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Fuck It, I'm Going Back to Firefox

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Re: Fuck It, I'm Going Back to Firefox

#631
post #566

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How do you see which tab is which? (I gave up on Chrome about 20 months ago for Firefox's superior tab handling, better stability, and being less of a resource hog. Oh, and for not spying on me.)

Not GP, but: multiple windows and intuition. Generally, for ~20 tabs per window I still can tell pretty okay what is what, only large swabs of similar tabs (e.g. 10 ebay product sites) are a bit annoying. A tab switcher that shows the headlines would admittedly be helpful.

In Firefox, I either scroll quickly though readable tabs with the mouse-wheel, or click the right down-arrow for a text list of tabs, or start typing in the address bar of whichever tab I'm in. For example, if I type twi then the drop-down list offers Twitter, and I select "Switch to tab". That gets me to the half-dozen tabs I want to look at several times a day.

With those options plus tab groups, I find it pretty easy to handle several hundred tabs in Firefox, where Chrome was a nightmare. The drawback is that you just keep adding tabs ;-)

Re: Fuck It, I'm Going Back to Firefox

#632

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Who said the browser has to report everything you do online to be of value. I don't claim to know anything about how Chrome works, so could be completely wrong in this, but my sense is that it is part of a broader desire to tie together tracking across all devices. Cracking that nut is very difficult from an analytics perspective, and having people logged in to Chrome across all devices provides a very convenient GUI…

> Again, I don't know what data Chrome makes available to Google's ad services, so please tell me if I am in fact incorrect here. If you read the very detailed Chrome privacy policy ( https://www.google.co.uk/chrome/browser/privacy/ ), you will see that it does nothing different to other browsers here (each server sees your IP address, cookies, etc). It does not send any form of uniquely identifiable ID with every re…

I have read it, and respectfully disagree that it sufficiently addresses my very specific point.

I see a section in the link you provided that reads:

> "Chrome OS may send a non-unique promotional tag to Google periodically (including during initial setup) and when performing searches with Google."

Sure Chrome may not be sending a GUID with every request. That wasn't my point. To clarify, my point was that Google has a GUID (your Google account, and likely other forms of ID) that identify you pretty clearly across devices/Chrome instances. I saw nothing in the policy you linked that said Google AdSense and other Google ad services (DoubleClick tags, GA, etc.) do not use that information to link identities across devices for purposes of tracking.

The AdWords and GA teams have rolled out significant advances in cross-device tracking over the past year or two, including new metrics and reports in the respective platforms. It seems pretty obvious to me that this is a data point that is factored into making that link.

But again, I'd love to be proven wrong if I missed a section of your link that explicitly says otherwise.

Re: Fuck It, I'm Going Back to Firefox

#633
post #198

> Remember when we all switched from Firefox to Chrome? I remember the hype, but I never switched. Firefox was always good enough for me. And really, Firefox overtook Chrome in performance a while ago already. And naturally Mozilla's manifesto is way better to support than Eric Schmidt's "you don't need privacy if you have nothing to hide" idea.

Firefox gets nearly $1mn/day from Google...they're using your browsing history to target new tab page ads to you...they're not a good choice if you care about privacy. They have, though, pressured Yahoo to do some good stuff -- they have zero leverage over google, in fact google has tons of leverage over them. Try the Epic Privacy Browser if you care about privacy!

As others said, their contract with Google is over - now they use Yahoo (and some others) which you can easily switch to DuckDuckGo if you want. And also you can switch off new tab ads trivially.

Re: Fuck It, I'm Going Back to Firefox

#634

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Again, I don't know what data Chrome makes available to Google's ad services, so please tell me if I am in fact incorrect here. If you read the very detailed Chrome privacy policy ( https://www.google.co.uk/chrome/browser/privacy/ ), you will see that it does nothing different to other browsers here (each server sees your IP address, cookies, etc). It does not send any form of uniquely identifiable ID with every re…

I have read it, and respectfully disagree that it sufficiently addresses my very specific point. I see a section in the link you provided that reads: > "Chrome OS may send a non-unique promotional tag to Google periodically (including during initial setup) and when performing searches with Google." Sure Chrome may not be sending a GUID with every request. That wasn't my point. To clarify, my point was that Google has…

That bit is about Chrome OS (ie, a chromebook), not Chrome itself. The bit about it being "non-unique" means it's not a GUID - other people's devices will send the same tag. It does not identify you.

