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If you had 5 dollars and 2 hours, how would you make as much money as possible?

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Re: If you had 5 dollars and 2 hours, how would you make as much money as possible?

#151

Post by gnaritas »

bhousel wrote: post #96
thenduks wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Thanks for the synopsis. I'm curious, though, what makes the solutions 'immoral' or dishonest? They seem perfectly legitimate to me.

Agreed.. I'm surprised by the comments here where many seem to think that some ways of making money are more fair than others. I would have expected the Hacker News crowd to really admire the winning team's 'hack'. But anyway, as long as it's not illegal , I don't see what the problem is. The instructor didn't say how (or even whether) to spend the seed money. Another way to look at it -- a good idea and good executi…

> But anyway, as long as it's not illegal, I don't see what the problem is.

It's thinking like that that makes most people not like Wall Street and businessmen in general. Legal and illegal and right and wrong and not the same thing. Being ethical doesn't just mean following the law, it means following the spirit of the law and not doing things other would perceive as wrong, regardless of the law. It's wrong to cut in line, but it's not illegal, that doesn't mean you should do it. It's wrong to be rude and insulting for no reason to a stranger, but it's not illegal, that doesn't mean you should do it or that it's OK to do it.

Re: If you had 5 dollars and 2 hours, how would you make as much money as possible?

#152

Post by dkokelley »

varikin wrote: post #84
seldo wrote: post #80

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You make valid points. My problem is less the specifics of the individual teams' solutions -- I don't dispute they were very clever and creative solutions -- but rather the impression that the greatest reward went to those who went furthest outside of the rules. Team 1 were arguably entirely within the rules and made $200, Team 2 went a little outside (unless they were handed the envelope at 6pm) and made a little mo…

If you watch the video, all teams were handed the envelop at the start of the week in class. They were allowed to think an form a business plan as long as they liked. They didn't know how much was in the envelop. Once they opened the envelop, they had 2 hours to make money.

Exactly. They weren't told they must open the envelope. The last team figured this out and (presumably) timed it so that their 2 hours coincided with the 3 minute presentation time.

Re: If you had 5 dollars and 2 hours, how would you make as much money as possible?

#153

Post by pyre »

mechanical_fish wrote: post #81
thenduks wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Thanks for the synopsis. I'm curious, though, what makes the solutions 'immoral' or dishonest? They seem perfectly legitimate to me.

From what I can see, their customers were happy, they made money, and it was all above-board, let alone legal. Clearly, something must be wrong! I have to say, I'm even more amused by people's outrage at these winning tactics than by the tactics themselves. I begin to understand why it's necessary to have an entire class in entrepreneurship. Perhaps it is largely about training people not to be pinned, like hapless c…

If I take a job as a hit man, and I always manage to kill my targets I am also making my customers happy, but I would hardly claim that I was being ethical.

{edit} To expand on that, the legality of what is being done doesn't matter either. There are many unethical things that are still legal (e.g. patent trolls, large companies burying competition through using the legal system as a money drain, suing someone for defamation/slander just to shut them up about something that is true but you don't want anyone to know about, etc).

And it wasn't 'above the board' either, because it's not like they told the restaurant what they were doing. If I call ahead and book a table for two that I have no intention of using unless I can scalp/pawn it off on someone else, how am I being ethical by lying to the restaurant? {/edit}

Re: If you had 5 dollars and 2 hours, how would you make as much money as possible?

#154

Post by forensic »

mp3jeep01 wrote: post #113
Tichy wrote: post #89

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"And I don't seem to recall anything in the "constraints" about not being allowed to beg or borrow anything, nor any rules about not being allowed to use stuff you already own." What if "stuff you already own" includes a bank account with 2 million bucks in it? I also thought the solution was a bit dishonest, but then the whole thing should not be taken that serious from the start. The reservations solution seems eve…

As far as a restaurant is concerned, why would they really care? It might annoy customers, but as long as the tables are still filling up, I feel the restaurant is more than happy, because they're still making the best of their available resources (tables and wait-staff). It's a valid point how the artificial constraints are the envelope and the time, because the way she listed the rules was, clock starts when you op…

Why not take ALL the reservations, and then force EVERY customer that wants to eat there to buy them from you?

Because you're fucking up the social contract that restaurants have with their customers.

Re: If you had 5 dollars and 2 hours, how would you make as much money as possible?

#155

Post by forensic »

wizard_2 wrote: post #103
seldo wrote: post #73

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, because the lesson I really want people who are thinking of working on Wall Street to learn is that they should be trying to cheat the system.

