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How One Stupid Tweet Blew Up Justine Sacco’s Life

nytimes.com

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Re: How One Stupid Tweet Blew Up Justine Sacco’s Life

#591

Post by tomjen3 »

sillysaurus3 wrote: post #245
kristofferR wrote: post #237

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"MRA is short for Men's Rights Activist. MRAs argue that, as human beings, men should have human rights, due process in legal matters, and should not be subject to "reverse discrimination" in favor of other groups. MRAs typically point to men's lower life expectancy in almost every country, higher rates of incarceration, more severe penalties for similar offenses, lower rates of health care spending and health resear…

So how does any of that make you a loser? What's going on in this thread? As far as I can tell it's nothing more than a similar type of bullying the article is itself is talking about, which I didn't ever expect to see on HN, let alone tolerated. At what point can you no longer express controversial opinions without being called a loser?

It doesn't make MRA losers. If it did there would be no reason to tack the word loser on. Being an mean, agressive alcoholic bum implies being a loser so you don't often see loser tacked on.

Re: How One Stupid Tweet Blew Up Justine Sacco’s Life

#592

Post by tomjen3 »

Futurebot wrote: post #234
potatolicious wrote: post #168

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I... what? Hold your horses, there's an awful lot of projection here. I haven't come in here to defend internet lynch mobs - there's literally not a word in my post condoning it. The bulk of tech progressive aren't the ones spoiling for a Twitter fight, they're the silent majority that's reading posts on HN, rolling their eyes, maybe sighing a little bit, and moving along with their lives. They're not orchestrating b…

I see a lot of what you're saying happening, and subjectively, it has gotten worse. One interesting thing is that I see this popping up in comment sections and forums far removed from HN - neo-monarchists, redpillers, neo-objectivists, and their loosely related ideological ilk have spread far and wide. At the same time, the ILM does seem out of control, both on the SJW and anti-SJW sides. The Internet has become an e…

>neo-monarchists, redpillers, neo-objectivists, and their loosely related ideological ilk have spread far and wide

Those are widely different viewpoints who have more in common with mainstream viewpoints than with each other - it is dishonest to label them together, please don't do so.

Re: How One Stupid Tweet Blew Up Justine Sacco’s Life

#593

Post by Futurebot »

tomjen3 wrote: post #592
Futurebot wrote: post #234

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I see a lot of what you're saying happening, and subjectively, it has gotten worse. One interesting thing is that I see this popping up in comment sections and forums far removed from HN - neo-monarchists, redpillers, neo-objectivists, and their loosely related ideological ilk have spread far and wide. At the same time, the ILM does seem out of control, both on the SJW and anti-SJW sides. The Internet has become an e…

>neo-monarchists, redpillers, neo-objectivists, and their loosely related ideological ilk have spread far and wide Those are widely different viewpoints who have more in common with mainstream viewpoints than with each other - it is dishonest to label them together, please don't do so.

Maybe you don't agree, but there's overlap and ideological cross-breeding in today's versions of these movements: http://boingboing.net/2015/01/28/a-beginners-guide-to-the-re...

I'm fully aware of where and how they differ, and I'm aware of the strident disagreements both within and between - but to deny an overlap today I think is misguided.

Re: How One Stupid Tweet Blew Up Justine Sacco’s Life

#594

Post by veb »

chris_wot wrote: post #508
pariya wrote: post #395

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You are not your mistakes, and there is a natural human margin of error. Mistakes make us human and it's what every single one of us has in common. You seem to be a super bright guy who experienced a momentary lapse in judgement fuelled by emotion. We all do this, it's just not always public. Also- I don't know how old you were at the time this story occurred but according to neuroscience, the frontal lobe doesn't de…

Thanks - I've tried :-) I've been pretty open in that situations probably get exacerbated for me because I have a mental illness - anxiety, depression and adult ADD (I refuse to call it ADHD, I'm not hyperactive!). I manage these better now, but it still leaks into my life. I'm extremely lucky I have a supportive wife and two small children who keep my mind off things and let me focus on what's important :-) I really…

Chris, if I can be of some help... Hyper-activeness in children can be a sign of ADHD, but in adults it's not entirely true.

If you don't mind me posting this Wikipedia link: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adult_attention_deficit_hyperac... you may find some answers there.

>Adults with ADHD are often perceived by others as chaotic and disorganized, with a tendency to need high stimulation to be less distracted and function effectively. Additionally, many adults suffer from associated or "co-morbid" psychiatric conditions such as depression or anxiety.[13]

>Symptoms of ADHD can vary widely between individuals and throughout the lifetime of an individual. As the neurobiology of ADHD is becoming increasingly understood, it is becoming evident that difficulties exhibited by individuals with ADHD are due to problems with the parts of the brain responsible for executive functions (see below: Pathophysiology). These result in problems with sustaining attention, planning, organizing, prioritizing, and impulsive thinking/decision making.

