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Restoring the Old Way of Warming: Heating People, Not Places

lowtechmagazine.com

81–90 of 99 posts

Re: Restoring the Old Way of Warming: Heating People, Not Places

#81

I find it interesting that they continually use the past tense in the article. While it is true that the west has largely abandoned these ideas, they are still very strong in the more temperate climates of Asia. I live in Shizuoka prefecture in Japan. It does not get very cold here compared to my home town of Winnipeg, Canada. On the very coldest days it might just dip below freezing at night. While some people heat…

Man! How long does it take to get used to temperatures like that? As someone who grew up in California, I simply can't stand cold houses. If a house is anything but warm in the winter — let alone 5°C — I get depressed and miserable and completely lose my concentration. My home gets stripped of its homeyness and I feel completely hostage to the environment.

Re: Restoring the Old Way of Warming: Heating People, Not Places

#82
post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In the UK we have plenty of old houses where there is no central heating, double glazing, loft insulation or fitted carpet. Typically the windows are wood framed 'sash' windows with the walls made from quite thick stone (1 - 4+ ft thick). Heating might be just the one fireplace with the kitchen cooker also there to warm the house up. I grew up in such a house and not once did I see mould. Typically such houses were b…

Indoor fires are a massive, massive health risk. They are a major cause of death in many countries where open fires are still the main heat source for cooking. Even closed fireplaces are an environmental hazard, but more for the surroundings. (I have a closed fireplace myself, got it installed about a year ago, I'm not some tree hugger - but the facts are clear on this one). The smothering of the fire is even worse.…

We had a chimney to take care of the smoke and the air draughted in was clean, 'country' air. There is also the matter of efficient burning, wet coal means a chimney lined with soot.

The fire was also a 'dustbin' of sorts, you could incinerate anything if you wanted. But plastics would give off dioxins etc. but there would be no smell from chucking a plastic bag on the fire unless the fire was dying out.

Thinking of others though...

We made our towns and cities 'smokeless zones' many aeons ago due to the soot making buildings black and 'pea-soupers'. Ironically the first smokeless zone in the UK was in the street next to the factory that made 'smokeless coal'. Needless to say the 'smokeless coal' factory was a massive polluter.

Re: Restoring the Old Way of Warming: Heating People, Not Places

#83
post #78
post #73

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They look like they start at around $1000+, which means you are looking at about 1 year before it pays itself off. Based on my estimated heating bill anyway. Additionally the biggest problem I find when turning off the heating in winter is hands and feet. You can wear gloves but then you can't type.

I like fingerless gloves (or get cheap ones and cut the tips off), but I also know people who feel hindered by them.

I do too but endlessly explaining to colleagues\friends why I'm wearing "homeless" gloves is tiresome. I don't know why people fail to see their utility, and indeed forget the explanation after a week and ask me again :-/

Re: Restoring the Old Way of Warming: Heating People, Not Places

#84
post #6

As others pointed out, this older style is more suitable for masonry homes which might be less susceptible to mold and have enough thermal inertia to prevent pipe freezing. On the flip side, you can make your house air-tight and use a heat exchanger to refresh the air while retaining the heat: that's the concept of Passive Houses[0]. Not suitable for cooling down hot & humid air (you'd have a condensation problem) bu…

There's a section there that talks about hot climates - you use an energy recovery ventilation system instead of heat recovery.

Re: Restoring the Old Way of Warming: Heating People, Not Places

#85

At least in Japan and most parts of China, houses are poorly insulated and heating is often from aircon, which means if you want to stay warm, you wear thick clothes inside, sit under a heated blanket and what not. This sucks. Your nose and hands are still cold. If you want to move from the blanket its cold. I don't see anything that really addresses this. Yeah, the insulated chair is nice when you sit on it, but wha…

I'm currently living like that in Japan. In fact I'm writing this sitting in a Kotatsu. Last week it once got 6C in the apartment. We use a DeLonghi oven, a small heater and a Kotatsu whenever we need a place to get warm. With the Kotatsu we were able to get the bill from 120$/m down to 80$/m. I have to say, one can get used to it - the constant change in temperature keeps up the blood flow and I feel a lot stronger…

Wow, that looks awesome! I'm in Canada, and one of the worst things for me is having cold feet around the house. Happens no matter what I do. Heavy socks, slippers, doesn't matter. A Kotatsu looks like the perfect solution!

