What taking my daughter to a comic book store taught me • Hacker News Board

Re: What taking my daughter to a comic book store taught me

#241

Post by clarkevans » Fri, Jan 16, 2015, 5:08 PM UTC

cauterized wrote: post #45

clarkevans wrote: post #4

I might tend to disagree with the author's final conclusion, that his daughter is too young to understand (at least about sexism and double standards, if not sex). Talking about this subject with your daughter when she brings it up is absolutely appropriate. There is lots of societal pressure on very young girls to fit a specific mold. It starts with very mundane differences... like short/long hair. Two weeks ago, fo…

His daughter.

Thank you for correcting me; I originally wrote "her daughter" when I meant "his daughter".

Re: What taking my daughter to a comic book store taught me

#242

Post by impostervt » Fri, Jan 16, 2015, 5:12 PM UTC

cwyers wrote: post #212

My daughter is seven, and she comes with me to the comic book shop several times a month. She has 2-3 comics a week on her pull list -- Scooby Doo, Scooby Doo Team-Up, Adventure Time, Regular Show, Tiny Titans (until it goes back on hiatus again), My Little Pony Friendship Is Magic. We just got into an arguement the other day -- I am NOT buying two copies of Unbeatable Squirrel-Girl a month, she can just borrow mine.…

Thanks for that list, going to buy some of them for my daughter now.

Re: What taking my daughter to a comic book store taught me

#243

Post by sago » Fri, Jan 16, 2015, 5:15 PM UTC

drzaiusapelord wrote: post #224

sago wrote: post #218

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's the problem with these dialogues. Often right-leaning types see them as ways to avoid having to take any responsibility or action for anything by claiming the real issues are things that are the neutral mechanics of an impersonal market. There, fixed.

Except we've had a history of censorship and its been historically horrible. This is just a new Comics Code Authority Code. So yeah, we tried the liberal censorship (protect the $minority, $gender, $children) approach and its a massive failure because TOP DOWN CONTROL OF CULTURE IS HARMFUL. Instead lower barriers, give people choice, don't guilt them, open markets, etc. Let speech and art flourish. Political correctn…

Wow, I'm not sure who you're responding to. I was remarking on the diversionary tactic of using impersonal markets to avoid taking responsibility. Perhaps I hit a nerve.

Re: What taking my daughter to a comic book store taught me

#244

Post by betenoire » Fri, Jan 16, 2015, 5:17 PM UTC

drzaiusapelord wrote: post #224

sago wrote: post #218

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's the problem with these dialogues. Often right-leaning types see them as ways to avoid having to take any responsibility or action for anything by claiming the real issues are things that are the neutral mechanics of an impersonal market. There, fixed.

Except we've had a history of censorship and its been historically horrible. This is just a new Comics Code Authority Code. So yeah, we tried the liberal censorship (protect the $minority, $gender, $children) approach and its a massive failure because TOP DOWN CONTROL OF CULTURE IS HARMFUL. Instead lower barriers, give people choice, don't guilt them, open markets, etc. Let speech and art flourish. Political correctn…

I've read every comment on this page until this one so far, and you are the only one making this political. Who are you arguing with?

Re: What taking my daughter to a comic book store taught me

#245

Post by itsuart » Fri, Jan 16, 2015, 5:18 PM UTC

po wrote: post #12

I can already hear the debate raging about weather or not the images or particular examples in this article are acceptable or defensible or not. I think it's totally fine for the comics that this one shop has are there. Artistic freedom! Great! What's not super is that it's really the only kind. It's like netflix with only action movies. This article should feature a bunch of blank photos representing the comics that…

I would like to chime in and say that if there is story, any story (or even no story) at all - there is manga about it. And interesting thing is, according to https://www.mangaupdates.com/genres.html - there is more series targeted at girls than boys: shoujo - ~17K, shounen - almost 9K. Though it's almost reversed for 18-30 age group: josei - ~7K, seinen - ~12K. In sum female oriented works trump male oriented (24 vs 21).

If only Japanese publishers (or it's laws?) were not so narrow minded and hired fans that translate those mangas to fill something like iTunes/Steam library, any human being of any age and sex would have something to read their whole life.

Re: What taking my daughter to a comic book store taught me

#246

Post by chasing » Fri, Jan 16, 2015, 5:19 PM UTC

drzaiusapelord wrote: post #224

sago wrote: post #218

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's the problem with these dialogues. Often right-leaning types see them as ways to avoid having to take any responsibility or action for anything by claiming the real issues are things that are the neutral mechanics of an impersonal market. There, fixed.

