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A Russian TV Insider Describes a Modern Propaganda Machine

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Re: A Russian TV Insider Describes a Modern Propaganda Machine

#71

Post by pluma »

lispm wrote: post #31
rational-future wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're funny as well :) RT, BBC, Al Jazeera are official state propaganda machines, but that doesn't mean ALL they say is propaganda. As a matter of personal opinion on many subjects (not directly connected with the Russian government) RT is more honest than the big international media outlets (that cant afford to alienate the western governments, big advertisers or powerful interest groups).

RT is pure propaganda. We have now a German program by RT. Website: http://www.rtdeutsch.com Straight from Putin's mouth...

Sometimes all you need to do to create propaganda is just show some unpopular facts in isolation.

Sure, they're biased, but that doesn't mean they are always outright lying -- at least not more than American media.

The idea of a unbiased news is a pipedream. I'm fully aware that German public television was intentionally created in a way that would supposedly protect it from the government's influence, but that doesn't mean they succeeded.

The "Lügenpresse" chants are asinine, of course. It's not anyone's fault media isn't trustworthy, we were just wrong to think that it could ever be made to be unbiased, considering how biased the source material always is.

I think the only safe way to consume information is to keep its origin in mind. I distrust RT and CNN equally -- but if they both share the same details in a story, there's likely some truth to it.

Re: A Russian TV Insider Describes a Modern Propaganda Machine

#72

Post by bayesianhorse »

mc32 wrote: post #53
ptaipale wrote: post #47

Regarding Russia's foreign propaganda, a Russian-born person (I think he may not wish to be named) described the situation like this: " Many have wondered why the Russian propaganda machine is spewing out a torrent of such preposterous claims that few people take seriously. They know it will not be believed abroad. The purpose is not that it is believed. The purpose of disinformation was is to destroy trust in all me…

That is their greatest achievement, to gain equivalency. To a good degree this has worked. There are lots of people who believe major European and NorthAmerican media are no better than Russian media. It has worked for their domestic audience, to great effect, and to a good degree internationally. Just look at Putin's approval ratings.

I don't really believe Putin's approval ratings. In Russia there is no free press and private companies or academic institutes can be controlled at will by the executive branch. So if any institute or private company conducts a poll... well...

Re: A Russian TV Insider Describes a Modern Propaganda Machine

#73

Post by bayesianhorse »

imissmyjuno wrote: post #28
DangerousPie wrote: post #21

The headline sounds very interesting but I was actually quite disappointed by the article itself. It doesn't offer any concrete examples or any attempt to actually validate what this guy is saying. It also doesn't even attempt to compare this to what the media landscape looks like in other countries. If all that happened was that a "prominent news anchor reviewed the coming events as if they were part of a film scrip…

I find it amusing that an article that's supposed to criticize a controlled media system is itself a thinly veiled advertisement. I guess mass media has issues everywhere you look :)

Plugging a book is hardly an issue comparable to for example 200 murdered journalists...

Re: A Russian TV Insider Describes a Modern Propaganda Machine

#74

Post by bayesianhorse »

A_COMPUTER wrote: post #34
bayesianhorse wrote: post #9

Funny story: In Germany there is currently a "movement" of people calling for stricter immigration control (to abbreviate an endless discussion about what they actually want), called Pegida. During one of their demonstrations a comedy/satire show dressed up an actor as a "Russian" journalist from "Russia Today", a news caster/online magazine financed by the Russian state. The Pegida participants were very willing to…

They're on to something, but they don't know the whole picture. Which is that in a world where mass media is under the control of one superpower or another, you are only going to hear painful criticism of your own government from the opposing superpower's media arm. What I find just as painful as you about your countrymen's opinion of RT, is that people in my country will criticize RT as propaganda and then comically…

I hear tons of criticism from major media against both the US and German government, from both US and German media. You don't hear the kreml being criticized in Russian media though...

Re: A Russian TV Insider Describes a Modern Propaganda Machine

#75

Post by ptaipale »

MisterWebz wrote: post #67
ptaipale wrote: post #47

Regarding Russia's foreign propaganda, a Russian-born person (I think he may not wish to be named) described the situation like this: " Many have wondered why the Russian propaganda machine is spewing out a torrent of such preposterous claims that few people take seriously. They know it will not be believed abroad. The purpose is not that it is believed. The purpose of disinformation was is to destroy trust in all me…

Thank you for letting me realize the reason I distrust most media outlets is because I've been brainwashed by Russian propaganda.

No, it's probably not the reason. But that you distrust is in the best interests of Russian leadership.

Re: A Russian TV Insider Describes a Modern Propaganda Machine

#76

Post by mc32 »

bayesianhorse wrote: post #72
mc32 wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That is their greatest achievement, to gain equivalency. To a good degree this has worked. There are lots of people who believe major European and NorthAmerican media are no better than Russian media. It has worked for their domestic audience, to great effect, and to a good degree internationally. Just look at Putin's approval ratings.

I don't really believe Putin's approval ratings. In Russia there is no free press and private companies or academic institutes can be controlled at will by the executive branch. So if any institute or private company conducts a poll... well...

