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What Happens When You Install the Top Download.com Apps

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Re: What Happens When You Install the Top Download.com Apps

#151

Post by jmilloy »

I agree that there is a lot of useless software, malware, and annoying bundling on download.com and in the Windows software ecosystem at large.

But seriously, it's not hard to avoid installing a lot of bundled software. I'd be more interested in what happens when you install the Top Download.com Apps without the obviously bundled crap. And I'm certainly not interested in hearing complaints about what the programs do (it's just distracting), considering that you picked them arbitrarily and some of them seem to be doing exactly what they say they will do.

If we're going to bash a software ecosystem, let's at least try to do it intelligently.

Re: What Happens When You Install the Top Download.com Apps

#152

Post by Anthony-G »

syllogism wrote: post #45
apetrovic wrote: post #27

Microsoft dropped the ball with lack of App Store. With all app store's drawbacks, that's the place where regular user can pay easily without thinking will someone steal his/her credit car number, the place where applications should be harmless, and the place where (and this is important) the user can compare prices between similar applications. Windows doesn't have the app store. And nobody (read: very, very small p…

When I finally left Windows for Linux on my desktop, this was why. The $0 app market on Windows was terrible. Even if it wasn't installing malware, everything was implicitly user hostile. I remember in the early 2000s, the form this took was every application eventually tried to steal your media file associations. The last straw was when I had to do a fresh install, and the Nero CD burning software was 200mb, because…

Hah! I'd forgot about all those annoyances. Back then I had a modem and a crappy phone line with a maximum transfer speed of 25 kbits/second. I had to be really careful about what software I'd install from the Internet. In fact, most of the software that I installed came from CDs packaged with trustworthy computer magazines.

Aside from the pre-yum dependecy hell, Red Hat Linux was a breath of fresh air.

Re: What Happens When You Install the Top Download.com Apps

#153

Post by acdha »

iSnow wrote: post #51
aaronbrethorst wrote: post #41

And this is why Apple created Gatekeeper and made the Mac OS X App Store so ridiculously onerous for developers[1]. The software world is, for all intents and purposes, a thin sheen of gold flecks and diamonds atop a veritable cesspool of shit. You can just imagine the conversation at 1 Infinite Loop: Marketer: The Panic guys are considering pulling out of the App Store. Maybe we should reconsider our App Store strat…

Ironic, considering that Apple did exactly the same, when you installed QuickTime on Windows. They tried to trick you into installing iTunes and Safari and set them as default apps. Also, it stinks that Apple has nailed iOS that shut that even as a knowledgeable user you are not able to bypass it. They did not yet dare to do the same on Mac OS, but who knows when that comes.

> Also, it stinks that Apple has nailed iOS that shut that even as a knowledgeable user you are not able to bypass it.

I agree with that feeling wrong but consider it from the perspective of anyone who cares about security. We live in a world where millions of people have fallen for attacks which required them to type in their admin password and okay a software install, open the web console and paste JavaScript in to compromise their own account (see e.g. https://www.facebook.com/help/246962205475854), install custom Android apps which then exfiltrate data or attempt local exploits, etc.

Apple chose not to allow that for iOS to ban that class of attacks outright. I've reconsidered my previous cynical conclusion that this was just to boost the app store profits based on the number of people I've heard mention using an iPad because they don't have to worry about installing programs; now I think the real profit comes from the trust in the platform – you need an awful lot of $.30 app profits to balance out a single device purchase.

I'm not enthusiastic about heading into the no-user-serviceable-parts world but it's not like the traditional PC model has worked out well when the majority of non-technical users has some level of dread/acceptance that they'll make a mistake and be compromised.

Re: What Happens When You Install the Top Download.com Apps

#154

Post by normloman »

weavie wrote: post #95
weavie wrote: post #84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I can't find my InDesign icon... where have you put it?

InDesign is the industry standard. There may be loads of OS alternatives, but unfortunately for people who can only just use a mouse and have invested years into learning that one package they just aren't going to be willing to invest a lot of time into exploring the alternatives.

I think the point was, most people like the OPs parents just use their computers for web browsing. And all of today's best web browsers run on linux.

I helped my parents switch to linux mint, and it's been fairly successful.