> To clarify, my point was that Google has a GUID (your Google account, and likely other forms of ID) that identify you pretty clearly across devices/Chrome instances.

I think the privacy policy is quite clear that Chrome does nothing here that other browsers don't do. Obviously if you have a Google cookie from signing in to the website then that's going to identify you pretty clearly, but that's just how cookies work, and would be exactly the same in any other browser. I'd like to specifically direct your attention to the first three paragraphs of the policy, and in particular:

"If you use Chrome to access other Google services, such as using the search engine on the Google homepage or checking Gmail, the fact that you are using Chrome does not mean that Google will receive any special or additional personally identifiable information about you."

> I saw nothing in the policy you linked that said Google AdSense and other Google ad services (DoubleClick tags, GA, etc.) do not use that information to link identities across devices for purposes of tracking.

I wouldn't expect to find any information about how AdSense works in the Chrome policy. The privacy policy for ads is over here and discusses this topic: http://www.google.co.uk/policies/technologies/ads/

Re: Fuck It, I'm Going Back to Firefox

#635

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because maintaining a large catalogue of bookmarks is a nightmare; good luck finding anything unless you are incredibly meticulous about organizing them. In addition, I think it's a spatial locality thing. I find that I'm a lot more likely to come back to an article/page/etc. if it's still open than I am to remember that I bookmarked it and wanted to come back later.

I just had to look up how to do it, but in Firefox you can search bookmarks from the url bar by starting off with a * and a space. (I'm glad I looked it up, this makes me more inclined to make bookmarks without sorting or tagging them)

I Firefox with Vimperator they're included in URL search as you start entering URLs. Based on either the URL or the page title / bookmark description.

This ... is exceptionally powerful.

Re: Fuck It, I'm Going Back to Firefox

#636

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's an excellent question, and one I started asking myself about a year ago. My conclusion: it's a lousy band-aid over poor browser document and state management. https://www.reddit.com/r/dredmorbius/comments/256lxu/tabbed_... If I had a _better_ way of keeping track of what it is I'm currently accessing (or interested in accessing) than tabs, I'd use them. A key problem is that browsers are keeping _every last ta…

I've never been to your subreddit before, but now I think I've found a blog I'll be keeping/catching up with for the next few weeks. I agree with you in general. A while ago I tried thinking of some other paradigm to keep track of webpages I might want to get back to in the near future without the permanence of bookmarks. Some of my thoughts: Web browsers are used for multiple activities that have their own "stack" i…

...I've found a blog I'll be keeping/catching up with...

Thanks :)

Web browsers are used for multiple activities...

Something I've concluded Web browser developers put insufficient thought into. They're also far too often optimizing for content providers and advertisers rather than readers.

...a whole set of tabs ... related to a general activity...

Quite. And I'll often have multiple projects going on, each with their own set of related references.

The failure of the Desktop (and GUI) paradigms in general to reflect this is a growing and tremendous frustration of mine. Our activities are organized and grouped by application and increasingly by Web silo rather than by task. It's where the UNIX shell philosophy is increadibly powerful, and the abilty to both create different "workspaces" (generally: directories) for projects, and to string data through commands and pipelines, is phenomenally useful.

Just to highlight a frustration: increasingly desktop tools are utilizing Web tools for documentation. I arrange my work by Workspace. So when I fire off the Help command in a particular utility ... a browser tab opens somewhere three workspaces away, that I'm not aware of. Often in the midst of a bunch of other unrelated tabs....

For example...

Excellent use cases, and while my own work differs in details, the general outline is the same: different tasks, often persisting across days, weeks, months, or even years, but alternating with time, which I wish to group. Often quite complex and involving many related sites and/or pages. And retaining that user state is at an extreme premium.

Bookmarks don't cut it for me in this regard....

I'm leaning toward a middle ground between Bookmarks, History, and some level of annotation. Readability is an interesting experiment but ultimately frustrating and limiting.

