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Go to Prison for File Sharing? That's What Hollywood Wants in the TPP Deal

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Re: Go to Prison for File Sharing? That's What Hollywood Wants in the TPP Deal

#21

Post by TheSpiceIsLife »

walterbell wrote: post #13
TheSpiceIsLife wrote: post #8

I can't speak for the US, but I'm just not buying the fear about the TPP. I honestly can't see the Australian judiciary sending people to jail, or issuing large fines, for sharing media. Suppose the sentencing is mandatory leaving the judiciary with no choice. We'll see how long that lasts, but very well then, I'll happily spend 3 months in an Australian prison for sharing media. I think you'd probably have to book i…

http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/SelectiveEnforcem... "SpongeBob SquarePants: In Bikini Bottom, harassing your business rival to near-suicide, destroying stuff because you've got the IQ of a turnip, or being an all-around annoying jackass with No Indoor Voice is perfectly acceptable. Littering, however, can get you an orange jumpsuit. Just ask Squidward or Mrs. Puff." How I Met Your Mother: Marshall talked…

We don't need TPP for law enforcement to enact Selective Enforcement. David Hicks' case should be evidence enough of that.

If your / my government wants to detain you fairly indefinitely for no reason whatsoever, it can already do that.

I tend to believe the only way through this mess, probably, is through it. Things like this are probably going to have to get a bit worse before they get better. The average person -that is to say, a person who doesn't read a lot of tech related news- doesn't really know, doesn't really care.

It's like some kind of bizarre paraphrasing of Douglas Adams: Having you committed three felonies today? Why not make it four with breakfast at the end of a pirated film.

I realise expressing my lack of concern over this probly isn't very popular in this forum. Like I'm supposed to be drastically and irrationally concerned about some law and a slippery slope argument.

I'm not though. I cross on the red light, occasionally smoke marijuana, habitually exceed the speed limit, and pirate media.

If Government thinks it can legislate, or intimidate, away minor infractions of victimless crimes, jokes on them.

I just can't take it seriously. I think the appropriate response isn't to be all "omg, draconian government, panic panic panic", no. The appropriate response is to laugh at the politicians and bureaucrats who come up with this nonsense.

If this this proposed legislation actually gets enacted then perhaps what we should all do is voluntarily turn ourselves in Flash Mob style. Probably while smoking reefers.

Re: Go to Prison for File Sharing? That's What Hollywood Wants in the TPP Deal

#22

Post by acd »

What I do not like about these deals which always have funny acronyms TPP, ACTA, SOPA is that they are done in secrecy. If the one who are drafting these agreements are acting in the publics best interest, why are the deals and drafts drawn up in secret? If you have nothing to hide and have good honest intentions why hide your drafts?

That makes me come to the conclusion that the deals they are drafting are not in the publics best interest and thus they want to hide their bad intentions!

Guess what, we live in the information age and the public will know anyway.

Re: Go to Prison for File Sharing? That's What Hollywood Wants in the TPP Deal

#23

Post by tratratra »

Hollywood brought that up to itself, you can't be paying actors for millions and then wonder why people want to get your stuff for free. Make affordable prices by reducing actors salaries and gfx artists salaries to 6 figures rather than having them sitting at a lot of millions.

Re: Go to Prison for File Sharing? That's What Hollywood Wants in the TPP Deal

#24

Post by walterbell »

TheSpiceIsLife wrote: post #21
walterbell wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/SelectiveEnforcem... "SpongeBob SquarePants: In Bikini Bottom, harassing your business rival to near-suicide, destroying stuff because you've got the IQ of a turnip, or being an all-around annoying jackass with No Indoor Voice is perfectly acceptable. Littering, however, can get you an orange jumpsuit. Just ask Squidward or Mrs. Puff." How I Met Your Mother: Marshall talked…

We don't need TPP for law enforcement to enact Selective Enforcement. David Hicks' case should be evidence enough of that. If your / my government wants to detain you fairly indefinitely for no reason whatsoever, it can already do that. I tend to believe the only way through this mess, probably, is through it. Things like this are probably going to have to get a bit worse before they get better. The average person -t…

That's not incompatible with asking your US representative to block Fast-Track and encouraging more transparency and debate on the proposals :)

If software is eating the world, these IP and copyright issues need to be addressed in a sensible manner that encourages future innovation, without being constrained by legacy thinking and economics. The issues are bigger than any one agreement and will affect many startups and people on HN.

Re: Go to Prison for File Sharing? That's What Hollywood Wants in the TPP Deal

#25

Post by lugg »

unfortunateface wrote: post #15
SpaceInvader wrote: post #10

It's all about money. Hollywood is greedy and wants more to create another mediocre (at best) movies.

A business wanting to make more money by charging for their good/bad/ok product? how evil. I don't agree that copyright infringement should be a criminal rather than civil matter. Even when I'm watching a mediocre movie, I still appreciate that it took lots of peoples time and money to create. Edit: updated with word 'more' in response to response to this response of a response

>> It's all about money. Hollywood is greedy and wants more to create another mediocre (at best) movies.

> A business wanting to make money by charging for their good/bad/ok product? how evil.

That doesn't follow in the slightest.

> I don't agree that copyright infringement should be a criminal rather than civil matter.