Re: Restoring the Old Way of Warming: Heating People, Not Places

#86

Down here in Australia central heating is (also) not very common, and at least around Melbourne it can dip to freezing or below throughout July and August. Generally only one room of the house is heated (often the room with the air conditioner on heat setting). Beds have electric blankets or hot water bottles, and otherwise you wear several layers if you want to be warm elsewhere. The curious thing is that gas is pre…

I think it's crazy how badly we insulate our houses in Australia. I live in Brisbane, and many houses just aren't insulated at all, like old Queenslanders [1] that just let the wind blow through underneath the floorboards and in through cracks in the walls, and even new-builds hardly have any... You'd think it never gets cold here, but it really does for a couple of months at least... What you end up with is houses that cost craploads to heat or cool and just have generally terrible thermal performance.

Sydney and Melbourne (that have colder winters) aren't much better...

I hope to build a house eventually, and fully intend to pack it with insulation, air-seal it as much as possible, use all double-glazed windows, and then use an energy recovery ventilation system to stop condensation and mould problems and reduce the load on the heating/cooling system. From my research, it looks like even a small PV solar system on the roof should be enough to completely offset the heating and cooling costs and keep the entire building at a comfortable temperature.

1. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Queenslander_%28architecture%2...

Re: Restoring the Old Way of Warming: Heating People, Not Places

#87
post #40
post #3

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Depending on the exact climate/heating system, the energy saved might be enough to run a dehumidifier and still come out ahead. The dehumidifier will also raise the air temperature.

Recently, I've been wondering why we use exhaust fans in bathrooms and not dehumidifiers. I might be way off base here, but it seems like taking conditioned air that's a little moist and dumping it outside and replacing it with drier unconditioned air would be less efficient than just removing the moisture from the already-conditioned air. I imagine it isn't one of those things where it's "always cheaper to do X", bu…

Think about some of the other things that happen in the bathroom, and ask yourself whether you'd want that air recirculating in your house.

Re: Restoring the Old Way of Warming: Heating People, Not Places

#88
post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Indoor fires are a massive, massive health risk. They are a major cause of death in many countries where open fires are still the main heat source for cooking. Even closed fireplaces are an environmental hazard, but more for the surroundings. (I have a closed fireplace myself, got it installed about a year ago, I'm not some tree hugger - but the facts are clear on this one). The smothering of the fire is even worse.…

We had a chimney to take care of the smoke and the air draughted in was clean, 'country' air. There is also the matter of efficient burning, wet coal means a chimney lined with soot. The fire was also a 'dustbin' of sorts, you could incinerate anything if you wanted. But plastics would give off dioxins etc. but there would be no smell from chucking a plastic bag on the fire unless the fire was dying out. Thinking of…

Even with a chimney, an open fireplace is very dangerous because open fireplaces do not burn hot enough to burn cleanly. True, wet coal (and wet wood) make things even worse, but an open open fireplace with bone dry coal (or wood) still doesn't burn cleanly. Burning anything plastic, rubber etc. is still dangerous, even if you don't smell anything.

Closed fireplaces are a bit better but still dangerous, although (as you note) more outside the house than inside. Wood or coal smoke is as dangerous as car exhaust fumes, or worse, in terms of particulate matter, although of course in most urban areas there is more particulate matter from cars than there is from burning wood or coal. But measured levels of particulate matters in rooms with fireplaces are as high as right next to highways, and often people spend more time in those rooms than they do next to highways.

Anyway, lots of people grew up in houses that were heated with coal or wood fires and only a small part of them got cancer from it, and as I mentioned I had one installed last year because as they say 'it's easy to live to 100: just give up everything that makes it worth to live to 100'. It's just that this is one of my pet peeves to bring up to people (not saying you are one of those) who think they're doing the environment a favor by not burning gas but by burning wood - because hey, wood is 'renewable', right? It's quite strange that so few people know about the health impacts of fireplaces, the scientific literature is crystal clear on it yet I know of very few places where residential burning of wood is subject to regulation, let alone prohibited.

Re: Restoring the Old Way of Warming: Heating People, Not Places

#89
post #71

I remember seeing something about an idea to use individual wristbands that would give off electric impulses which would make you feel cooler or warmer. I believe some prototypes were being worked on. Wish I could recall the people / startup involved. Does it ring a bell for anyone?

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=6646074 http://www.wired.com/2013/10/an-ingenious-wristband-that-kee...

Thanks!

Re: Restoring the Old Way of Warming: Heating People, Not Places

#90
post #70

I remember seeing something about an idea to use individual wristbands that would give off electric impulses which would make you feel cooler or warmer. I believe some prototypes were being worked on. Wish I could recall the people / startup involved. Does it ring a bell for anyone?

http://slice.mit.edu/2013/11/05/wristify-thermal-comfort-via... and http://www.embrlabs.com/ ?

Thanks!
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