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Marijuana may be even safer than previously thought, researchers say

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Re: Marijuana may be even safer than previously thought, researchers say

#151

Post by DanBC »

Retric wrote: post #79
DanBC wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The number of elderly people who drive who shouldn't be is mind boggling. Is this supported by any research? Road traffic accident statistics show too many young people. So, older people might be safer drivers. Of course, there are a few people with dementia or visual impairment who shouldn't be driving but it's interesting that it's ok to suggest that older people are risky drivers when that doesn't appear to be t…

Older drivers (85+) are generally extremely risky per mile. "On the per-mile basis, the death rate of target drivers aged 85 and older is nearly triple that of drivers aged 16 to 17" https://aaafoundation.org/sites/default/files/OlderDriverRis... They drive fewer miles, but even still their far more risky than teenagers. "The per-driver death rate of target drivers aged 85 and older is nearly double that of target dr…

Thank you! That changed my mind.

Re: Marijuana may be even safer than previously thought, researchers say

#152

Post by [deleted] »

integraton wrote: post #74
Someone1234 wrote: post #23

I've never been a user, but I do support legalisation. The reason I support it even though I myself wouldn't benefit is: - It is at least as safe as tobacco and alcohol. So even if we leave the question of what is safer on the table, I think most people would agree based on available evidence that it isn't LESS safe than those two, and they're legal. - The "war on drugs" has been a disaster. It has actually hurt econ…

> drive under the influence The research about Marijuana's impact on driving is inconclusive, but there are indications that it might have no negative impact (for the most recent example: https://s3.amazonaws.com/s3.documentcloud.org/documents/1667... ) and even that it might reduce risks of crashes. As a result, it's unfortunate that it's apparently socially acceptable to assume without question that marijuana has a…

[deleted]

Re: Marijuana may be even safer than previously thought, researchers say

#153

Post by hga »

anigbrowl wrote: post #129
hga wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Suspected "unwanted mental health effects" include full blow permanent schizophrenia. (Emphasis on suspected, for we know there's a lot of mental illness self-medication with psychoactive drugs starting with alcohol.) That strikes me as making it very hard to do ethical research of the sort you're positing.

That's a reasonable point, but marijuana use is already prevalent enough that you could probably recruit a statistically significant number of existing users with little difficulty and track the incidence of mental ill-health vs. a control population.

Per my other comment in this sub-thread, my concern there is that the experimental group will still be getting whatever it is that's bad, and in the context of "unwanted permanent mental health effects" of recreational use the experiment would be unethical.

On the other hand, with the recent state-wide decriminalizations we're "conducting" a rather while uncontrolled experiment right now that ought to be able to yield better data on the biggest concerns, although that sort of epidemiological research is really, really hard, and few are unbiased.

Re: Marijuana may be even safer than previously thought, researchers say

#154

Post by bri3d »

ssharp wrote: post #65
Someone1234 wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I agree. People are far too blasé about drinking and driving in the US. It also seems like the punishment is often fairly light for the first few offenses (e.g. a small ticket, no penalty points, or similar). People from the US I've spoken to often claim this is because in some areas not having a car is pretty unworkable due to a lack of public transport or alternatives. So if driving was revoked then people could ge…

If you get a DUI, even for the first time, you're going to spend at least a night in jail and rack up several thousand dollars in fines and attorney fees. I don't think first time DUI's are a felony in most of the U.S., but you're going to get points on your license and it's going to cost you long-term with insurance as well. The penalties aren't damning, but I'm not sure I'd call them "light" either. Many states als…

DUI plates are an interesting idea, but they're only used in Ohio and Minnesota - I had no idea they existed until I read your post!

Re: Marijuana may be even safer than previously thought, researchers say

#155

Post by discardorama »

mycroft-holmes wrote: post #85
ska wrote: post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think anyone, regardless of their own take on the issues, would argue that current drug policy in the U.S. is internally consistent.

True. I wasn't necessarily trying to imply that anybody does. It was more to illustrate that we live in one of those countries now. In most of the US, you could get thrown into jail but it's fine as long as you're where all the politicians are.

> but it's fine as long as you're where all the politicians are.

Though, to be fair: the DC MJ laws were changed by the voters of DC, despite threats from Republicans to repeal that law. The Congress did not vote itself a puff-puff-pass law.

Also: you cannot toke up in the federal areas of DC (a large chunk of DC is under the feds, including national parks and monuments), despite what the DC law says.

