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Google Play Store: Browsing with Firefox is no longer supported on Android

news.ycombinator.com

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Re: Google Play Store: Browsing with Firefox is no longer supported on Android

#121

Post by themartorana »

zanny wrote: post #36
dannywoodz wrote: post #4

Interestingly, it works if you request the desktop site: they're explicitly blocking Firefox Mobile.

They probably just don't want you accessing the store from a browser on mobile when you can be using their app. I don't think this is some malicious betrayal of trust, even if its a stupid thing to do.

Gave you an up-vote, not sure why you're being down-voted for making a perfectly logical assumption.

It's annoying if in fact it's very specifically Firefox Mobile and nothing else, but I agree, if the app has the better experience, they likely want to funnel everyone that way.

Edit: aaaand down-voted. What is the actual problem here?

Re: Google Play Store: Browsing with Firefox is no longer supported on Android

#122

Post by Touche »

jaredmcateer wrote: post #78
wernercd wrote: post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why would you think it's a good experience? I can't count the number of times I'm annoyed when I click on a link to a website - say, clicking a link on news.google.com or a link here - get moved to that website and BAM there is a "you want to use our app. Click here to download it." No. I don't want your F(!&^NG app. I want your website. Don't show me that. The next time I go to the same website? BAM! Go To Our App p…

That's not the same thing that is being discussed here. What's being discussed is that you click, for example, a youtube link in your web browser and android opens up the youtube app to view the video. Android will give you the choice to open it up in a variety of supported applications, including the browser, you can set your permanent preference if you want to not be asked again.

That's not what is happening in this case. The app is not opening when you go to the play store in Firefox. It just goes to this page that says "this browser is not supported".

Re: Google Play Store: Browsing with Firefox is no longer supported on Android

#123

Post by anon1385 »

Karunamon wrote: post #104
pyre wrote: post #100

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> are things it releases and publishes as open standards Publishing working code (even as Open Source) and possibly a white paper does not make something a 'standard.' It may be 'open' but not a 'standard.'

And yet it also completely disproves the argument of anyone claiming that Google is trying to make another ActiveX. The idea that nobody can do anything cool on the web unless all browsers support it seems like a great way to encourage stagnation.

>The idea that nobody can do anything cool on the web unless all browsers support it seems like a great way to encourage stagnation.

But that's the entire point of open web standards. If you don't like using a runtime that is the lowest common denominator across all platforms then why are you using the web in the first place?

I really don't understand people who claim to support the web and web standards but then moan about vendor X or Y not implementing this or that. That's the single biggest defining feature of open web standards; things don't happen unless everybody agrees. If you don't like it that individual vendors have veto power over things then you don't like open web standards. If you don't like technology that moves slowly and by consensus then you don't like open web standards. These are the costs of creating a platform that is defined by open standards.

Re: Google Play Store: Browsing with Firefox is no longer supported on Android

#124

Post by arca_vorago »

TheCapn wrote: post #35
mariusz79 wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, there is a valid reason - market share wars

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hanlon%27s_razor Without evidence its not really worthwhile to sling mud like that. Chances are they implemented some feature in the Play store that FF mobile doesn't support. When a FF mobile user goes to the site and its broken who would they blame most likely? Google? or Firefox? Experience tells me they'd blame Google.

I just wanted to say, as I have said before, that Hanlon's razor is a rhetorical reference tool that should be relegated to the dustbin of conversational history. It is by definition a logical fallacy, is not conducive to intellectual conversation, and should not be used by any logic respecting person. Every time I see it referenced almost in the exact same way, eg, as an excuse to cover someones ass for them.

Stop using Hanlons razor as lead in to why someone isn't malicious when you aren't in a position to know one way or the other!

edit: I would appreciate a response along with the downvote.

Re: Google Play Store: Browsing with Firefox is no longer supported on Android

#125

Post by a3n »

droopybuns wrote: post #118

This seems consistent with the other poor design decision in the play store: no anonymous app reviews. A team that forces you to compromise your anonymity in order to write a positive app review has no qualms about forcing you to use a different browser. That team must be filled with former MS employees.

> That team must be filled with former MS employees.

Nah, just people. People are the same everywhere.

