Why shouldn't investors and founders share the same equity as other employees? Investors can presumably adjust their valuation model accordingly.
Ask HN: Why is liquidation preference acceptable and prevalent?
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Re: Ask HN: Why is liquidation preference acceptable and prevalent?
#2Re: Ask HN: Why is liquidation preference acceptable and prevalent?
#3Now the counter argument would be that whether its a 0x or a 1x it's a loss for the VC, as they're in the game of getting a 100x. And the founder's 'win' is only a win relative to the general population, they also lost as they could have made so much more if things went right.
So 1x liquidation is mostly to prevent a founder from trying to game the system. But I can totally see how it could feel unfair if there wasn't any ill behavior founder-side.
The issue of employee stock [options] vs founder stock is a somewhat separate issue.
Re: Ask HN: Why is liquidation preference acceptable and prevalent?
#4Or, if new investors give a new investor a liquidation preference, they could ride along with an outside chance of seeing some upside. In that light, an investor with a liquidation preference is preferable to an asset sale.
Re: Ask HN: Why is liquidation preference acceptable and prevalent?
#5Liquidation preference in effect makes VC investment a hybrid between standard equity investment and a loan (it has an almost-guaranteed repayment feature, like a loan, but trades interest for potential upside.) Its better for the other stockholders (and for the success of the company) than VCs holding debt instruments, and its better for the VCs than common stock.
> On the surface, it seems wrong that employees get "worse" equity, i.e. common equity, than the investors and founders.
As long as the features of the type of equity they are receiving are taking into account when employees decide to accept an equity + salary compensation offer, I don't see the problem. Liquidation preference is a guarantee against losing money. The employees' guarantee against losing value for the time invested is the salary + benefits part of the salary + benefits + equity pay deal.
Re: Ask HN: Why is liquidation preference acceptable and prevalent?
#6I'm speaking in generalities since I'm not sure about specifics, but as an example an investor might be willing to accept a smaller (i.e. less controlling) stake with liquidation preferences for the same price, which leaves you more equity to sell to others.
Re: Ask HN: Why is liquidation preference acceptable and prevalent?
#7Re: Ask HN: Why is liquidation preference acceptable and prevalent?
#8If investors put in $10M and the company sells for $9M, doesn't it all go to the investors?
If founders get the same preference as investors, it wouldn't be true. I just didn't think they normally did.
Re: Ask HN: Why is liquidation preference acceptable and prevalent?
#9Here's the argument I've heard: Let's say you found a company. A VC invests $1M for 20% of the company, for a $5M post-money valuation. Then you immediately sell the company for $3M (less than $5M). You make $2.4M. The VC essentially loses $400k. The 1x liquidation preference protects them from losing that $400k.
Re: Ask HN: Why is liquidation preference acceptable and prevalent?
#10On common stock though, I don't think that'll fly. There are a number of ways where founders with board control can screw a minority shareholder. For eg. they can issue 10x the current outstanding shares to their family, or appoint their friends to the board, or sell the company, or sell the company. It's only in extreme cases that VC's will expose themselves like that. I believe facebook's first institutional round was for common stock and no board seat.