Re: Marijuana may be even safer than previously thought, researchers say

#156

Post by maxerickson »

Retric wrote: post #79
DanBC wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The number of elderly people who drive who shouldn't be is mind boggling. Is this supported by any research? Road traffic accident statistics show too many young people. So, older people might be safer drivers. Of course, there are a few people with dementia or visual impairment who shouldn't be driving but it's interesting that it's ok to suggest that older people are risky drivers when that doesn't appear to be t…

Older drivers (85+) are generally extremely risky per mile. "On the per-mile basis, the death rate of target drivers aged 85 and older is nearly triple that of drivers aged 16 to 17" https://aaafoundation.org/sites/default/files/OlderDriverRis... They drive fewer miles, but even still their far more risky than teenagers. "The per-driver death rate of target drivers aged 85 and older is nearly double that of target dr…

I was in the vehicle with a new 30 something driver when they made a large input to the wrong pedal and put the vehicle through a wall.

Ford F-150 had some minor damage to the bumper, the brick wall had major damage for the width of the vehicle (I think any modern pickup would fair similarly).

Re: Marijuana may be even safer than previously thought, researchers say

#157

Post by nedwin »

Someone1234 wrote: post #23

I've never been a user, but I do support legalisation. The reason I support it even though I myself wouldn't benefit is: - It is at least as safe as tobacco and alcohol. So even if we leave the question of what is safer on the table, I think most people would agree based on available evidence that it isn't LESS safe than those two, and they're legal. - The "war on drugs" has been a disaster. It has actually hurt econ…

In Australia we have rolled out widespread "booze busses" which block off major roads and breathalize everyone who comes through. This + major advertising campaigns have had a significant impact on drunk driving.

I am surprised at the lack of these kinds of measures in the US - and how casually most people treat drink driving.

These booze busses have now extended to testing for marijuana and methamphetamine, though neither drug is likely to be legalized in Australia anytime soon.

Re: Marijuana may be even safer than previously thought, researchers say

#158

Post by innguest »

LordKano wrote: post #82

I don't smoke but I don't care if you do. Because of my field of work, I am subject to drug testing and I like my job so I don't partake but it really doesn't matter to me if someone else wants to. It doesn't make any sense to me to spend billions of dollars every year to try to stop people from obtaining and ingesting a plant. Even if it were a deadly poison, it still wouldn't make sense to me. For example, if drink…

Great point!

Let me help you out. Your hemlock hypothetical already exists. It's a Japanese fish called Fugu and the fatality rate from consumption thereof is 6.8%. I would never advocate for making Fugu illegal.

Re: Marijuana may be even safer than previously thought, researchers say

#159

Post by mod »

filoeleven wrote: post #148
Someone1234 wrote: post #23

I've never been a user, but I do support legalisation. The reason I support it even though I myself wouldn't benefit is: - It is at least as safe as tobacco and alcohol. So even if we leave the question of what is safer on the table, I think most people would agree based on available evidence that it isn't LESS safe than those two, and they're legal. - The "war on drugs" has been a disaster. It has actually hurt econ…

> Unfortunately there isn't a very reliable test to see if someone is under the influence of anything other than alcohol. I heard a lot of noise almost a decade ago about impairment testing. The idea is not to test for a specific drug, or a specific amount of a drug, but rather to test the ability of the person to react to situations. There isn't a lot of material out there about it, but it was highly praised at the…

It also would presumably discriminate against entire swaths of people (think old folks, potentially disabled drivers, etc).

Not that I think anyone incapable of driving should be, but any impairment test would flunk certain groups of 100% sober people working at their best ability (not sleep-drunk, either).

Re: Marijuana may be even safer than previously thought, researchers say

#160

Post by mod »

nedwin wrote: post #157
Someone1234 wrote: post #23

I've never been a user, but I do support legalisation. The reason I support it even though I myself wouldn't benefit is: - It is at least as safe as tobacco and alcohol. So even if we leave the question of what is safer on the table, I think most people would agree based on available evidence that it isn't LESS safe than those two, and they're legal. - The "war on drugs" has been a disaster. It has actually hurt econ…

In Australia we have rolled out widespread "booze busses" which block off major roads and breathalize everyone who comes through. This + major advertising campaigns have had a significant impact on drunk driving. I am surprised at the lack of these kinds of measures in the US - and how casually most people treat drink driving. These booze busses have now extended to testing for marijuana and methamphetamine, though n…

There's plenty of roadblocks in the US.

It's often argued they violate the constitution--that police are stopping every car for no reason.

Police get around that by calling it a "safety check."

There's plenty of videos about how to "beat" them: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kLmKl60VrWM

You can see from this video that the cops are clearly violating rights, and someone who knows what their rights are can stand up for themselves, so to speak.

There's another one I can't find where someone hangs a note out the window and gets waved through.

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