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FCC Passes Strict Net Neutrality Regulations on 3-2 Vote

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Re: FCC Passes Strict Net Neutrality Regulations on 3-2 Vote

#691
post #520

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And that is why you would disconnect the Bell on all the "extra" phones. ;)

Fascinating and informative! Thanks! I had no idea it was this bad, as I am from the UK.

It was almost that bad in pretty much all European countries too. Including the UK. Prior to the start of deregulation in 1981 you could only rent your phone from BT, and BT/the Post Office had sole authority to decide what could be attached to the network.

Starting from 1981, standardized sockets were introduced to allow people to buy and attach third party equipment, and BSI took over the responsibility for setting the standards for what equipment could be attached.

(And you can still rent your phone from BT if you prefer: http://bt.custhelp.com/app/answers/detail/a_id/13012/~/is-it... )

Re: FCC Passes Strict Net Neutrality Regulations on 3-2 Vote

#692

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Here's the breakdown of new accounts I noticed: 4 for NN (not necessarily for the FCC action) 1 against 1 unknown 1 ambiguous Unless you have a different definition of new account, it is not even close to 'all but universally'. Edit: I'm still not seeing how your edit applies. There was only one new person I saw that would even come close to 'parroting discredited anti-neutrality talking points'.

We disagree on your characterization of the posters.

How would you characterize them then?

I'll give you that one person easily fits the bill. The rest I'm just not seeing it. I'm not sure how you can get anything out of 'time will tell'. Two where just arguing against the blanket labeling of green members as astroturfers. One of the parents wasn't even arguing against NN, but the way this decision acheives it. Other than that one person where is the astroturfing from the green members?

Do you consider me an anti-NN astroturfer even though I have yet to comment on the decision?

Re: FCC Passes Strict Net Neutrality Regulations on 3-2 Vote

#693

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The Affordable Healthcare Act was gigantic and created by morons, but by most metrics is improving the American healthcare system. The argument that the government can not act in a way that improves things, even if it is not the perfect solution, is contrary to fact. EDIT: I treat down-votes in the absence of a counter-argument as up-votes.

The Affordable Healthcare Act was ... created by morons Really? I thought it was drafted by very clever, largely self-interested people. I treat down-votes in the absence of a counter-argument as up-votes. Good luck with that. Sounds like a great way to eventually find yourself banned.

The morons part was just me being facetious. Since I edited my comment I went from -3 to 0, so apparently people agree. I don't know why asking for a counter-argument would get me banned, or how you know anything about being banned from HN when you've been a member for 86 days and I've been a member for over 600 days. I've never actually heard of banning here.

Re: FCC Passes Strict Net Neutrality Regulations on 3-2 Vote

#694

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes but by drawing that parallel, you have to realize that programmers represent totalitarian dictators. Software isn't a democracy. America is.

I don't know what your job is like, but at mine, I'm accountable to various technical leadership, PMs, UX, and ultimately the client, from which all authority to commit code that goes to production is derived. :) And the FCC is an agent deriving its authority to regulate from legislation and working under elected executive authority. So I'm not sure what the connection with totalitarian dictatorship is.

You write the rules that govern exactly how every aspect of the program runs. If a part of the program runs in a way that your government doesn't approve of, it gets modified or ripped out and replaced with code that does follow the rules exactly. You don't let the code decide for itself whether it should loop or not, you tell it exactly when it should loop and exactly when it should continue.

Totalitarian governments don't exist of just one person, either.

Re: FCC Passes Strict Net Neutrality Regulations on 3-2 Vote

#695

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The Affordable Healthcare Act was gigantic and created by morons, but by most metrics is improving the American healthcare system. The argument that the government can not act in a way that improves things, even if it is not the perfect solution, is contrary to fact. EDIT: I treat down-votes in the absence of a counter-argument as up-votes.

Not being in the USA, could you summarise the Affordable Healthcare Act and the problems with it?

Unfortunately, not really. You might know it better as Obamacare, though. It created health insurance exchanges that are subsidized for low income people and reformed other aspects of medical reimbursement and regulations governing health insurance. The aspects you think are problematic will depend on whether you're criticizing it from the right (it increased government involvement, and the complexity of the healthcare system, etc.) or the left (that it gave private insurance companies too much power, wasn't universal, and didn't fundamentally address some of the problems driving cost increases, etc.). Either way, the data shows that healthcare costs are growing more slowly after implementation and that more people are insured than were in the past.

Re: FCC Passes Strict Net Neutrality Regulations on 3-2 Vote

#696
Free markets lead to better profits, better profits lead to better innovation. Better innovation leads to cheaper prices. I guess no one learned from the last multi-hundred page bill (that no one was allowed to see) that didn't "lower prices" as it was chanted with religious zeal. Self-righteous power grabs in the name of the common good are always more important than actual consequences in reality.

Re: FCC Passes Strict Net Neutrality Regulations on 3-2 Vote

#697
post #659

Earlier quoted context omitted.

if problem 1 really matters, market forces will handle it. Market forces didn't handle seat belts, air bags, fuel efficiency, racial discrimination, taxation without representation, etc. We cannot rely on the market to solve all problems.