"It is difficult to get a man to understand something, when his salary depends upon his not understanding it." https://en.wikiquote.org/wiki/Upton_Sinclair

Re: Google Play Store: Browsing with Firefox is no longer supported on Android

#127

Post by kenbellows »

drzaiusapelord wrote: post #108
oblio wrote: post #102

This is a dangerous slope. And I'm sad seeing many of the arguments here - a wild guess is that they've been made by people who weren't here (or have forgotten) the Microsoft/IE story. Soon it will become: "Why would they invest resources? Firefox is a niche browser, the return on investment is not justified". After all, Firefox's market share is dwindling. I really hope we're not slowly being boiled like the proverb…

Weren't we all applauding some startup that had a douche-bagy "We dont support IE" message on their site and everyone here was so excited about it. Now that the bell is tolling for Firefox, its a different story, eh? There's been this largely ridiculous "revenge of the geeks" after the IE6 days. Now we've fed so much fuel into that fire, that casually telling people to use different browsers is the norm. I'm not sayi…

There is potentially a critical difference here. The "We don't support IE" mini-movement was a reaction to Microsoft's refusal to use the web standards that every other major browser supported. In this case, it appears to me (admittedly without research) that Google's motivations must be different, and two possibilities spring to mind: (1) Google doesn't like the competition from Firefox or (2) the Play store uses non-standard features not supported by Firefox's overwhelmingly standards compliant browser. If either of these is the case, we've got a very different situation, potentially one in which Google has begun to play the part of Microsoft, implementing and using their own non-standard features, even if it's in a less intrusive and less inconvenient way.

Re: Google Play Store: Browsing with Firefox is no longer supported on Android

#128

Post by nulagrithom »

higherpurpose wrote: post #119
drzaiusapelord wrote: post #108

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Weren't we all applauding some startup that had a douche-bagy "We dont support IE" message on their site and everyone here was so excited about it. Now that the bell is tolling for Firefox, its a different story, eh? There's been this largely ridiculous "revenge of the geeks" after the IE6 days. Now we've fed so much fuel into that fire, that casually telling people to use different browsers is the norm. I'm not sayi…

There were good reasons for not supporting IE because they weren't adhering to standards. That's not the case with Firefox. That was closer to saying "we shouldn't support Chrome because it breaks standards" than "we shouldn't support Firefox because it has small market share". The main reason for not supporting IE was its anti-standards stance, not its market share. I think that's a perfectly valid reason, just like…

Exactly. Internet Explorer was very far behind and failed to adhere to standards. This sentiment largely disappeared with the release of IE10, and I've seen more people defend IE11 than anything else.

Re: Google Play Store: Browsing with Firefox is no longer supported on Android

#129

Post by tuxone »

fpgeek wrote: post #88
_ea1k wrote: post #75

On Android, clicking a link in the browser generally takes you to the default application for that type of url. If there is no default set, then it will give you the choice of what to use to go there (possibly including the browser in the case of a link like this). Firefox doesn't support that, and would instead take you to the play website, that really doesn't perform well on a lot of mobile devices. I'm guessing th…

This isn't true. As I mention in a comment below, Firefox gives you two nicer ways to switch from the web to an app: 1. The droid in the URL bar once the page has loaded. 2. The "Open in an app" alternative in a link's long-press menu, which often tells you which app when the destination is clear.

The point here is that it's not a lack of feature but a lack of user experience. Android Intent Filters [0] should work like that: the user starts an action and the system executes the default behavior (or prompt a choice list). Think about the average user, both ways you described seem poorly user friendly.

Sure Google solution is crap, right now following a link to a Play Store app generates this [1], you really need to be a Firefox Power User in order to tap the droid in the URL bar (on this point Firefox should prompt a tip, at least the first time).

[0] http://developer.android.com/guide/components/intents-filter...

[1] http://i.imgur.com/X43Izy3.png

Re: Google Play Store: Browsing with Firefox is no longer supported on Android

#130

Post by cognivore »

VlijmenFileer wrote: post #96
cognivore wrote: post #28

I sometimes wonder if browsers are going to become runtimes. For Google services you obviously use Chrome. For others they choose to support runtimes Chrome and Firefox. Microsoft supports IE as the runtime for there services. It's awful, but it seems like the direction things are going.

"For Google services you obviously use Chrome" What makes you say that? It is like saying that for going to work you need a red car, but for going to the shop you need a blue car. It's insanity. It is how internet and the web were supposed to not be. It is what shitty companies like Google try to push for the greater glory of their profit margins. It is /very/ bad for customers in the mid- to long term. It is what we…

"...companies like Google try to push for the greater glory of their profit margins. It is /very/ bad for customers in the mid- to long term."

Oh, I'm right there with you. I just think that, as a company, you spend millions of dollars making a web browser, making a great Javascript runtime, and your web sites run better when you use this browser, there isn't a lot of incentive to make it work on other browsers.

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