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Testosterone is the drug of the future

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Re: Testosterone is the drug of the future

#151

Post by matwood »

hellodevnull wrote: post #87

>I was just at the gym watching the 30-year-olds at the pull-up bar building muscles in three weeks. And I’m at the pull up bar and nothing’s happening While many of you are thinking that he's making excuses (he might be) or that the other guys worked long and hard to build muscle, I can relate: I've been lifting weights three times a week for the last four years. I still look average, and yes I'm eating and exercisi…

Looking at your logs, what do the big exercise #s look like from day 1 to now? Row, DL, Squat, Bench, OH Press

You certainly may have some medical condition, but every person who has come to me with a similar story has not realized they are simply missing something. I was even you at one point until I finally figured out how to lift and how to eat.

Re: Testosterone is the drug of the future

#152

Post by 6stringmerc »

Big fan of supplementation...growing up as a couch potato that medical professionals said should never, ever lift weights due to a physical handicap, I had a lot of body image issues. The fact I really enjoyed comic books didn't help my perception either. Just take a look for yourself and the way the Super Hero bodytype looks like. Straight up juiced[1].

Then, I started natural using a book from the library. Weightlifting actually helped manage a lot of my physical handicap - by being stronger, I was reducing the wear and tear on my body. Well, because I still wanted to break through to another level, I started researching supplements. Using the mind to grow the body.

Protein, Glutamine, BCAAs, Tribulus, ZMA - all of them are natural ways to increase physical strength and also grow into a lean, muscular person. They were good, and eventually I found my way to some PH products. If 19-Norandro was good enough for Mark McGwire (it wasn't he was on the real stuff, that was just a cover story), then I was game to try it! Worked great, enjoyed it but also knew that doing so over a long period of time would have side effects. Eventually 19-Norandro got banned. There are chemists doing great work in the field (I've got my eye on one vendor in particular), and they'll always be 1 step ahead of the law, IMO.

I did a couple more different products but never stacked to the point where I'd need PCT. Honestly, I think budget and liver damage fears were my driving motives. Just look at Arnold - he had to have heart surgery, and I'd bet a lot of money it's related to the muscle being exposed to years of heavy steroid doses[2].

These days I avoid PH or the juice outright. As I age, I might get back into the scene, but it's a crap shoot. There are far, far too many placebo type products out there, and the really good stuff has side effects that must be planned for, otherwise the whole quality of life part goes down, and where's the fun in that?

Overall, I'd say TRT/PH/Juice are definitely not for everybody, but they're not inherently evil. Sort of like alcohol. Not everybody can knock back a dozen beers during a weekend marathon session at home and still be productive / nice / etc, but it's possible depending on the individual.

[1] Freshman year of University the next door neighbor was a Pre-Med, about 5'2" and 205 lbs. We became pals and he let me in on the steroid secrets (cycling, GHB for sleep, etc). We did have a good laugh talking about how comic book characters reflected different steroids: Want to be Captain America? Deca. Wolverine? Winstrol. Sabretooth? Deca + Winstrol! It was a joke in a lot of ways, but kind of not...

[2] Arnold is coming! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8sHvWYAzIRo

Re: Testosterone is the drug of the future

#153

Post by jschwartzi »

vidarh wrote: post #53
Simp wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"start meditating" Research has not shown that meditation beats a placebo Studies about meditation are usually of poor quality. Source: http://blogs.scientificamerican.com/cross-check/2013/03/08/r...

Your source does not support your claim that research has not shown that meditation beats a placebo. Apart from pointing out that "meditation" is a wide ranging concept that includes a vast number of different, often contradictory, practices, and that a lot of the research is of poor quality (given the number of "research" papers coming out of TM affiliated sources alone - see blow -, that should not be a surprise),…

It might be possible to do a double-blind study on meditation, but you would have to be incredibly strict about the procedure for achieving a meditative state, and you would have to select people who know nothing about "meditation" as a practice both to administer bouts of meditation and to participate in the study. Then your part in the study would be to teach the controls the "placebo" practice and to teach the non-controls the strictly-defined meditative practice, and to convince all of the participants that they're meditating either way.

Re: Testosterone is the drug of the future

#154

Post by leephillips »

Lio wrote: post #79
davak wrote: post #55

MD here. Just remember that women live longer than men. Although it'll never be proven that hormones are part of that provess, I think it's a good assumption. Many males as they get older become more lovable and more pleasent to be around because of natural hormone declines. There are a ton of health issues such as balding, coronary artery disease, prostate cancer, obstructive sleep apnea that are related to testoste…

"Women live longer than men" is interesting though. Does that take into account the horrendous levels of male suicide? Statistically does this bump the average life expectancies down for men? I'm definitely not disagreeing with you. It seems very plausible that human growth hormone could be linked to some cancers. On a side note, is baldness actually a "health issue"? I mean I know mainstream media doesn't like to sh…

I like famous baldy John Glenn's take on this: "The good Lord only gave men so many hormones, and if others want to waste theirs on growing hair, that's up to them." (I've heard several versions of the quote, so take the wording with a grain of salt.)

Re: Testosterone is the drug of the future

#155

Post by JosephBrown »

johnward wrote: post #114
stevepotter wrote: post #98

I went through a major testosterone-related health scare when I was 31 (4 years ago). I was in the midst of launching a startup. Stressed out, financially strained, hardly sleeping, hardly exercising, drinking too much. I thought I was eating right but turns out I wasn't. I began feeling like an empty shell of my former self. And yes, it totally affected my sex drive. Went to doc and had blood work done. My test leve…

Studies have shown that creams are pretty terrible. Especially if you happen to have thyroid problems. They seem to work at first and then fade out for a lot of people. Shots just simply work and are cheaper.