Re: What Happens When You Install the Top Download.com Apps

#155

Post by tsaoutourpants »

jmilloy wrote: post #151

I agree that there is a lot of useless software, malware, and annoying bundling on download.com and in the Windows software ecosystem at large. But seriously, it's not hard to avoid installing a lot of bundled software. I'd be more interested in what happens when you install the Top Download.com Apps without the obviously bundled crap. And I'm certainly not interested in hearing complaints about what the programs do…

How is it unintelligent to point out that downloading a few apps from a (formerly) reputable source of free apps results in your computer being basically unusable? What the article showed shouldn't happen, and it did despite download.com's assurances that it wouldn't.

Re: What Happens When You Install the Top Download.com Apps

#157

Post by huhtenberg »

sireat wrote: post #134
huhtenberg wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> And nobody (read: very, very small percentage) is willing to type the credit car number on some unknown site to pay for some utility. So shareware died, and shareware authors went to the dark side. HAHAHA. Oh, jeez... /wipes a tear. You clearly have no idea how the shareware model actually works. Shareware is very very far from being dead. Yes, some of the devs take the lazy path of bundling crap, but it is an abso…

Serious question, is there shareware which is not dead today? Where are the shareware success stories? Where is PC-Write, PKZip or Commander Keen of 2015? I'd even settle for WinRAR of today.

Shareware today is basically a trialware from smaller/indie developers. As such, there's a plenty if you look beyond the company facades.

Just go to Softpedia, pull up a Windows app section and filter in Paid apps. The vast majority of what you see is shareware. NetBalancer, Syncovery, AX64, various PDF viewers, drive emulators for cloud storage services, etc. - all of these are made either by a single person or smaller teams. There are TONS of them; you just didn't realize it :)

Then if you extend the definition to just "trialware" and include larger companies, then pretty much all commercial Windows software is now shareware. You try it and then you buy it. Kaspersky, Acronis, Norton bloatware. Microsoft Office is offered under this model. Heck, even Windows itself is.

Re: What Happens When You Install the Top Download.com Apps

#158

Post by acdha »

weavie wrote: post #38
BSousa wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can't you do something similar with Windows Restore points?

I seem to recall getting burnt by them a long time ago, so I've never trusted them. Are they stable now?

They're only useful for simple problems – e.g. a user-level compromise or an innocent mistake by non-malware. If anything malicious ever gets admin privileges, you still need to reinstall from scratch.

Since you need a real backup solution either way I've always disabled restore points since they're at best redundant.

Re: What Happens When You Install the Top Download.com Apps

#159

Post by wampus »

petecooper wrote: post #143

Mobile computer tech, here. War story follows. I handle high single-figures of these adware and/or potentially unwanted programs (PUPs) infestations every week. Mostly it's Windows 7 and 90% adware/PUPs-centric, occasionally ransomware. In the huge majority of cases, the following will get a computer back up and sorted in a sensible amount of (billable) time: First, bring known-good copies of AdwCleaner, Junkware Rem…

The problem with using cleaning tools like the ones you mention is that I'm always left wondering, "What did I miss?" when they've finished. Since it's a long process that's always potentially incomplete, I abandoned that approach years ago. The first thing I ask a client is "What data do you want to keep?" Then I scan the drive offline (mostly for my own curiosity, but also to get an idea of what I'm dealing with), save the data, reinstall the OS from scratch, then restore the data (sometimes with additional scans). This is the only way I feel comfortable handing the computer back to the client.

Re: What Happens When You Install the Top Download.com Apps

#160

Post by swies »

TeMPOraL wrote: post #15
Renaud wrote: post #14

Instead of dowloading from Sourceforge (loaded with ads and its own devious 'installer'), CNET, Download, etc, there are no-crapware alternatives that offer more management tools as well (remembering your list of apps across machines, automated updates, discoverability): Ninite: nice, simple, installer: just select apps and let the installer do it all for you. AllMyApps: all the apps, no crapware (at least for now).…

A nice list. How long they're all around? I still can't shake the feeling that it's only a matter of time before Moloch gets to them and they'll start serving crapware like any others. I'd love to be wrong on that.

Ninite Co-Founder here.

Our pro-version SAAS business model works great.

Plus we started Ninite because junkware enraged us so much. It's just punching down at non-technical users. I'd kill the company before doing that.

Anyway, we'll be around and junkware free until the world moves to platforms where everything's signed and sandboxed.

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