Except we've had a history of censorship and its been historically horrible. This is just a new Comics Code Authority Code. So yeah, we tried the liberal censorship (protect the $minority, $gender, $children) approach and its a massive failure because TOP DOWN CONTROL OF CULTURE IS HARMFUL. Instead lower barriers, give people choice, don't guilt them, open markets, etc. Let speech and art flourish. Political correctn…

Your over-reliance on political straw men ("left-leaning types," "social justice warriors," "liberal censorship") might turn people off to your actual ideas.

Re: What taking my daughter to a comic book store taught me

#247

Post by smtddr » Fri, Jan 16, 2015, 5:22 PM UTC

xienze wrote: post #111

vidarh wrote: post #87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I'm guessing Marvel, DC et al have done a lot of research over the years and found out yep, it's pretty much only males that read comic books. When the vast majority of their output is targeting a mostly male demographic, and being sold almost exclusively in an environment that attracts mostly men, that may be so. But it is a situation of their own making by making their product offering so niche. > are really only…

> When the vast majority of their output is targeting a mostly male demographic, and being sold almost exclusively in an environment that attracts mostly men, that may be so. But it is a situation of their own making by making their product offering so niche. I think you've got the order of things mixed up. No company intentionally wants to cut their customer base in half. They've tried to attract female readers. The…

>> Women just aren't attracted to comic books.

This is the same kind of thinking when men says "Women just aren't attracted to science or computers". Ignoring all the social cues that discourage women from those activities.

Re: What taking my daughter to a comic book store taught me

#248

Post by angersock » Fri, Jan 16, 2015, 5:25 PM UTC

detaro wrote: post #134

rprospero wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I know exactly how you feel. For the past year, my main gaming rig has been on another continent and I've been making do with what I could play on a cruddy little netbook running Linux. It's probably been my best year of gaming ever. I've been an old west robot prospector. I've seen a man have sex with a giant goldfish. I've tried to get a mouse to wear a hat. I've consoled a grieving child. After all that was done,…

The indie game equivalent are web comics. There are really well made and interesting ones out there, although finding them isn't always easy. For some, printed versions are also available.

Going to have to second this.

There's a whole range of comics catering to those more esoteric (and often quite boring, frankly) storylines, and a good many of them have books for sale.

Check out Something Positive (terrible people), Stand Still, Stay Silent (kid friendly but a little dark, beautiful art), Dumbing of Age (ugh, but some people like it), Vattu (kid friendly, nice art, coming-of-age), Schlock Mercenary (goofy, sometimes a little mature but kid friendly), Gunnerkrigg Court (female protagonists), or any of several other dozens. All of those have books out, I believe, except for maybe SSSS.

EDIT:

Something Positive is probably the best-written webcomic out there today, with the best characters and dialog and plot--it's only flaw is that it might be a bit raw and inaccessible to people younger than teenagers (the first strip being a mean abortion joke probably doesn't help).

Re: What taking my daughter to a comic book store taught me

#249

Post by dragonwriter » Fri, Jan 16, 2015, 5:25 PM UTC

kiiski wrote: post #176

xienze wrote: post #111

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> When the vast majority of their output is targeting a mostly male demographic, and being sold almost exclusively in an environment that attracts mostly men, that may be so. But it is a situation of their own making by making their product offering so niche. I think you've got the order of things mixed up. No company intentionally wants to cut their customer base in half. They've tried to attract female readers. The…

I think you're missing the point that in other parts of the world people (kids, adults, men, women) do read comic books. In those other parts of the world, where comic books are read by all sorts of people, they are not so overtly sexualized as those in the USA. Maybe you're right that non-young-male-Americans are genetically incapable of liking comic books as a medium, but it seems more likely that Americans are no…

> Maybe you're right that non-young-male-Americans are genetically incapable of liking comic books as a medium

It doesn't have to be genetics. It could just be that the opportunity for a cultural development that would favor broader popularity of comic books in the US was missed -- the development of that culture is not independent of things like the currently existing set of other media options, pre-existing cultural perceptions of pictorial media, etc.

The cultural popularity and associations of particular art forms are path dependent.

Re: What taking my daughter to a comic book store taught me

#250

Post by the_af » Fri, Jan 16, 2015, 5:27 PM UTC

danielweber wrote: post #171

alphadevx wrote: post #143

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Also there is Image, Oni Press and Vertigo.

Image doesn't really work for daughters. http://www.coverbrowser.com/image/savage-dragon/18-1.jpg I saw that cover in a comic store in my 20s, and it made me do a "what am I doing with my life?" reaction.

I'm not familiar with Image anymore, but I remember Jim Lee's Wildcats and it was generally "supersexy females with ridiculous breast implants". And they had a couple more superhero teams, whose names I can't remember, which were similar to Wildcats in this regard.