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The Fine Art of Bullshit, Killed by Google

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Re: The Fine Art of Bullshit, Killed by Google

#31

Post by increment_i »

crazygringo wrote: post #5

I have a rule I always follow, and have convinced many friends of too -- no Googling/Wikipedia-ing in social settings. If nobody knows something (trivia-like), it's almost always a lot more fun to continue not knowing. Sure, look it up when you get home. But a little group self-discipline goes far in keeping the fine art of bullshitting alive. (And it's not just the answer that kills the conversation, but also the fa…

No offense but that doesn't sound fun at all. Imagine walking into your friend's place and he says to you, "Oh yeah, no googling. Thanks."

Re: The Fine Art of Bullshit, Killed by Google

#32

Post by eropple »

tjradcliffe wrote: post #30
crazygringo wrote: post #5

I have a rule I always follow, and have convinced many friends of too -- no Googling/Wikipedia-ing in social settings. If nobody knows something (trivia-like), it's almost always a lot more fun to continue not knowing. Sure, look it up when you get home. But a little group self-discipline goes far in keeping the fine art of bullshitting alive. (And it's not just the answer that kills the conversation, but also the fa…

Sure, because what fun are facts? What have facts ever done for us? Other than cured disease, ended hunger, doubled lifespan. But lately , I mean! Why anyone would ever choose bullshit over facts is beyond me. Facts are interesting. Facts are fun. Bullshit is just the unrestrained spew of the ignorant ego. There's no point to it other than mate competition, and making what amount to factual claims that are known to b…

All of this is well and good, but has very little to do with a bullshit session with one's friends where everybody involved is having fun with an argument about something that is ultimately meaningless.

Re: The Fine Art of Bullshit, Killed by Google

#33

Post by nichochar »

crazygringo wrote: post #5

I have a rule I always follow, and have convinced many friends of too -- no Googling/Wikipedia-ing in social settings. If nobody knows something (trivia-like), it's almost always a lot more fun to continue not knowing. Sure, look it up when you get home. But a little group self-discipline goes far in keeping the fine art of bullshitting alive. (And it's not just the answer that kills the conversation, but also the fa…

My rule goes further: it's called the phone stack. I suggest you try, it's pretty awesome.

Rule: all phones head down in a stack. That's it, go enjoy people a little

Re: The Fine Art of Bullshit, Killed by Google

#34

Post by eropple »

pervycreeper wrote: post #18
harshreality wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The point is that uncertainty about some things creates social engagement.

Well, there are still things to be uncertain about that aren't useless trivia, factoids, or urban legends. Hopefully the new BS free era will trickle down to the lower classes, gradually eroding their ignorance and prejudices, at least about one-liner facts.

It has indeed been entire minutes since I saw somebody rationalize their well-actuallying into social good. Well done.

Re: The Fine Art of Bullshit, Killed by Google

#35

Post by coldtea »

Actually Google (and Wikipedia et al) enabled an even more evolved form of bullshit.

The kind were people with shallow (or none) knowledge of a topic check some reference source they half understand and try to pass of as experts in the subject matter...

At least with reference books you had to own them in the first place and get into the trouble to locate a reference in their index etc.

Now any bozo can check an obscure lemma in a matter of seconds and pretend he knows what he's talking about in an online discussion (and often offline), going back to check more details in the process any time his bluff is close to be discovered.

Re: The Fine Art of Bullshit, Killed by Google

#36

Post by HCIdivision17 »

crazygringo wrote: post #5

I have a rule I always follow, and have convinced many friends of too -- no Googling/Wikipedia-ing in social settings. If nobody knows something (trivia-like), it's almost always a lot more fun to continue not knowing. Sure, look it up when you get home. But a little group self-discipline goes far in keeping the fine art of bullshitting alive. (And it's not just the answer that kills the conversation, but also the fa…

I'm rather shocked at the fairly visceral reactions a lot of people are having here. This is pretty classic conversational shenanigans. We had a blast with this in college; either you play along or counter with something equally preposterous or unprovable. Looking up the answer is cheating. It's like a game of verbal Calvin Ball or Mornington Crescent. As noted elsewhere in this thread (edit: at least one level up it seems (I got lost, apparently)), the goal is to specifically not make it win/lose, since that ends the game and is boring.