I'm afraid I believe the role of the Emp(eror/ress)/Tsar(ina)/Premier/President in Russia is akin to the role of a Father-at-large. So basically, people know he's flawed, they're not innocent, afterall, but they feel protective of him. They take him personally. So an attack on him, by the media, by western institutions, are, indirectly an indictment on them. I think this has foundation in how the country has always had a strongman or strongwoman at the helm who have always projected their power unambiguously and forcefully. It has been this way since the Khievan Rus. People were for practical purposes enslaved serfs till 1917. And then it arguably got worse.

Re: A Russian TV Insider Describes a Modern Propaganda Machine

#77

Post by Mikeb85 »

bayesianhorse wrote: post #68
Mikeb85 wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Manufacturing_Consent We in the west are far more brainwashed than we think...

If you know you are brainwashed, you obviously know the "truth". So how come you know the truth but believe the truth isn't told? You see my point?

> If you know you are brainwashed, you obviously know the "truth".

We never really know the truth. I can tell you what I ate this morning, and I can tell you that the sky is blue (maybe blue-greyish today).

The point is that too many people believe what they see on CNN, and assume it's the absolute truth. People base their world view upon curated news without questioning anything.

Here's a great interview by Larry King on his Ora TV network (re-broadcast online by RT): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wv2f6ZZmx4A

In it, Stephen Cohen (the guest) makes the point that there's little debate in the western media these days. Either you agree, or you agree more. No one questions anything anymore.

Russians will tell you everything is a lie not because everything in Russia IS a lie (some things are, some aren't - much like over here), but because it's part of Russian culture, their outlook on the world, to be cynical and critical of everything.

One poster brought up that RT is trying to discredit everything, but that's not really correct. Russians question everything, it's a part of slavic culture, hell my 92 year old Ukrainian grandfather who's been here his whole life shares that outlook.

We in the west though have been transformed into gullible sheep, who question nothing we're told because we are comfortable working our 9-5 (more like 7-6) job to pay off our credit cards and debt, while watching shitty TV shows and never finding the motivation to ever learn about anything...

Re: A Russian TV Insider Describes a Modern Propaganda Machine

#78

Post by ptaipale »

bayesianhorse wrote: post #72
mc32 wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That is their greatest achievement, to gain equivalency. To a good degree this has worked. There are lots of people who believe major European and NorthAmerican media are no better than Russian media. It has worked for their domestic audience, to great effect, and to a good degree internationally. Just look at Putin's approval ratings.

I don't really believe Putin's approval ratings. In Russia there is no free press and private companies or academic institutes can be controlled at will by the executive branch. So if any institute or private company conducts a poll... well...

I don't believe the exact ratings either, but I do not doubt that an honest poll would reveal a very strong support for Putin. There is a deep trauma in Russia about the disorder and weakness of 1990's, and Putin, for good or bad, took Russia out of it.

Re: A Russian TV Insider Describes a Modern Propaganda Machine

#79

Post by bayesianhorse »

kingmanaz wrote: post #55
bayesianhorse wrote: post #9

Funny story: In Germany there is currently a "movement" of people calling for stricter immigration control (to abbreviate an endless discussion about what they actually want), called Pegida. During one of their demonstrations a comedy/satire show dressed up an actor as a "Russian" journalist from "Russia Today", a news caster/online magazine financed by the Russian state. The Pegida participants were very willing to…

"The Pegida participants were very willing to talk to him. They said that western media is all corrupt and unfree, and that Russia Today is a "welcome" and more honest alternative." And how are any of the the above concerns baseless? Media cartels, whether Western or otherwise, are organized in a hierarchy, wherein editors review and cull the content of their subordinate journalists. Such an arrangement results in a…

If you say stupid things, then that is your right. But if I then say that I think you are stupid, that is also my right.

What you don't seem to understand is that our media is "controlled" by a free market. There are tons of online magazines which share your world view. The audience can choose these outlets. If news media with these world views were popular enough, they would get their own TV channels, and the money from advertising and subscription would enable them to reach even more people. But they suck. The vast majority disagrees with their views, "logic" and "solutions". That's why they are called "fringe" media.

Re: A Russian TV Insider Describes a Modern Propaganda Machine

#80

Post by guard-of-terra »

deepyearning wrote: post #64
bayesianhorse wrote: post #9

Funny story: In Germany there is currently a "movement" of people calling for stricter immigration control (to abbreviate an endless discussion about what they actually want), called Pegida. During one of their demonstrations a comedy/satire show dressed up an actor as a "Russian" journalist from "Russia Today", a news caster/online magazine financed by the Russian state. The Pegida participants were very willing to…

Actually this shows the opposite. The mainstream media is unwilling to engage in discussion with someone who is anti-immigration (unless that person is is an Israeli politician). Instead they do cheap tricks to humiliate the speaker without addressing their actual arguments. The mainstream media, like all people, has the accusation of "racism" hanging over their heads so they are unable to speak freely on topics like…

In Russia immigration is a hot topic too, and internal Russian press is virtually not allowed to express opinions about limiting immigration just as well.
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