she went to, and get some food from a drive through she's been to hundreds of times, it will reduce her time-to-return by 24-48 hours usually. We can look through several thick photo albums, and at the end she just shrugs and says, "I don't know who any of these people are".

Re: My Girlfriend Dissociated and Forgot Who I Was

#165

Post by lisnake » Thu, Mar 05, 2015, 12:46 PM UTC

fsiefken wrote: post #103

When I was experimenting with polyphasic sleep there was a moment of around 30 seconds while waking up where I was conscious and aware but not knowing who I was or where I was until I figured out I was lying in the gras instead of standing somewhere. Them I wondered how I'd gotten there and my memories returned.

I used to experience same things after I lose consciousness (happened a lot when I was a teenager). I remember one case, when upon gaining consciousness I was pondering for a whole minute what kind of strange metal columns I see on a horizon. After what felt like a mountain of memories falling onto me, I realized that I'm lying on a floor of a lecture hall, and these columns are just chair legs.

Re: My Girlfriend Dissociated and Forgot Who I Was

#166

Post by halfcat » Thu, Mar 05, 2015, 12:57 PM UTC

pavel_lishin wrote: post #73

> She'd wake up with no memory of what had happened, and wouldn't want to know. This was probably the most painful part of that whole story. Naturally, I was thinking of my wife and myself as the main characters throughout the whole story, and while it would be incredibly difficult to go through this, it would be harder if she woke up the next morning and didn't want to acknowledge or know about what had happened the…

>while it would be incredibly difficult to go through this, it would be harder if she woke up the next morning and didn't want to acknowledge or know about what had happened the night before

It's not that bad. Once you go through the exercise a few times, you have strategies that work, and it's about on par with having a sick child, where you might be slightly frustrated that you have to take a day off of work or make other arrangements, but you know the steps to take and get on with the day.

Re: My Girlfriend Dissociated and Forgot Who I Was

#167

Post by hessenwolf » Thu, Mar 05, 2015, 1:07 PM UTC

lizard wrote: post #126

MrJagil wrote: post #14

I was curious with the difference between schizophrenia and DID, since most mental illnesses overlap tremendously. If anyone has a better source, you're welcome to elaborate: "Schizophrenia and dissociative identity disorder are often confused, but they are very different. Schizophrenia is a severe mental illness involving chronic (or recurrent) psychosis, characterized mainly by hearing or seeing things that aren't…

You might think of it like this: DID: Alice is talking to Bob. At some point in the conversation Bob "dissociates" and is replaced by Charlie. Charlie is in the exact same place as Bob and sees all the things Bob was seeing, but Charlie wasn't here before so no idea where here is, how he got there, or who is talking to him. Alice doesn't know anything's wrong at first but Bob (now Charlie) seems uncomfortable and doe…

Ah. Good explanation.

So that's why my ex didn't remember things. I read about it, but I could never quite put my finger on what the dissociation stuff was.

Re: My Girlfriend Dissociated and Forgot Who I Was

#168

Post by halfcat » Thu, Mar 05, 2015, 1:11 PM UTC

mst wrote: post #21

You ... get used to it. Familiarity, is, as mentioned, the key - narrating the location and why it should be familiar and when they moved there and ways they can prove it's theirs (e.g. keys fitting the front door) tend to help quite a bit. A dissociated mind still wants to believe it should be where it is and that that makes complete sense, it just doesn't have the data available. Eventually, with luck, you can get…

This is how it usually goes with my wife:

Wife: (looking at me suspiciously)

Me: "Are you confused?"

Wife: (nods yes)

Me: "Do you know who I am?"

Wife: (shakes head no)

Me: "I am your husband"

Wife: (looks at me, wide-eyed, more suspicious)

Me: "Do you have a headache?"

Wife: "Yes..."

Me: "It's going to be okay. This happens when you get bad headaches. I can give you some medicine. Once your headache gets better you will remember everything"

At that point she will usually trust me and the situation becomes much more manageable. In her case, she suffered abuse as a child, and her absentee incidents are always associated with bad migraines. Once we break the migraine, she improves quickly.

Re: My Girlfriend Dissociated and Forgot Who I Was

#169

Post by lukeasrodgers » Thu, Mar 05, 2015, 1:24 PM UTC

mapt wrote: post #80

sjtrny wrote: post #45

Does anyone have an explanation for why she can tell a dissociatve episode is about to happen? It strikes me as really odd.

Because there is a self-aware, behavioral component to not just dissociative events, but to most maladaptive psychiatric disorders. This component may be small or large - the fact that we've medicalized the disorder simply says that the overall pattern of behavior is causing severe problems, nothing about cause or self-awareness. The people afflicted with them are not simply normal people who are possessed by a rando…

Your argument reminds me a bit of Thomas Szasz's book, The Myth of Mental Illness, which you might be interested in (if you haven't already read it). I don't 100% agree with his overall thesis, and I think your stance may actually be a bit more nuanced than his, but it's an interesting read.

Re: My Girlfriend Dissociated and Forgot Who I Was

#170

Post by DanBC » Thu, Mar 05, 2015, 1:32 PM UTC

mapt wrote: post #80

sjtrny wrote: post #45

Does anyone have an explanation for why she can tell a dissociatve episode is about to happen? It strikes me as really odd.

Because there is a self-aware, behavioral component to not just dissociative events, but to most maladaptive psychiatric disorders. This component may be small or large - the fact that we've medicalized the disorder simply says that the overall pattern of behavior is causing severe problems, nothing about cause or self-awareness. The people afflicted with them are not simply normal people who are possessed by a rando…

(I agree with your long and nuanced post.)

> it was surely at least somewhat effective, because of this voluntary component

No, it was a cruel and inhumane way to treat people. Personality Disorder used to be a diagnosis of exclusion in England - people with PD would be turned away by mental health services because they were seen as untreatable. That left them at the mercy of criminal justice systems.

We don't think Mental Health hospitals are the place for people with PDs. It's clear that prisons are even worse.

Here's just one example, but there are hundreds, thousands, of others. And this is England where we have free mental health care.

http://www.theguardian.com/society/2008/feb/03/prisonsandpro...

For anyone interested in the treatment of personality disorder: The current NICE guidelines are a bit old and are currently being re-worked. "Meeting the Challenge, Making a Difference" is an excellent short document detailing what PD is, how it affects people, what best current practice for treatment should be, and a list of recommended psychological therapies.

http://repository.tavistockandportman.ac.uk/864/

http://www.emergenceplus.org.uk/news-from-emergence/507-meet...