Or, if you know your friends well enough to guess what they're going to say, it's the art of picking the third or fourth dialog choice from the top, Monkey Island style. And if you're really friends, they'll do the same and it'll work.

And then there was the other side, where you tried to derive the answer. One of my favorites was attempting to determine if you could neglect the earth's core in modeling gravity; ferocious debate for an hour and a half by a dozen engineers. Best lunch ever.

Really, this is more about people being boring. Jumping immediately to the obvious instead of enjoying a meandering argumentative stroll. It's a way to play. Simple as that.

Otherwise you're just the adult saying, "that's not lava, that's carpet." Killjoy is the word, I think.

Edit: Ah, here we go: Mornington Crescent.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OjOsOB4erZI

Re: The Fine Art of Bullshit, Killed by Google

#37

Post by coldtea »

increment_i wrote: post #31
crazygringo wrote: post #5

I have a rule I always follow, and have convinced many friends of too -- no Googling/Wikipedia-ing in social settings. If nobody knows something (trivia-like), it's almost always a lot more fun to continue not knowing. Sure, look it up when you get home. But a little group self-discipline goes far in keeping the fine art of bullshitting alive. (And it's not just the answer that kills the conversation, but also the fa…

No offense but that doesn't sound fun at all. Imagine walking into your friend's place and he says to you, "Oh yeah, no googling. Thanks."

In what sense does that not sound like fun?

Who goes to his friend's place and wants to google?

Re: The Fine Art of Bullshit, Killed by Google

#38

Post by coldtea »

harshreality wrote: post #9
pervycreeper wrote: post #8

Good riddance? I believe I'm missing some profound point that the TFA is apparently making.

The point is that uncertainty about some things creates social engagement.

Not to mention that you can come up with some interesting ideas, art and even inventions when facing such uncertainty -- stuff that is lost otherwise.

Re: The Fine Art of Bullshit, Killed by Google

#39

Post by HCIdivision17 »

cbd1984 wrote: post #24
ummonkwatz wrote: post #2

The bullshit didn't even have to be believable: "Marilyn Manson was the kid that played Paul from the Wonder Years. Also, he had a rib removed so he could perform autofellatio." Kids everywhere believed that. Hilarious.

Right, like "Vaccines cause autism" and "Homeopathy is something you should say without laughing". Also hilarious. There's a dark side to bullshit. There's a side which creates endless pain for no good reason, because things 'sound good' or are 'too good to check' and nobody likes a party-pooper, do they? Especially when the party-pooper is pointing out how this little piece of bullshit could kill someone. No. Go alo…

As stolio notes elsewhere in the thread, there is a blunt difference. On the one side there's bullshit that matters, and on the other side is "no seriously, they both have Tyler in their name!" It is absolutely necessary to be able to tell the difference, since it's a basic way to avoid being conversationally tone deaf.

Alternatively, I invoke Poe's Law in case I'm being That Guy. (Tone's hard on the Internet - it's much better to play in person!)

Re: The Fine Art of Bullshit, Killed by Google

#40

Post by girvo »

increment_i wrote: post #31
crazygringo wrote: post #5

I have a rule I always follow, and have convinced many friends of too -- no Googling/Wikipedia-ing in social settings. If nobody knows something (trivia-like), it's almost always a lot more fun to continue not knowing. Sure, look it up when you get home. But a little group self-discipline goes far in keeping the fine art of bullshitting alive. (And it's not just the answer that kills the conversation, but also the fa…

No offense but that doesn't sound fun at all. Imagine walking into your friend's place and he says to you, "Oh yeah, no googling. Thanks."

What, googling and stopping a fun conversation when your riffing with your friends is more fun?
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