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Je Suis Charlie

charliehebdo.fr

161–170 of 292 posts

Re: Je Suis Charlie

#161
post #61
post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

People being murdered is a shame, but the only way that it can stifle freedom of speech is if we let it. Obviously the person(s) murdered lose their ability to exercise that freedom when they're murdered, but the point is to continue pushing forward as a whole. Doing that requires us to all decide to continue to utilize our freedom.

As long as the number of people that choose to exercise their freedom of expression does not fall you are right. Let's just hope that people do not begin to follow extremist muslim law out of fear for their lives.

There is no muslim (extremist or not) law that encourages these acts, research it. You can tweak any law to do exactly as you wanted to do and that's what those people are doing. The last thing I know about a war (if we put this as a kind of war) is don't cut trees, don't kill non-armed soldier, women, children or old people but they keep beheading people on national television.

Re: Je Suis Charlie

#162

308 points in 2 hours and 121 comments... and listed at #24. Ranked below stories like: 2. 121 points, 3 hours ago , 26 comments 3. 69 points , 2 hours ago , 22 comments 5. 138 points, 4 hours ago , 33 comments 8. 80 points , 4 hours ago , 28 comments 9. 46 points , 3 hours ago , 10 comments 10. 56 points , 3 hours ago , 19 comments Looks like it's being flagged left and right. Why? What if, instead of Charlie, it wa…

If we're not supposed to comment when we flag articles[1], does it really make sense to ask why?

For the record, I hit flag because while this was an outrageous act of barbarism, and indeed freedom of speech is important for all of us, the link does not particularly gratify intellectual curiosity[1]. Nor do I think it's a good idea to start discussing even significant non-hacker news of the day here. The (relative) focus of the hn community is one reason we have such an amazing stable of regular commenters.

[1] https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

Re: Je Suis Charlie

#163
post #27
post #22

This is horrible, and we as a society need to somehow make this kind of thing not happen. I have no idea what that means in practice, though. It seems everything that has been tried so far has only escalated the hatred and strengthened the extremists. Also, at a time like this it is important not to forget that the last major terrorist attack in Europe was instigated by a fundamentalist christian norwegian. https://e…

> How is freedom of speech best defended in the face of unreasonable people who have no limits to what they are prepared to do? By everyone continuing to utilize their freedom of speech. It's really that simple. The only way to lose is to not make use of your freedom.

> By everyone continuing to utilize their freedom of speech. It's really that simple. The only way to lose is to not make use of your freedom.

Do you think normal daily newspapers should print the cartoons? How about KKK cartoon propaganda? How about "With Jews you lose"? http://www.dailystormer.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/09/with-...

Re: Je Suis Charlie

#164

308 points in 2 hours and 121 comments... and listed at #24. Ranked below stories like: 2. 121 points, 3 hours ago , 26 comments 3. 69 points , 2 hours ago , 22 comments 5. 138 points, 4 hours ago , 33 comments 8. 80 points , 4 hours ago , 28 comments 9. 46 points , 3 hours ago , 10 comments 10. 56 points , 3 hours ago , 19 comments Looks like it's being flagged left and right. Why? What if, instead of Charlie, it wa…

> Martin Niemoller's "First they came for the Communists...." Seriously? You're making a comparison to the Nazis? Edit: It's 3 assholes with assault rifles, not a totalitarian state. Can we calibrate our references to be a bit less hysterical and hyperbolic?

[deleted]

Re: Je Suis Charlie

#165
post #150

I'm a muslim and I found most of cartoons by Charlie Hebdo funny, however the cartoon about the prophet didn't upset me at all but was not funny. It did however trigger something: this is how people actually see this religion, a bomb on a prophet's head. The reality is what makes something funny or not. Should this be the end of making funny of anything or raising questions/ideas, no. However a journalist's job is no…

It's not a journalist's job to upset people? What a strange opinion and who do you suppose should judge?

it is still an opinion (you know free speech). I assume in a civilized world, when you make a statement that upset somebody, you apologize. Something like http://xkcd.com/814

Re: Je Suis Charlie

#166

308 points in 2 hours and 121 comments... and listed at #24. Ranked below stories like: 2. 121 points, 3 hours ago , 26 comments 3. 69 points , 2 hours ago , 22 comments 5. 138 points, 4 hours ago , 33 comments 8. 80 points , 4 hours ago , 28 comments 9. 46 points , 3 hours ago , 10 comments 10. 56 points , 3 hours ago , 19 comments Looks like it's being flagged left and right. Why? What if, instead of Charlie, it wa…

These aren't the moderate Muslims you are looking for. Move along.

Re: Je Suis Charlie

#167
post #152
post #144

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think HN is trying not to have stories like this here. I have to admit I was really curious about this community's reaction (as reddit's reaction is pretty... violent). But afterall is HN really the place to discuss such things?

I think one post as an outlet is fine, but I agree that HN is not the best place for seat-of-the-pants style outrage. I'm looking forward to quality posts written after the initial shock and outrage has subsided.

yup, maybe a post to recapitulate everything in 5 days might be better (grow of right movement, germany's reaction, france's resolutions, etc...)

Re: Je Suis Charlie

#168
post #163
post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> How is freedom of speech best defended in the face of unreasonable people who have no limits to what they are prepared to do? By everyone continuing to utilize their freedom of speech. It's really that simple. The only way to lose is to not make use of your freedom.

> By everyone continuing to utilize their freedom of speech. It's really that simple. The only way to lose is to not make use of your freedom. Do you think normal daily newspapers should print the cartoons? How about KKK cartoon propaganda? How about "With Jews you lose"? http://www.dailystormer.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/09/with-...

I don't really see how this is the same thing. Can you elaborate?

Re: Je Suis Charlie

#169
post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Even if they weren't even-handed, it wouldn't change a thing. They could be publishing a newspaper named "Fuck Muhammad" and it'd still be equally wrong for them to have been attacked in this way. I'm not entirely sure why we coddle religious fanatics as we do, but it needs to stop for us to progress as a society.

Oh, I agree, it's just that the impression the FT tries to give ("Charlie Hebdo, the newspaper specialized in Muslim-baiting") is wrong. Hopefully nobody reading this thinks it's entirely reasonable to shoot people for a drawing.

But they are supposed to be free to practice their religion, which means shooting people for a drawing. Maybe religious freedom should not extend to psychopathic ideologies just as freedom to bear arms does not extend to personal nuclear weapons.

Re: Je Suis Charlie

#170
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