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Having a Final Solution of "only" deporting Jews - after taking their possessions - and murdering just a few, for a warning or for a bit of fun, is not really that much more humane than the later industrial extermination into which things developed. Or let's say that making a point about difference there is just, well, gross.

Starting to give sources to a revisionist, regarding Nazi persecution of Jews not only as retaliation for a "Judea against Germany" boycott "act of war", is much like starting to play chess with a flock of pigeons. There's no point.

I want to make sure I read that correctly.

You're saying deportation is not that much more humane than mass extermination? Wow. No comments there.

There's a lot more evidence that the Third Reich had a Transfer Agreement with the Zionists than there is that the Nazis wanted to kill all Jews.

And stop calling me a revisionist when all I argue is from mainstream sources. You don't give me sources because there aren't any, like the respectable mainstream holocaust historian, Raul Hilberg, said under oath in 1985.

That's interesting! Though after reading so many pros & cons of FairTax on wiki, I'm still not convinced it's a good idea. The potential downsides are pretty dramatic:

* Easier tax evasion (first-party reporting, B2B untaxed)

* Discouraging of consumption (encouraging saving, DIY & black markets)

* Income-regressive nature of consumption

That said, some of the upsides are pretty good too. And if we were switching from FairTax to the current system, the latter would seem even more insane.

Sources are not relevant for what you argue. Yes, Hillberg is a good source. You just misuse him.

The start of this thread was a comment with a link that described how Hitler defied the bankers. That stuff is nonsense. The Nazi economic policy was bonkers, or would have been if it weren’t just a preparation for a war of conquest, which it was. It couldn’t have sustained in peace.

It started with a massive monetary expansion by issuing the so-called "Mefo bills", and went on nicely for a few years. Expropriating the wealth of Jews – and non-Jewish but pacifist or socialist businessmen like Hugo Junkers – helped in the beginning, of course. In just five years after gaining power, the Nazis were annexing their neighbours and confiscating the wealth of Austria and Czechoslovakia, which enabled them to keep going for another year or two.

"How Hitler defied bankers" was more a policy of expropriation – justified by hate and rancour – and then military expansion, rather than economics. Nazi Germany couldn’t operate in peace mode; it had to start a war of conquest and resort to slave labour to keep its economics working.

Drawing parallels with "bankers" and "World Jewry" is a tool in the classic anti-Semitist kit. Hitler hated Jews, as he documented his idea of cleaning Jews away in Mein Kampf. It is disgusting to imply that this is sort of okay because originally Jews were just to be deported, not exterminated, and then Jews brought their misfortune on themselves by some "declaration of war" by "World Jewry" that then "provoked" the extermination.

Yes, read Hillberg. Read Shirer’s The Rise and Fall of the Third Reich, particularly chapter 7 about nazification of Germany. And please read the book to the very deserved end.

Not everything that Nazis did was bad or crazy, but much of it was. The economics certainly was. "How Hitler defied the bankers" is no model to build an economic policy, unless you plan to make war.

Alright. We mostly agree.

The only reason I spoke up is because it irks me that some people are quick to stifle debates on certain topics just because they might involve the Jews. You're a classic case, playing the "anti-Semite" card and banging on that "bring onto themselves" key that no one else mentioned but you. To me that says something about your agenda, as most pro-Israel people react that way.

For all your hatred of revisionists, you and I should be thankful that we know more accurate death tolls for Majdanek, Auschwitz and the Reinhardt Action camps because of them. Otherwise we'd still have those inflated, unbelievable numbers that were sacred a couple decades ago. Revisionists are intellectuals first of all (this much even Michael Shermer admitted on C-SPAN) and they have a good track record of smelling bullshit (see David Cole and the Auschwitz museum lying about a reconstructed gas chamber). I think it's a shame we thank them by throwing them in jail and you should be ashamed to participate in that censoring behavior.

The way to curb intolerance is not to suppress discussion, nor to call people names. The "Hitler vs bankers" story is wrong not because whoever talked about it might be an anti-Semite according to you; it's wrong because the facts don't check. If revisionists are intellectuals, we must argue with them and show them wrong. Calling them names won't do any good because it doesn't change what they think.

Bottom line is, if Palestine did not aid the Nazis in killing Jews, why must they suffer a holocaust? This motivates more WWII research by independent thinkers than this silly banker/Jews association you have in your head. Bankers are bad because of money printing machines, libor conspiracies, Goldman Sachs and JP Morgan folks working at the Fed, and so on. Zero to do with ethnicity. Get this through your head. This association you make is a red herring to avoid discussing the real issue which is the present day holocaust and genocide of the Palestinian people who are also Semites just like their oppressors. I side with the Hasidim Jews and informed secular Jews all over for bravely opposing this disgusting Zionist obsession.

If this were really about relocating the Jews, they should just live here in the US, where they are welcome by all rational people including me. Of course, Zionism has zero to do with Jews, and everything to do with power hungry bankers that want control of a place where real money comes out of the ground and from where they can run pipelines to 90% of the world. But please, go on distracting everyone about how everything is about the Jews.