My own curated lists of stuff are somewhat useful but extremely tedious to create. My subreddit is as much a bookmarking tool (of both Websites / references, and my own thoughts) as it is a publication and discussion.

The ability to create and readily access sets of bookmarks, tag and tab them, filter them usefully (by tag, author, site, dates, etc.) would be tremendously useful.

I'd really love a browser feature which let me search for text within pages I'd recently visited (hour, day, week, month, ...). Often what I'm looking for is something I've already recently visited.

It is* possible to organize Bookmarks hierarchically, etc. But I find that the UI/UX for doing this in numerous browsers is simply tedious beyond description.

...some combination of tab pinning, tab groups and tree style tabs, and tab suspension/delayed loading...

Yes to all of this.

For Pinning, I'd prefer to simply break out Web Apps as their own local app instance. Not associated with a browser at all. While Web-as-App-delivery is interesting, it's ultimately highly frustrating in my experience. A neither-man-nor-beast experience.

Tab groups...

I'll need to play with that.

Tree Style Tabs...

I use and love the plugin (for Firefox), and use it much as you do Tab Groups from what I can tell.

...tab stacking...

Not familiar with that.

...delayed loading of tabs...

Genius.

1. Memory management/unloading of old tabs

2. Tab group classification or tagging

4. Open the browser to the tab overview page

A-fucking-men to all of this. Your point that there is no overview page for tabs, or similarly that there is not way to perform group operations on tabs, is another massive failing.

Re: Fuck It, I'm Going Back to Firefox

#637
post #21

The reliability of Firefox's post-crash 'session restore' is what made me stick with it for good over Chrome. Life of a power tabber.

At one point, the post-crash session restore on Firefox actually single handedly made me move to Chrome. Another reason was the fact that I needed to kill its process because the UI became unresponsive. Chrome was fresh and snappy, not a fair comparison at that point but it was definitely fast. I never wanted to switch away from Firefox but I felt like I had to because it had become unusable. I've switched back to Firefox since and all the previous problems were gone. It's been very reliable and if it did crash (which can still happen like with all software) it would restore my tabs just fine. I just like it better than I ever did Chrome and I certainly like the organization behind Firefox better than that behind Chrome. :)

Re: Fuck It, I'm Going Back to Firefox

#638

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I just had to look up how to do it, but in Firefox you can search bookmarks from the url bar by starting off with a * and a space. (I'm glad I looked it up, this makes me more inclined to make bookmarks without sorting or tagging them)

I Firefox with Vimperator they're included in URL search as you start entering URLs. Based on either the URL or the page title / bookmark description. This ... is exceptionally powerful.

Yeah, bookmarks are included like that with the standard search bar too, but I keep a lot of history so they don't really stand out.

Re: Fuck It, I'm Going Back to Firefox

#639

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, as one piece of anecdotal evidence: I only use one browser extension (Vimium on Chrome, VimFx on Firefox) and still find Firefox significantly faster than Chrome. Also, I like using the same browser on my Android tablet as on my laptop and websites that use MathJax render incorrectly on Android Chrome (these sites render perfectly well on Android Firefox and on both desktop Firefox and desktop Chrome). So I'd p…

There is a Vimium equivalent for Firefox?! I'm sold!

You're kidding right? Vimperator and the much better fork Pentadactyl have been around for years on Firefox, and implement everything Vimium does and more, in a much more reliable way. Every single control interface is available, and scriptable in Pentadactyl.

Vimium isn't even the best vimperator clone for Chrome - cVim has now taken that crown by a very large margin, and is worlds better in terms of features, configuration and reliability.

Re: Fuck It, I'm Going Back to Firefox

#640
post #552

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Tree Style Tabs looks like it has a potential to allow querying HTML via SQL. I have been thinking about this for a while. I do not have a concrete idea for an application, but it would be cool to retrieve titles of all open sites in certain group/tree. Almost like some sort of scraper.

Vimperator has fuzzy matching on tab titles if you press "b": https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/spa/quq37nq1583x0lf/sr732e...

Yep, this is worlds faster for me than mousing over and clicking on tabs.

Is vimperator still actively developed and compatible with the latest Firefox? I switched over to the fork, Pentadactyl some years ago.

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