With wall street as with most things, there is no "outside the system" everything is the system even if other people don't recognize it. I'll argue outside the rules is still inside the system, and that not all rules are created equal. On another note, Breaking rules isn't what caused the recent wall street collapse it was a lack of looking ahead at consequences of actions.

"Breaking rules isn't what caused the recent wall street collapse it was a lack of looking ahead at consequences of actions."

Not really. All the people who caused the problem are still employed and still rich. So for those entrepreneurs, they are still succeeding. It is the USA public who are failing at being entrepreneurs, not Wall Street.

Re: If you had 5 dollars and 2 hours, how would you make as much money as possible?

#156

Post by Goladus »

seldo wrote: post #80
mechanical_fish wrote: post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Your argument seems to lean a bit too strongly on unsupported accusations of fraud: Did it take less than 2 hours to create the booth, the signs, and perform the services? Unlikely. What, you're saying that a team of college students, on a college campus , which presumably has a fully stocked stationery store within five minutes' walk, can't throw up some hand-scrawled signs in less than (say) 15 minutes for under fi…

You make valid points. My problem is less the specifics of the individual teams' solutions -- I don't dispute they were very clever and creative solutions -- but rather the impression that the greatest reward went to those who went furthest outside of the rules. Team 1 were arguably entirely within the rules and made $200, Team 2 went a little outside (unless they were handed the envelope at 6pm) and made a little mo…

The lesson was: don't let funding distract you from identifying the most valuable resources available to you. At worst, the cases you mention break the rules in rather insignificant ways. All three scenarios can quite plausibly be done entirely within the rules as defined, even if they didn't quite make it in reality.

Presumably, there were much less creative solutions that also failed to entirely obey all stipulations. It was an exercise, not a contest.

Re: If you had 5 dollars and 2 hours, how would you make as much money as possible?

#157

Post by Goladus »

raganwald wrote: post #104
seldo wrote: post #80

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You make valid points. My problem is less the specifics of the individual teams' solutions -- I don't dispute they were very clever and creative solutions -- but rather the impression that the greatest reward went to those who went furthest outside of the rules. Team 1 were arguably entirely within the rules and made $200, Team 2 went a little outside (unless they were handed the envelope at 6pm) and made a little mo…

Fundamentally, you're not rewarding creativity at money-making, you're rewarding creativity at rule-breaking. And there's your insight. If what you want is money, and lots of it, finding creative ways to game the system is how it's done. I am not lauding that, just pointing it out.

Actually the lesson was about managing valuable resources, not gaming the system. It was a warning that the system can be distracting and can easily confine your thinking.

Re: If you had 5 dollars and 2 hours, how would you make as much money as possible?

#158

Post by Devilboy »

chrischen wrote: post #142
dotBen wrote: post #108

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The biggest issue with this one is its unrepeatable... it's a one time deal. They executed the advertising opportunity, now they have nothing. The other two, issues with their business practices aside, have set up businesses that could continue to operate, grow and scale. To me that deserves more recognition than a flash-in-the-pan idea.

But that wasn't what they were asked to do. They weren't asked to develop the best sustainable business model with 2 hours and $5, they were asked to come back with the most money.

Team 4 phoned a rich family member and got him to donate $1000 to their effort.

Re: If you had 5 dollars and 2 hours, how would you make as much money as possible?

#159

Post by bhousel »

gnaritas wrote: post #151
bhousel wrote: post #96

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Agreed.. I'm surprised by the comments here where many seem to think that some ways of making money are more fair than others. I would have expected the Hacker News crowd to really admire the winning team's 'hack'. But anyway, as long as it's not illegal , I don't see what the problem is. The instructor didn't say how (or even whether) to spend the seed money. Another way to look at it -- a good idea and good executi…

> But anyway, as long as it's not illegal, I don't see what the problem is. It's thinking like that that makes most people not like Wall Street and businessmen in general. Legal and illegal and right and wrong and not the same thing. Being ethical doesn't just mean following the law, it means following the spirit of the law and not doing things other would perceive as wrong, regardless of the law. It's wrong to cut i…

That's true, and I totally agree with you. I guess my comment came out wrong. What I meant to say was that I don't see what the problem is for the purposes of the assignment.

Obviously the rules for doing business on Wall Street, where decisions can impact millions of people, and the rules for this business class assignment are going to be different.

Re: If you had 5 dollars and 2 hours, how would you make as much money as possible?

#160

Post by koolkelso »

Devilboy wrote: post #158
chrischen wrote: post #142

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But that wasn't what they were asked to do. They weren't asked to develop the best sustainable business model with 2 hours and $5, they were asked to come back with the most money.

Team 4 phoned a rich family member and got him to donate $1000 to their effort.

That's one of the main things executives bring to the table in a business: connections.
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