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Neurons Gone Wild

meltingasphalt.com

21–30 of 41 posts

Re: Neurons Gone Wild

#21
post #5
post #2

Couldn't help but think of this (apocryphal apparently, huh?) story: One night at Cheers, Cliff Clavin explained the "Buffalo theory" to his buddy Norm: "Well ya see, Norm, it's like this. A herd of buffalo can only move as fast as the slowest buffalo. And when the herd is hunted, it is the slowest and weakest ones at the back that are killed first. This natural selection is good for the herd as a whole, because the…

That is a rationalization for drinking beer. I'm not against alcohol, but I am against people deceiving themselves about its effects. Alcohol will make you less, not more intelligent.

In defense of your comment, a lot of younger alcoholics think it is funny because they want it to be true.

Re: Neurons Gone Wild

#22
I read this article hoping for some neuroscience but just got a few buzzwords and a lot of argument by analogy. This is not reductionism or science. It's just another artificial conceptual framework built on top of pop evolutionary psychology.

Re: Neurons Gone Wild

#23

I read this article hoping for some neuroscience but just got a few buzzwords and a lot of argument by analogy. This is not reductionism or science. It's just another artificial conceptual framework built on top of pop evolutionary psychology.

It does not purport to be science; not really. It's supposition. That is not a knock against it.

The existence and nature of consciousness, and its relationship to the computing and (perhaps) learning systems we now build, is a big open question, and the single biggest gaping hole in our knowledge about the world. It seems likely that filling that gap will require conceptual frameworks for thinking about consciousness far outside of the ones we've had up to this point -- they have failed for thousands of years.

The goal of the article is not to present fact put to provide a tentative exploration of the space of possible explanations of something we simply do not understand at all.

Re: Neurons Gone Wild

#24
A fascinating piece, even if I don't hold the author's materialistic views.

Regarding exorcisms, one aspect that is not addressed is sometimes external manifestations of demonic activity/presence not explainable (or seemingly not explainable) by biochemical processes.

Now, one can dismiss such claims out of hand if one considers a priori that such occurrences are impossible (i.e. that the super-natural does not exist), and so are necessarily explainable as deceptions, misperceptions, or yet-to-be understood natural phenomena. That's fine, but then care should be taken that one does not vacillate between that position and claiming that no one has ever shown any evidence of supernatural phenomena. Anyway, the latter point is a bit of a nit, but I've seen armchair skeptics make the mistake often enough that it bears pointing out.

In my own life, I have on several occasions observed or experienced some phenomena which seemed to defy laws of nature. With respect to the demonic, I can relate one such experience, from which I must necessarily omit certain details so as to not betray anyone's privacy:

Several years ago, I met someone whom I will refer to as "Jim". Jim suffered from serious mental illness and had been unable to develop an awareness that he had a problem for which medical treatment was necessary (and readily available). I tried to be a good friend, but Jim's life was upside down and he regularly got into (sometimes serious) trouble with local law enforcement. I visited him and picked him up from the county jail on several occasions over the years. As I got to know Jim better, I also discovered he had something of an obsession with "the devil" and demons, as well angels and manual copying of long portions of the Christian Bible.

One evening, Jim seemed to be struggling with an intense episode of paranoia and I went to visit him at his request. Upon entering his apartment, I felt that something was... wrong, very wrong. I couldn't quite figure out what it was, but then Jim spontaneously began to verbally relate knowledge of events in my life which were in no way recorded in digital or physical media (Facebook, paper trash, etc.) – private things, secret things, spanning years before I met Jim (and in precise form) of which I had never spoken. It began with one sudden statement, which startled me, which reaction elicited a pained laugh from Jim. He then proceeded to relate more "secret knowledge". His intense gaze (at me) and manner of speech throughout seemed "detached" from the world around him... for just a moment I was genuinely frightened. I said a silent prayer, abruptly changed the subject, and then hurried him out the door so we could go get a late dinner and coffee. Later conversations with Jim suggested that he didn't recall the incident; I've never asked him how he knew those things. Sadly, Jim disappared some time later, after a failed intervention to get him medical help. If he's still alive, I hope a couple of things for Jim. One, that he will realize he needs medical help to deal with his mental illness, and will avail himself of it. Two, that if he is under demonic influence, then he will meet with a kind soul who is able to help deliver him. I have spoken with a real-life exorcist – I didn't seek him out, I met him in passing – and was told that my experience with Jim was a possible sign of demonic activity though not necessarily possession.

Please note that my relating the above is not my way of "pounding the table" to insist that demons are real. It's a very personal and unexaggerated anecdote offered, for what it's worth, in relation to the idea that exorcisms and experience of the demonic would somehow always relate to "internal" phenomena.

Re: Neurons Gone Wild

#25
post #23

I read this article hoping for some neuroscience but just got a few buzzwords and a lot of argument by analogy. This is not reductionism or science. It's just another artificial conceptual framework built on top of pop evolutionary psychology.

It does not purport to be science; not really. It's supposition. That is not a knock against it. The existence and nature of consciousness, and its relationship to the computing and (perhaps) learning systems we now build, is a big open question, and the single biggest gaping hole in our knowledge about the world. It seems likely that filling that gap will require conceptual frameworks for thinking about consciousnes…

you and the article 'do not understand [it] at all', maybe, but a generalization ignorant of probable scientific excourse is the opposite of scientific, as the GP pointed out.

Re: Neurons Gone Wild

#26
post #16
post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That is a rationalization for drinking beer. I'm not against alcohol, but I am against people deceiving themselves about its effects. Alcohol will make you less, not more intelligent.

#ThatsTheJoke

Except it's not always true. A little bit of alcohol can take the edge off, reduce the stress. I don't know about you, but I myself am like 20 IQ points dumber when stressed out.

Re: Neurons Gone Wild

#27
post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

#ThatsTheJoke

Except it's not always true. A little bit of alcohol can take the edge off, reduce the stress. I don't know about you, but I myself am like 20 IQ points dumber when stressed out.

That's the ballmer peak

Re: Neurons Gone Wild

#28
Reminds me of Eric Raymond’s “Dancing With The Gods — An autobiographical account of my ‘religious’ beliefs and how they got that way”: http://www.catb.org/~esr/writings/dancing.html

Author’s note: “If you start this, please read it through. Stopping partway would probably leave you with some very silly misconceptions.

Re: Neurons Gone Wild

#30

A fascinating piece, even if I don't hold the author's materialistic views. Regarding exorcisms, one aspect that is not addressed is sometimes external manifestations of demonic activity/presence not explainable (or seemingly not explainable) by biochemical processes. Now, one can dismiss such claims out of hand if one considers a priori that such occurrences are impossible (i.e. that the super-natural does not exist…

One interpretation that you seem to overlook in favor of an external demonic possession: he has sociopathic tendencies (perhaps spying on you) and was attempting to manipulate you into thinking he is/was possessed. Maybe you even got wasted with Jim once and let out some secrets. Anyway, I If true, he succeeded in defending his criminal behavior by outsourcing his internal evil on bogus societal constructs such as religion or demonic possession. I see why you got downvoted though; the OP makes a yet another more plausible case of splitting of the self, or growth of a more evil, maniacal self.
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