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Show HN: A histogram of salaries given to H1B workers in the software industry

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Re: Show HN: A histogram of salaries given to H1B workers in the software industry

#31

Post by pslam »

fsk wrote: post #20

Alternatively, you could look at what % raise a former H1-b visa holder receives when he gets his greencard. I heard it can be 2x-3x, but I've never seen a formal analysis.

It is illegal to pay an H1-B Visa Holder differently to the prevailing wage. Converting to a Green Card should have no effect on your pay, and if it does, the employers are committing fraud.

You may have a side-effect of increased pay due to having more positions open to you. Holding an H1-B restricts you to a specific job description. For example, if you were a plain ordinary "Software Engineer" with nobody reporting to you, then you are not normally allowed to move to a role where you would have reports. This can be overcome with due-process and lawyers etc, but the basic idea is an H1-B worker is coming to the US to fill a job role not just a job.

So, when you convert to holding a Green Card, you can get promoted into positions which weren't previously open to you. You get the pay increase by being a better engineer and getting the better job.

Re: Show HN: A histogram of salaries given to H1B workers in the software industry

#32

Post by canistr »

jure_z wrote: post #9
negrit wrote: post #3

This is not relevant: > The best city for software engineers was Menlo Park with an average salary of $130,640 The best city for software engineers should not determined on salary only. If the cost of living is 10X cheaper in Huntington Beach and the average salary is $125k then the best city by far is Huntington Beach. Then again there is a lot more than salary to consider before moving to a city...

Good point, would be interesting to see a comparison with cost of living included.

May further want to account for income tax laws according to state. Take-home pay is really what we're after.

Re: Show HN: A histogram of salaries given to H1B workers in the software industry

#34

Post by JOnAgain »

negrit wrote: post #17
ensmotko wrote: post #2

It'd be interesting to see how H1B salaries compare to normal salaries, but that data probably isn't publicly available, right?

By law, foreigners should not have a lower salary. When a company sponsor an employee for a visa, the salary is one of the criteria to check for the immigration. They should/have to make sure it match the average salary in the office location. So, if the office is in Boulder, CO instead of San Francisco then it's ok to not pay your employee $100k+. But a least 4 of the top 10 companies sponsoring for visas in the US…

tldr; turnover of visa holders vs. non-visa holders should be used as the metric more than wages. Significantly lower turnover of visa holders suggests they're being exploited since those who can quit and find another job do.

But this doesn't work. For many people on H1B's the visa and greencard sponsoring has tremendous value. The do depress wages, but it's because of the risk around the visas.

If you have an H1B, you're less likely to work at startups -- if the company goes bust and you need to find a job fast, you're at tremendous risk of needing to leave the US. You have 4-5 weeks to get a new job, but it has to start by then. Thinking about how long interview cycles can be at some companies, 4 weeks from application to start date is challenging.

Also, people getting sponsored are much less likely to leave. This should be the real metric for evaluation -- turnover. If you're on a visa, especially if you're getting sponsored for a green card, you're much less likely to quit and go to another company. You can get hired at a competitive salary, but over a few years and a few promotions you can be underpaid.

To completely stereotype, I used to work with a ton of these guys at Amazon -- they're all in line for Green Cards and will not consider quitting or even complaining about things until they get it. The turnover among non-visa people is much higher.

Re: Show HN: A histogram of salaries given to H1B workers in the software industry

#35

Post by JeremyMorgan »

I'm wondering where the data came from and how accurate it it is.

"In 2012 the Oregon software industry gave jobs to 38 foreign software engineers."

Ok so here I am assuming you mean 38 new H1B engineers were hired in 2012. There is no way that could be true, I nearly hired and processed that many H1Bs personally in 2012. I was working with several others with similar or higher numbers. And that's just one company in Oregon.

Not trying to nitpick with anecdotal data, but it just seems wrong to me.

Re: Show HN: A histogram of salaries given to H1B workers in the software industry

#36

Post by rev_bird »

hoprocker wrote: post #8

I am an unabashed infographic fanatic, but one thing that really throws me off here is the changing scale between graphs. I think it'd be a lot easier to flip through these tabs if a) the pay scale was the same for each graphic, and b) the pixel count on the y-axis remained the same.

Seconding this. The data is thorough and fascinating, but impossible to compare between any two. Not being able to select two at the same time is fine, but it'd be really nice to at least be able to switch between two without getting stuck with apples and oranges.

Re: Show HN: A histogram of salaries given to H1B workers in the software industry

#37

Post by fiatmoney »

pslam wrote: post #31
fsk wrote: post #20

Alternatively, you could look at what % raise a former H1-b visa holder receives when he gets his greencard. I heard it can be 2x-3x, but I've never seen a formal analysis.

It is illegal to pay an H1-B Visa Holder differently to the prevailing wage. Converting to a Green Card should have no effect on your pay, and if it does, the employers are committing fraud. You may have a side-effect of increased pay due to having more positions open to you. Holding an H1-B restricts you to a specific job description. For example, if you were a plain ordinary "Software Engineer" with nobody reportin…

It's illegal to hire H1-Bs in preference to citizen workers, yet that goes on all the time.

Re: Show HN: A histogram of salaries given to H1B workers in the software industry

#40

Post by kelukelugames »

ensmotko wrote: post #2

It'd be interesting to see how H1B salaries compare to normal salaries, but that data probably isn't publicly available, right?

Legally it should be the same. But in reality foreign workers have way less leverage when negotiating.
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