> Even when I'm watching a mediocre movie, I still appreciate that it took lots of peoples time and money to create.

I'm sorry, but I still don't see what you're adding to this thread.

It literally is about money. The entire industry does not want their current business model to end because of how profitable it is. It, sadly for them, is a dead horse and has been since VHS. They should have pivoted their model back then, hell, they should have at least seen it coming when napster hit the scene, everyone saw movie copying coming straight after music. Why didn't they?

You can appreciate the effort of cogs in an antique machine all you like, but I started lacking all and any sympathy for the lot of them the second they started pushing bullshit takedowns all over the web[1][2].

On making money by charging for their work being evil, no it isn't, not in the slightest. Yet pushing, paying for, and lobbying behind closed doors for the kinds of censorship they are lobbying for, well that is pretty much evil no matter which way you look at it. And them losing, or being unable to make money simply does not excuse that in any way:

"No industry gets to dismantle civil liberties with the poor excuse that they can't make money otherwise." [3]

[1] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chilling_effects

[2] https://www.google.com/search?q=site:chillingeffects.org

[3] https://torrentfreak.com/letter-copyright-monopoly-140921/

Re: Go to Prison for File Sharing? That's What Hollywood Wants in the TPP Deal

#26

Post by mercurial »

walterbell wrote: post #14
pdkl95 wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So how much do they pay you to post that "press release"-style post that doesn't actually explain how the TPP would help? You've posted a lot of fear-mongering, but haven't actually shown what would be changed by the treaty. As we already have very little in the way of tarriffs or other barriers to international trade, there isn't a lot that could be done to "improve trade" between US and asia. So why the treaty? The…

There is a proposed US-EU equivalent of the Australia - Hong Kong arbitration panel for ISDS (Investor-State Dispute Settlement), http://www.computerworlduk.com/blogs/open-enterprise/ttip-up... "So what the European Commission is proposing with the dispute resolution chapter is how future clashes with the US over those key social constructs should be resolved. And the answer is: by a three-person arbitration panel. T…

AFAIK, the ISDS has been met with enough opposition that it has been essentially expunged from the treaty.

Re: Go to Prison for File Sharing? That's What Hollywood Wants in the TPP Deal

#27

Post by TheSpiceIsLife »

walterbell wrote: post #24
TheSpiceIsLife wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We don't need TPP for law enforcement to enact Selective Enforcement. David Hicks' case should be evidence enough of that. If your / my government wants to detain you fairly indefinitely for no reason whatsoever, it can already do that. I tend to believe the only way through this mess, probably, is through it. Things like this are probably going to have to get a bit worse before they get better. The average person -t…

That's not incompatible with asking your US representative to block Fast-Track and encouraging more transparency and debate on the proposals :) If software is eating the world , these IP and copyright issues need to be addressed in a sensible manner that encourages future innovation, without being constrained by legacy thinking and economics. The issues are bigger than any one agreement and will affect many startups…

I agree.

Re: Go to Prison for File Sharing? That's What Hollywood Wants in the TPP Deal

#28

Post by ekianjo »

acd wrote: post #22

What I do not like about these deals which always have funny acronyms TPP, ACTA, SOPA is that they are done in secrecy. If the one who are drafting these agreements are acting in the publics best interest, why are the deals and drafts drawn up in secret? If you have nothing to hide and have good honest intentions why hide your drafts? That makes me come to the conclusion that the deals they are drafting are not in th…

> the public will know anyway.

Yes, but that does not mean the public can actually do something about it (not saying we should not try, though). Political lobbies can be more powerful than citizens, it would not be the first time it happens.

Re: Go to Prison for File Sharing? That's What Hollywood Wants in the TPP Deal

#29

Post by chinathrow »

xnull2guest wrote: post #16
pdkl95 wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So how much do they pay you to post that "press release"-style post that doesn't actually explain how the TPP would help? You've posted a lot of fear-mongering, but haven't actually shown what would be changed by the treaty. As we already have very little in the way of tarriffs or other barriers to international trade, there isn't a lot that could be done to "improve trade" between US and asia. So why the treaty? The…

I do not get paid to post to Hacker News. That would be a fun job... but alas I am not that lucky. Why do you think my post was fearmongering, specifically? As per the implication that corporations stand a lot to gain from the TPP - you'll see in my post I've said precisely the same thing. I would agree that there is a trend in the direction of corporate sovereignty - another large trend in this direction is what Bru…

It's in the US interest, but it can't be in the non-US interest then.

There's always another party to contracts like that. And one side is always getting screwed when the US is involved.

Re: Go to Prison for File Sharing? That's What Hollywood Wants in the TPP Deal

#30

Post by chinathrow »

mercurial wrote: post #26
walterbell wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is a proposed US-EU equivalent of the Australia - Hong Kong arbitration panel for ISDS (Investor-State Dispute Settlement), http://www.computerworlduk.com/blogs/open-enterprise/ttip-up... "So what the European Commission is proposing with the dispute resolution chapter is how future clashes with the US over those key social constructs should be resolved. And the answer is: by a three-person arbitration panel. T…

AFAIK, the ISDS has been met with enough opposition that it has been essentially expunged from the treaty.

How do you know that for sure when the meetings are held in private?
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