Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Megaupload programmer goes to prison for one year

justice.gov

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

141–150 of 159 posts

Re: Megaupload programmer goes to prison for one year

#141

Post by tptacek »

jackjeff wrote: post #9

I really dislike the extra-territorial aspect of it. From what I understand the Netherlands copyright law is more lenient than the US law. For instance downloading copyrighted material was legal until very recently. So downloading something from Megaupload was hardly a crime there... http://www.zdnet.com/article/downloading-pirate-material-fin... So you could do something which is legal, or illegal but not criminal o…

The Netherlands has a criminal copyright infringement statute, and it appears to include --- in the criminal law part --- vicarious infringement.

Re: Megaupload programmer goes to prison for one year

#143

Post by tptacek »

tzs wrote: post #94
kaoD wrote: post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To be fair, Megaupload didn't explicitly condone copyright infringement, and if I recall correctly infringing files were removed. Are my memories flawed and Megaupload ignored the copyright infringement notices, or is Megaupload the fall guy to scare everyone else?

When Megaupload received notification of an illegal file, their action depended on the type of file. If it was child porn or terrorism propaganda, they deleted the file. If it was copyright infringement, they made the specific URL that was reported stop working, but retained the file, and all other links that referred to that file continued to work. Even making the specific URLs stop working was a sore spot with Dotc…

Megaupload also ran a monetary incentive scheme that ranked rewards for users based on the value of the content; discovery during the prosecution turned up emails from Megaupload employees overtly acknowledging copyrighted content and rewarding it with enhanced payouts.

Re: Megaupload programmer goes to prison for one year

#144

Post by bhayden »

pluma wrote: post #85

Sidenote: it's so weird the English language uses the same word "justice" for the legal system and the moral concept. In German for example the two are different, making it easy to explain to people how the legal system is about equal application of the law, not personal closure. The domain "justice.gov" just sounds like propaganda (imagine "freedom.gov") to me as a non-native speaker who mostly hears the term used i…

I'm an American, when I think "justice system" I think of justice not on a personal level, but on a punishment level. Justice is having a punishment that fits the crime. If someone wanted personal justice, I think they usually qualify it with "personal" before "justice".

Re: Megaupload programmer goes to prison for one year

#145

Post by bhayden »

Tharkun wrote: post #40
Fuxy wrote: post #7

There's a lot of lip service but I still don't get why a programmer need to go to jail for this crap. Are they prosecuting everyone that ever worked for or did business with megaupload now? Because that seems a bit shady.

Might as well jail every tobacco or arms producer as well.

Pretty sure if an arms dealer promoted, even indirectly, the use of their firearms for illegal purposes, they'd also get some people going through the justice system.

Re: Megaupload programmer goes to prison for one year

#146

Post by pluma »

mrottenkolber wrote: post #139
lucb1e wrote: post #116

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not sure which German words you are referring to, but as a Dutch person "justice.gov" sounds like propaganda to me too.

Die Gerechtigkeit und das Recht? Not sure but could be.

Gerechtigkeit (moral justice) and Justiz (the justice system). Recht is actually in a similar spot as justice: Recht can mean "law" (as in Rechtsstaat, "state of laws") or "right" (as in Menschenrechte, "human rights").

Re: Megaupload programmer goes to prison for one year

#147

Post by pluma »

bhayden wrote: post #144
pluma wrote: post #85

Sidenote: it's so weird the English language uses the same word "justice" for the legal system and the moral concept. In German for example the two are different, making it easy to explain to people how the legal system is about equal application of the law, not personal closure. The domain "justice.gov" just sounds like propaganda (imagine "freedom.gov") to me as a non-native speaker who mostly hears the term used i…

I'm an American, when I think "justice system" I think of justice not on a personal level, but on a punishment level. Justice is having a punishment that fits the crime. If someone wanted personal justice, I think they usually qualify it with "personal" before "justice".

Interesting. I don't think of the justice system as concerning punishment at all. The primary functions to me are rehabilitation and prevention (via incapacitation).

Even though my view certainly isn't representative, it seems to me that American culture is far more concerned with punishment or retribution than rehabilitation than we are in Germany. Sure, we have tabloids calling for "severe punishments" as well, but in general the system seems to be far more concerned with protecting the public (and maybe converting the criminal to a law-abiding citizen in the process).

Re: Megaupload programmer goes to prison for one year

#148

Post by ptaipale »

mrottenkolber wrote: post #139
lucb1e wrote: post #116

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not sure which German words you are referring to, but as a Dutch person "justice.gov" sounds like propaganda to me too.

Die Gerechtigkeit und das Recht? Not sure but could be.

Or perhaps die Gerechtigkeit und die Justiz.

But I must say that in my ear, "Department of Corrections" sounds perhaps even more like propaganda, or doublespeak...

Re: Megaupload programmer goes to prison for one year

#149

Post by bhayden »

pluma wrote: post #147
bhayden wrote: post #144

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm an American, when I think "justice system" I think of justice not on a personal level, but on a punishment level. Justice is having a punishment that fits the crime. If someone wanted personal justice, I think they usually qualify it with "personal" before "justice".

Interesting. I don't think of the justice system as concerning punishment at all. The primary functions to me are rehabilitation and prevention (via incapacitation). Even though my view certainly isn't representative, it seems to me that American culture is far more concerned with punishment or retribution than rehabilitation than we are in Germany. Sure, we have tabloids calling for "severe punishments" as well, but…

The prison system in the US is designed to create repeat offenders. This is because we have a lot of for-profit prisons that benefit from repeat offenders. There is no rehabilitation going on, I assure you. Quite the opposite is true.

Re: Megaupload programmer goes to prison for one year

#150

Post by pluma »

hellbanner wrote: post #125
tinco wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

He would not be allowed to plead guilty in The Netherlands, as The Netherlands is not charging him. The extradition hearing is about whether he will be extradited after being sentenced. So it would go like this: US says you are guilty, 25 years in jail for computer hacking and mass copyright infringement. US sends warrant for your extradition to The Netherlands. The Netherlands arrests you but allows you to go to exp…

No, why wouldn't they at least give it a shot? Is there collusion between NL hearing courts & US prosecution?

Basically, in order to make a case against being extradited, you'd have to convince the court that you wouldn't be given a fair trial in the country making the request.

His problem wasn't that he wouldn't receive a fair trial, his problem was that the laws themselves are silly (but not obviously immoral or excessive). If he had faced a corporeal punishment (death penalty or mutilation), he might have had a case.

Of course the ideal path would have been facing the hearing and then pleading guilty when he was extradited, but the plea bargain likely required him not to challenging the extradition and his chances for successfully doing so were likely far too low to take the gamble.

Post reply on HN