Je Suis Charlie • Hacker News Board

Re: Je Suis Charlie

#31

Post by mikeash » Wed, Jan 07, 2015, 6:07 PM UTC

krig wrote: post #22

This is horrible, and we as a society need to somehow make this kind of thing not happen. I have no idea what that means in practice, though. It seems everything that has been tried so far has only escalated the hatred and strengthened the extremists. Also, at a time like this it is important not to forget that the last major terrorist attack in Europe was instigated by a fundamentalist christian norwegian. https://e…

I don't think technology or psychology is yet sufficiently advanced to be able to stop this stuff altogether.

However horrible it may sound, I think our best course of action is to accept that these things do happen occasionally. That doesn't mean we shouldn't fight them, and that doesn't mean we shouldn't do our best to prevent them, but it does mean that we must accept that we'll never get to 100%.

If we can move forward with the idea that we'll do our best to reduce these attacks as much as possible, rather than with the idea that we'll eliminate them, I think the result will be much better.

As for what to do, I think the combination of smart intelligence (as opposed to NSA-style dragnets) and emergency response (to minimize the effects of attacks after they happen) are the way to go.

Edit: whee, downvotes. If you think I'm wrong, or even just right but insensitive, would you mind explaining yourself instead of (or, heck, in addition to) downvoting? I honestly don't see anything wrong with my comment.

Re: Je Suis Charlie

#32

Post by dankohn1 » Wed, Jan 07, 2015, 6:09 PM UTC

gouggoug wrote: post #21

Some context for people wondering what this is about. Wednesday 7th, at 11am, 3 people entered "Charlie Hebdo" a very well known French satirical newspaper and shot 12 people with kalashnikov. Charlie Hebdo is also known, for their caricatures of the prophet Mahomet. "Je Suis Charlie" means, "I Am Charlie" and is a message of support to the newspaper. This is obviously a very short sum-up.

And "Je Suis Charlie" echoes Kennedy's famous line: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ich_bin_ein_Berliner

Re: Je Suis Charlie

#33

Post by daeken » Wed, Jan 07, 2015, 6:09 PM UTC

aaronem wrote: post #29

daeken wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> How is freedom of speech best defended in the face of unreasonable people who have no limits to what they are prepared to do? By everyone continuing to utilize their freedom of speech. It's really that simple. The only way to lose is to not make use of your freedom.

Being murdered for what you say seems like, if not precisely losing, then being at least removed from the board.

People being murdered is a shame, but the only way that it can stifle freedom of speech is if we let it. Obviously the person(s) murdered lose their ability to exercise that freedom when they're murdered, but the point is to continue pushing forward as a whole. Doing that requires us to all decide to continue to utilize our freedom.

Re: Je Suis Charlie

#34

Post by mercurial » Wed, Jan 07, 2015, 6:09 PM UTC

krig wrote: post #22

This is horrible, and we as a society need to somehow make this kind of thing not happen. I have no idea what that means in practice, though. It seems everything that has been tried so far has only escalated the hatred and strengthened the extremists. Also, at a time like this it is important not to forget that the last major terrorist attack in Europe was instigated by a fundamentalist christian norwegian. https://e…

> Also, at a time like this it is important not to forget that the last major terrorist attack in Europe was instigated by a fundamentalist christian norwegian. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anders_Behring_Breivik

Sure. And there were also numerous bombings and attacks in Europe by left-wing extremists during the "years of lead". That said, the difference between Breivik and these guys is just the beard length. Right-wing nutjobs are right-wing nutjobs, whatever their creed.

Re: Je Suis Charlie

#35

Post by Kiro » Wed, Jan 07, 2015, 6:09 PM UTC

blfr wrote: post #23

robteix wrote: post #3

I wonder if the debate in the media will focus on religious fanaticism or if they'll start victim blaming by arguing that Charlie Hebdo was asking for it, being provocative.

Religious fanaticism? Were the attackers Buddhists? Shintoists? Jews?

Can muslims not be religious fanatics or what do you mean? Sorry if I missed something obvious with your comment.

Re: Je Suis Charlie

#36

Post by mikeash » Wed, Jan 07, 2015, 6:10 PM UTC

manticore_alpha wrote: post #8

ankurpatel wrote: post #2

Can someone explain what this is suppose to mean? I know there were attacks in Paris.

"We are Charlie" Your EQ is low, isn't it?

It's likely that the person you're replying to didn't know the details of the attack or how it has anything to do with "Charlie."

But hey, jumping straight to a personal attack instead of an explanation says volumes about your EQ.

Re: Je Suis Charlie

#37

Post by frozenport » Wed, Jan 07, 2015, 6:11 PM UTC

aaronem wrote: post #28

krig wrote: post #22

This is horrible, and we as a society need to somehow make this kind of thing not happen. I have no idea what that means in practice, though. It seems everything that has been tried so far has only escalated the hatred and strengthened the extremists. Also, at a time like this it is important not to forget that the last major terrorist attack in Europe was instigated by a fundamentalist christian norwegian. https://e…

By force of arms. What else is there?

Trolling web-boards?

Re: Je Suis Charlie

#38

Post by Shivetya » Wed, Jan 07, 2015, 6:11 PM UTC

robteix wrote: post #3

I wonder if the debate in the media will focus on religious fanaticism or if they'll start victim blaming by arguing that Charlie Hebdo was asking for it, being provocative.

Well you can look at it based on how each news source labeled it, some stated terrorist, some stated attackers, some called it out for they religion they are, Islamic.

Far too many people fear to name it for what it is.

Re: Je Suis Charlie

#39

Post by daeken » Wed, Jan 07, 2015, 6:11 PM UTC

aaronem wrote: post #28

krig wrote: post #22

This is horrible, and we as a society need to somehow make this kind of thing not happen. I have no idea what that means in practice, though. It seems everything that has been tried so far has only escalated the hatred and strengthened the extremists. Also, at a time like this it is important not to forget that the last major terrorist attack in Europe was instigated by a fundamentalist christian norwegian. https://e…

By force of arms. What else is there?

Guns might preserve the freedom of speech of a few people. Words preserve freedom of speech for everyone else.

"An eye for an eye leaves the whole world blind."

Re: Je Suis Charlie

#40

Post by tokenadult » Wed, Jan 07, 2015, 6:11 PM UTC

Posted on my Facebook wall immediately. Thanks for sharing the link. Earlier today, I was searching for news stories about the shooting incident in Paris that would actually show the cartoons published by Charlie Hebdo to establish context for how cowardly and despicable the shooting was. Most English-language press outlets are not showing the cartoons. A comment on one news site pointed out that Spanish-language media are generally not being so gutless today, so I linked a slideshow from El Pais[1] on my Facebook wall so that my friends could see that the shooting is all about suppressing free speech.

[1] http://elpais.com/elpais/2015/01/07/album/1420632020_829679....