As always, these items are only presented as "problems" because of the presence of government. So when government steps in and solves them, all pro-state individuals shout a glorious "Hurray, take that free-market!!'. >Seat Belts: If individuals wanted them, the car companies would have followed suit. You forget that not only were seat belts mandated to be installed, but people were FINED if they didn't put them on.…

>Seat Belts: If individuals wanted them, the car companies would have followed suit. You forget that not only were seat belts mandated to be installed, but people were FINED if they didn't put them on.

Not sure i see an issue here, we know that individuals did not particularly want them, just as i would prefer not to wear a seatbelt on an airplane because i'm not capable of understanding at any given time what the likelihood of danger is on a plane. Do you get mad at the government went the fasten seatbelt sign goes on during turbulence?

> If there wasn't a state, I'm sure you'd have safety organizations putting out reports/studies about effectiveness of air bags

You are "sure" are you? congratulations, no one else is. You can't use hand waving to dismiss this problem.

>Rich people would buy them in their cars, poor people wouldn't

In a country that absolutely necessitates the use of a car, do you think its morally acceptable to keep airbags out of reach of the poor?

>and they don't do that now anyways

Are you under the impression that poor people in the US drive around in cars without airbags and seat belts?

>Fuel efficiency: ... Let me know how that's working out.

Its working quite well, I lease cars and each of my last three cars (3 years each, current car is due next month) were cheaper than the previous and more fuel efficient. For the record i was not switching types of cars - previous cars where pontiac G6, Chevy Malibu, Mazda 3, all similarly sized/priced cars.

>Again, if people wanted it, you wouldn't have to force them to do it.

OK so i want a 99 MPG car. If i dont have to force an automaker to produce one, why arent they? Youre looking at the market as a abstraction of reality. In reality an automakers motivation is profit, not sales. There are other ways of increasing profit than determining and matching consumer demand. To ignore this is far from trivial.

>Racial discrimination: This was enforced and perpetuated by state laws. Some would argue it still happens today with certain mandatory sentencing laws, minimum wage, etc.

Whats your argument here? That we would be better off with no state laws at all? That we would be better off with no regulation on discrimination in any direction?

>The free-market is more democracy than democracy is right now, and people fundamentally can not accept that.

Its not that people can't accept it, it is that a direct democracy is universally accepted as a terrible organizational structure. Theres a reason the US is NOT a democracy. There is no disagreement, the free market would be a direct democracy, and that is not a positive thing to say.

Re: FCC Passes Strict Net Neutrality Regulations on 3-2 Vote

#698
post #691

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Fascinating and informative! Thanks! I had no idea it was this bad, as I am from the UK.

It was almost that bad in pretty much all European countries too. Including the UK. Prior to the start of deregulation in 1981 you could only rent your phone from BT, and BT/the Post Office had sole authority to decide what could be attached to the network. Starting from 1981, standardized sockets were introduced to allow people to buy and attach third party equipment, and BSI took over the responsibility for setting…

Ah I was born mid80s so grew up after the deregulation. My brother once moved into a flat where the previous tenant had rented their phone from BT but moved without telling them, leading to many threatening letters from BT regarding the phone.

One thing I am surprised about these days is how RUBBISH home phones are. Given the advances in cheap mobile phone technology and the finishes/quality even on cheap devices, home phones still feel like toys and have abysmal quality and no features - I would love to pair a bluetooth headset to a base station and wander around but apparently this is entirely beyond the normal use patterns envisioned by manufacturers. It's very frustrating - I almost want to go back to a 1980s polyoxybenzylmethylenglycolanhydride rotary phone.

Re: FCC Passes Strict Net Neutrality Regulations on 3-2 Vote

#699

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not being in the USA, could you summarise the Affordable Healthcare Act and the problems with it?

Unfortunately, not really. You might know it better as Obamacare, though. It created health insurance exchanges that are subsidized for low income people and reformed other aspects of medical reimbursement and regulations governing health insurance. The aspects you think are problematic will depend on whether you're criticizing it from the right (it increased government involvement, and the complexity of the healthca…

Thanks. Where does the subsidisation come from?

Re: FCC Passes Strict Net Neutrality Regulations on 3-2 Vote

#700

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Out of interest, what is the situation like in Germany with regard to the networks?

Mostly depressing. Basically the Telcos are acting in the same way as the ones in the USA. But we didn't have such an uproar from the people without which, I assume, the new NN rules couldn't be established in the USA. Politicians are influenced mostly from the telcos and seem to follow their line of argument. We do have some services that would violate net neutrality rules, like the circumvention of data caps sold b…

Very informative, thank you! The more I read about the USA and other developed countries and their networks and poor mobile networks, the more I realise how fortunate I am to live here in the UK where fibre optic is rolled out for suburban areas and you generally get a mobile signal most places (apart from extreme countryside locations or in valleys).
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