Hope I'm being useful -- a close family member was in the same boat. I was able to help, because it was me who randomly saw someone talking about this on an HN comment and I dived further into the world of ADHD and found out that it may not be 'classical' depression, but depression caused by something else. Since then, there's been complete emotional stability, rational decision making and depression is controlled completely.

Lastly, Chris... what you did I think was not a bad judgement call at all. In my mind you were making something right, and fixing a wrong because that was the only tool available to you. Debating something just takes forever and some things need to be fixed there and then. What happened to you, is simply disgusting. I am sorry for that, and I hope you can look back on it as a good memory and not a bad memory (which is tough).

I ran a massive community as the real admin, but the same sort of thing happened to me as well. Been years since I left but it's still sore to think about.

Hope all is well man. :)

Re: How One Stupid Tweet Blew Up Justine Sacco’s Life

#595

Post by wutbrodo »

swang wrote: post #589
wutbrodo wrote: post #582

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Note to hopefully avoid unproductive tangents: all the views I use as examples here say nothing about how I feel about these issues, they're just examples of how _society_ feels and may feel about certain things (which is what is relevant). > If you're against same-sex marriage you're probably on the wrong side of history. The problem I have with this is that it condemns the vast majority of society, throughout the v…

I don't necessarily really agree with your statement that a majority of society was opposed to gay marriage in 2008. But I think it is a valid point to say that what happened near 6-7 years ago should not necessarily count against you in the present. _BUT_ (and I'm largely paraphrasing) when asked about this issue and same-sex marriage, Eich pretty much sidestepped the question and refused to answer it, citing how he…

> I don't necessarily really agree with your statement that a majority of society was opposed to gay marriage in 2008.

I actually thought this was the least controversial part of my comment. This isn't just my anecdotal opinion, it's pretty well supported by polls if I'm not mistaken. Do you mind if I ask on what basis you think the opposite is true?

> when asked about this issue and same-sex marriage, Eich pretty much sidestepped the question and refused to answer it, citing how he has never discriminating against anyone. And to a lot of people that wasn't good enough of a response coming from a CEO of a company that prides itself on its diversity, especially when they also have gay employees.

This is a more compelling point actually. On the other hand, it's easy for me to imagine that he just (like me) failed to comprehend the level of lunacy he was facing and figured the best way to handle a manufactured controversy was to not give it more attention than necessary. On top of that, I feel like I'd also be much more morally inclined to emphasize that political views are irrelevant, rather than pander by saying "oh I've completely changed forever" and implicitly approving of the intolerance implied by political litmus tests (regardless of your location on the political spectrum).

> I also doubt Eich got called a whore, bitch, slut, etc much. And to say Eich was "bullied" in the way Sacco was bullied is laughable

As you said, it wasn't me who compared them. That being said, I don't think using the term "bullied" for either person is particularly unwarranted though.

Re: How One Stupid Tweet Blew Up Justine Sacco’s Life

#596

Post by tomjen3 »

Futurebot wrote: post #593
tomjen3 wrote: post #592

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>neo-monarchists, redpillers, neo-objectivists, and their loosely related ideological ilk have spread far and wide Those are widely different viewpoints who have more in common with mainstream viewpoints than with each other - it is dishonest to label them together, please don't do so.

Maybe you don't agree, but there's overlap and ideological cross-breeding in today's versions of these movements: http://boingboing.net/2015/01/28/a-beginners-guide-to-the-re... I'm fully aware of where and how they differ, and I'm aware of the strident disagreements both within and between - but to deny an overlap today I think is misguided.

That is a slander piece. If you are going to come up with a source then at a mimimum I expect the author to know the http://slatestarcodex.com/2013/10/20/the-anti-reactionary-fa... and be able to tell me with a straight face that that is what those who (like me) believe fathers should have better custody rights.

Oh and how PUAs and MRA are part of the same moment when PUAs look down on MRAs, how PUAs want a class of alphas with more social responsibility like the NR.

To me your argument only works if you adopt a you are either with us or against humanity attitude for political correctness and associated belief with _is_ inline with what many SJW think.

I will give you this much: about the only thing these people you have grouped together do agree on is that feminism and modern leftism has gone a little too far: but since they do not agree on how much (wiz MRA wanting more custody rights to NR wanting James of Stuart as king) nor what to do about it they in fact have more in-group and out-group variance.

Of course the fact that they disagree at all is enough for some (such as the author of that hit piece) to wrap them all together, we should be above such simple mindedness here on hacker news.

Edit: removed unecessary and counterproductive anger, added call to unity.

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