Live data from Hacker News

China

blog.samaltman.com

141–150 of 317 posts

Re: China

#141
post #42

Clearly sama is preparing for a career in politics, because this is the standard canard of politicians everywhere. If we don't work harder, more efficiently, we'll be overtaken by country X, and be destitute. It's a well known economic axiom, that long-term economic health of a country is directly proportional to productivity. It is not in any way true that its affected by the productivity of another country. Both co…

"If we don't work harder, more efficiently, we'll be overtaken by country X, and be destitute"

Before the days of the Internet, this might have been true (because it takes much longer for it to happen). But many companies can now hire overseas employees which will directly complete with potential employees in the US.

Re: China

#142
post #7

> One thing that I’ve found puzzling over the last ten or so years is the anger directed towards people who choose to work hard That feels somewhat disingenuous. If 'sama is referring to the sentiments expressed on this board, from what I've seen, it's not anger towards people choosing to work hard, but anger towards demands of hard work of others from those who stand to benefit at their expense. Ie, the anger is tow…

  One thing that I’ve found puzzling over the last ten or 
  so years is the anger directed towards people who choose
  to work hard
I think there is serious merit to that sentiment. Others in this thread have made very keen observations on this all pervasive national attitude that has blanketed America in the past decade or two.

  however the biggest issue facing the US is this message that excelling
  isn't to aspired too, acceptance of who you are and who someone else 
  is is all that matters. It is a self defeating mindset. Don't worry if
  you fail, you had no choice, you just can't do better. Here let us 
  take care of you....
And fully expecting to be flamed, I give you perhaps, the most lucid and no-nonsense explanation of how this kind of self-defeatist thinking has come about envelope the national psyche, in the form on a nice quip by none other than, Peter Thiel himself:

  The countercultural in the '60s was the hippies. You know, we landed
  on the moon in July of 1969. Woodstock started three weeks later, and
  with the benefit of hindsight, that’s when progress ended, and the 
  hippies took over the country.
He adds:

  Today the counterculture is to believe in science and technology. You
  know, our society, the dominant culture doesn’t like science. It
  doesn’t like technology. You just look at the science-fiction movies
  that come out of Hollywood — Terminator, Matrix, Avatar, Elysium. I
  watched the Gravity movie the other day. It’s like you would never
  want to go into outer space. You would just want to be back on some
  muddy island. And so I think we’re in a world where actually believing
  that a better future is possible that you can have agency and work
  towards a better future, that is actually radically countercultural.
[1] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9034895

[2] http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IER50pX-FuM&t=3m22s

[3] Technology Stalled in 1970

    http://www.technologyreview.com/qa/530901/technology-stalled-in-1970/

Re: China

#143
post #94

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For good reason. It is both unhealthy and inefficient to work massive amounts of hours. There are multiple studies that show that overall productivity increases when you don't work over 40 hours a week.

The studies I've seen show productivity falling at 40 hours and dropping off a cliff at 50 for most activities. I don't think the blame for the workaholic culture lies primarily with VCs, though some do encourage this. I think it's mostly a part of the cult of male ego. "I worked 70 hours last week! How many did you work? 50? Wuss! I'm so much more hard-core than you!" People also lie about how many hours they worked…

I've run into this before as well, where guys will brag about how much (unpaid) overtime they put in, how early they get to the office in the morning, etc. I feel pity for them, not respect.

Re: China

#144
post #47

I don't mean to eye-roll, but Sam on economics tends to be, well, meh. The thing I always remind people when they say that China will take over the world is that everyone said the same thing about Japan in the 1980s (remember the movie/novel Rising Sun?). What happened? Well, the mercantilist economic toolkit has an endgame. Neither Sam nor I knows when it's going to let them down, but building an entire economy on c…

There's a population difference. While the US is more than twice as populous as Japan, it is less than a fourth as populous as China. It would be crazy if Japan became wealthier than the US; it would be only natural if China did.

Re: China

#145

I disagree with a lot of this. The Chinese value the appearance of working hard, not actual hard work. Cheating among Chinese students is pandemic. Chinese companies regularly publish misleading or outright fraudulent earning statements and quarterly reports. While the Chinese government seems to be taking steps to reverse these trends, it will take a long time to undo their culture of corruption. Contrast this with…

I'm sorry but you don't understand how reserve currencies work and your conclusions are wrong. Michael Pettis has an excellent explanation here: http://blog.mpettis.com/2014/12/my-reading-of-the-ft-on-chin...