Can you provide some references? I've been prescribed T and get it via a compounding pharmacy in liposome cream form, so now I'm curious if it's actually worth it.

Re: Testosterone is the drug of the future

#156

Post by o_____________o »

blfr wrote: post #145
davak wrote: post #55

MD here. Just remember that women live longer than men. Although it'll never be proven that hormones are part of that provess, I think it's a good assumption. Many males as they get older become more lovable and more pleasent to be around because of natural hormone declines. There are a ton of health issues such as balding, coronary artery disease, prostate cancer, obstructive sleep apnea that are related to testoste…

There are a ton of health issues such as balding, ..., obstructive sleep apnea I thought balding is primarily genetic (men respond differently to some metabolite of testosterone) and obstructive sleep apnea only a serious issue for overweight people. Could you, or someone else, elaborate, maybe link a longer explanation?

Your predisposition is genetic, but like many things, it's not an on/off switch, and will land you in a gradient. Beyond that, there are lots of variables like how much of your T is albumin/SHBG bound, glucocorticoids, 5a-r, etc. Our endocrine and inflammatory responses are crazy complex.

That said, it's easily the leading causal agent, and most people will experience some form of hair loss in their life. Women experience loss at levels that might surprise you. Tellingly, the first defense for women is usually an antiandrogenic (anti-T) called Spironolactone.

Re: Testosterone is the drug of the future

#157

Post by mej10 »

freshfey wrote: post #76
henryaj wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What are the details of your intermittent fasting?

in terms of timing you mean? I fasted for 14 hours and simply delayed/skipped breakfast, still eating 3 meals at around 2400 calories.

Can you link to any studies showing IF increased T levels substantially? I am genuinely curious. I have been considering doing IF (since I am half way there already) just for the longevity boosts and general body composition benefits.

Re: Testosterone is the drug of the future

#158

Post by woofyman »

dreamweapon wrote: post #148
mironathetin wrote: post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I am happy that an expert without a bias reports about this. What you noted down came back into my mind immediately. These were the reported risks for professional athletes (back in the days when I decided to study physics instead of taking more of this junk and go pro). There are also natural ways to keep your own T level high, like healthy food, enough sleep, everything that increases your muscle mass (weightliftin…

There are also natural ways to keep your own T level high, like healthy food Specifics? Evidence?

Zinc, magnesium and vitamin D are essential for the production of testosterone.

Re: Testosterone is the drug of the future

#159

Post by saiya-jin »

vidarh wrote: post #92
paganel wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The many studies done on this subject show that testosterone makes a huge impact on muscle growth Genuine question: Why this emphasis on increasing "muscle growth"? What benefits does it bring us (men)?

I do power lifting (non-competitive), and while I'm noticeably muscular and lift more than most people at my gym (no competitive lifters there, so doesn't say all that much), I'm not nearly at peak muscle volume nor do I look nearly as big as body builders much smaller than me - leanness makes a huge difference to perceived muscle size. Still, from an hour 2-4 times a week (2 times a week at the moment), with no ster…

Yeah, definitely, but there are drawbacks too. if you already have a woman by your side that you want to spend rest of your life with (and judging by your comment about son, you should be there) - extra ladies attention is annoying as hell. If you are actually mentally a grown up, this ain't an impressive result as it might seem :) (Yes, been/am there, but to impress ladies you don't need to be creepy muscular type. Just a sporty one. Especially if you care about quality of your partner, not just quantity).

as for strength - I find it much better to have real world-usable one, combined with endurance. Examples you describe are OK, but better use cases for me are - being able to climb that mountain (or just hike it), full day of of-piste skiing (its damn hard on quads) etc. In many sports, too much muscles has negative impact. For high altitude, common knowledge is that gym type muscular types struggle more up there. For climbing same. But that's me. It also brings freedom in eating - keeping huge amount of muscles while doing some 3-week effort on Aconcagua... not really possible.

Re: Testosterone is the drug of the future

#160

Post by brianwski »

stinos wrote: post #14
paulojreis wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Would you be kind enough to share your experience? I ask you this as a 29 yrs old who's mortified of aging and feels guilty as hell for having a "all-day-sitting" job.

mortified of aging Isn't that rather a psychological issue? After all, aging is still quite unavoidable. Would postponing the unavoidable end really make you less mortified? feels guilty Sort of the same remark as above. Moreover, it is (afaik) not proven taking any kind of drug will counter or reverse the damage done by sitting all day - so taking drugs anyway would just act as a placebo: it doesn't really help with…

> aging is still quite unavoidable. Would postponing > the unavoidable end really make you less mortified?

Yes, I want to postpone the unavoidable. Death is unavoidable, I'm trying to postpone it. I will probably be in a wheel chair like my father eventually, yes I want to postpone that as long as possible so I can walk around in nature and enjoy it. If my hearing starts to fail, I will get hearing aids to try to postpone deafness as long as possible. (My elderly mother wears hearing aids.) I don't care if deafness is inevitable, I will fight for every extra day of hearing birds chirping and the hearing the ocean waves.

What am I missing? Isn't everybody just like me? SOME parts of aging are Ok, but most of them are super bad - when your bones get thin due to Osteoporosis if you fall you might break a bone, which in turn might end your life. Nobody wants to get Osteoporosis sooner, we are all trying to postpone it as long as possible, right?

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