Re: China

#146

I disagree with a lot of this. The Chinese value the appearance of working hard, not actual hard work. Cheating among Chinese students is pandemic. Chinese companies regularly publish misleading or outright fraudulent earning statements and quarterly reports. While the Chinese government seems to be taking steps to reverse these trends, it will take a long time to undo their culture of corruption. Contrast this with…

There's a billion people! You can't make any generalizations about "hard work". It's just overly broad stereotyping at that point. Do Uighurs value hard work? Tibetans? Subsistence farmers? City-dwellers? I don't really know what people mean when they say that the Chinese "value hard work". Which Chinese?

Indeed. People forget that China has twice the population of United States and European Union combined. It's often silly to treat them all as one uniform group.

Re: China

#147

The historical track record of the largest economy being overtaken by another is not good. Sometimes it’s violent. (For example, Germany and the UK in 1914. To give WWI as an example of the consequences of GDP league tables seems like a bad reach to make the event sound apocalyptically important when it doesn't represent any radical change in balance of power at all. As I understand it, the Kaiser's geopolitical moti…

The central question of the start of WWI was who gets to pick over the bones of the ottoman empire and to a lesser extent the bones of the austrian empire. Several very big players decided "it'll be me, and I'll fight everyone else for my share".

Re: China

#148

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's a billion people! You can't make any generalizations about "hard work". It's just overly broad stereotyping at that point. Do Uighurs value hard work? Tibetans? Subsistence farmers? City-dwellers? I don't really know what people mean when they say that the Chinese "value hard work". Which Chinese?

Indeed. People forget that China has twice the population of United States and European Union combined . It's often silly to treat them all as one uniform group.

I once had a friend say something about how the Chinese valued hard work. Then I asked him what cultures don't value hard work. He squirmed as he started ticking off a list of countries whose populations are predominantly black/Latino...

Re: China

#149

I disagree with a lot of this. The Chinese value the appearance of working hard, not actual hard work. Cheating among Chinese students is pandemic. Chinese companies regularly publish misleading or outright fraudulent earning statements and quarterly reports. While the Chinese government seems to be taking steps to reverse these trends, it will take a long time to undo their culture of corruption. Contrast this with…

> Contrast this with the American culture of honesty; fraud and cheating are national scandals, not the norm. Fraud is basically the biggest national industry in the U.S. Just look at: - The 30% of all medical spending that is wasted. - The rise of for-profit colleges with super low graduation rates and even worse employment prospects. Same with law schools. - The fact that the majority of people who graduate high sc…

You're going to have to backup that claim that the majority of people that graduate from college are functionally illiterate. I call bullshit on that being true.

The American food system is one of the safest and most regulated on earth. You may disagree with some of its practices, but that does not make it unregulated nor unsafe. The claim that America has a complete lack of food safety regulations is laughable, you couldn't be more wrong.

America has always had for-profit colleges, and there's absolutely nothing wrong with that. They work perfectly fine. America has had by far the best university system for many decades and still does. The rest of the world has nothing like it.

Massive subsidies for fossil fuels? In fact the subsidies are not massive compared to the industry and dollar figures in question, even if those subsidies should not exist. If you want to talk per capita fossil fuels and the destruction of the environment from that, let's talk about Norway's output - that bastion of everything America is supposed to aspire to.

America merely contributes upwards of half of all global science and innovation. Given the immense output record the US possesses, you're going to have to do a lot better to discredit it than throw out an empty soundbite.

Re: China

#150
post #135
post #94

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The studies I've seen show productivity falling at 40 hours and dropping off a cliff at 50 for most activities. I don't think the blame for the workaholic culture lies primarily with VCs, though some do encourage this. I think it's mostly a part of the cult of male ego. "I worked 70 hours last week! How many did you work? 50? Wuss! I'm so much more hard-core than you!" People also lie about how many hours they worked…

"I'm so much more hard-core than you!" Its a grind game. Obviously my WoW character level 70 is far superior to your WoW character level 50. Unfortunately companies can be killed by this kind of primitive behavior when the 70 hour/week guy executes less shareholder value add than a 20 hour/week intern. Give someone a stupid metric to aspire to, they'll max it. Might destroy the company in the process, maybe even them…

Grinding in WoW is at least fun and you get to socialize...
Post reply on HN