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Fasting triggers stem cell regeneration of damaged, old immune system (2014)

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Re: Fasting triggers stem cell regeneration of damaged, old immune system (2014)

#121

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is there any evidence that fasting for 3 days is not safe or is this just an assumption? As I understand it is perfectly safe for all but the most fragile people.

As long as you're in good health and stay hydrated, you can safely fast for almost 30 days. http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/25552155 "Conclusion: Ramadan fasting is associated with transiently impaired insulin sensitivity, compensated for by an increased p3-cell function. However, the pattern of insulin resistance-mediating adipocytokines suggests a potentially beneficial metabolic effect of Ramadan fasting." http…

Ramadan is fasting in the same way that only having sex at night maintains virginity.

Re: Fasting triggers stem cell regeneration of damaged, old immune system (2014)

#122

Earlier quoted context omitted.

True, we need to be able to reproduce and confirm technically that fasting correctly is good for people. But you cannot simply ignore millenia of anecdotal evidence that people who fast simply are more healthier. I find it odd that it's now considered normal to stuff yourself all the time, when historically before maybe a century ago it was considered totally normal to not eat all the time(involuntarily or otherwise)…

What millennia of anecdotal evidence? I've heard claims like that before, but never seen the source of any of these claims. Really? In the past it was common not to eat, voluntarily? That seems hard to believe with how central food is to every culture I've ever been exposed to. In fact you are seen as odd if you choose NOT to partake when others are. If this is common knowledge to you it is certainly not for me, whic…

I am not sure what OP had in mind about fasting, but I recall studies done on lab mouse related to this subject. Studies were about increasing average life expectancy. The results were that the only meaningful increase of life span was gained by limiting food ration. I don't think it was fasting, but amount of food consumed does seem to have significant effect. They claimed life expectancy increased up to 30%.

Re: Fasting triggers stem cell regeneration of damaged, old immune system (2014)

#123
post #35

Forget the study, people belonging to Jainism know this for centuries. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jainism

No reason to downvote this guy, he has a valid point. Scientists should look at the wisdom of people.

It's important to remember that anecdotal evidence is not scientific in any way. Just because there exists "peoples' wisdom" doesn't mean that this wisdom is correct. This is why science exists in the first place, to explore and explain natural phenomena.

Re: Fasting triggers stem cell regeneration of damaged, old immune system (2014)

#124
post #107

i fasted for 14 days on spirulina tablets and water as an office bet to prove its effectiveness and still take it everyday. every now and then i do 3-5 day fast to cleanse my body, but technically i'm still eating food. i have yet to do any blood tests to prove its effectiveness besides my own experiments and what i've read. i also don't recommend people doing a fast for 14 days...maybe 3-5 days at first. after the f…

Can you share further reading material or studies behind spirulina?

The wikipedia page on the topic appears reasonably good: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spirulina_(dietary_supplement)

However it can't be the only thing you eat. There were some studies about using spirulina on a spacecraft (or sub) for both 100% of oxygen and food. While it was feasible, it was pretty energy intensive and would tend to kill you after a few months. Something about more protein in the blood than your kidneys could filter? Will try to find a link.

Re: Fasting triggers stem cell regeneration of damaged, old immune system (2014)

#125
post #35

Forget the study, people belonging to Jainism know this for centuries. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jainism

No reason to downvote this guy, he has a valid point. Scientists should look at the wisdom of people.

If I can venture a possible explanation of downvotes while noting I always prefer a respectful reply than a downvote for any disagreement.

Every religion since forever has claimed their religious practices are beneficial. Such claims are not science regardless of the religion and, importantly they aren't science even if the claim turns out to be true.

If you have a properly executed study gathering the data correctly and doing a dispassionate analysis on the effects of fasting as practised by Jainism or any other religion that's worth looking at. The easiest person to fool is always yourself and never is it easier than when looking at something about which you feel particularly strongly such as your religious beliefs and practices. Claims from religious devotees (or former devotees) about fasting or magic underwear, or genital mutilation benefits or miseries should be completely disregarded. Evidence properly gathered, analyzed and capable of being falsified about those same things should be taken with the seriousness it deserves. Religious claims might give one an idea about where to look but should but not be mistaken for any kind of rigor in themselves. Or you end up with truly barbaric, unnecessary medical "treatment" that needs to be consigned to horrific sections of history texts where mercifully at least some of it has now been.

Properly done science is how you know if any given claim is true, false or its truth is still yet unknown and possibly still unknowable.

Re: Fasting triggers stem cell regeneration of damaged, old immune system (2014)

#126

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What millennia of anecdotal evidence? I've heard claims like that before, but never seen the source of any of these claims. Really? In the past it was common not to eat, voluntarily? That seems hard to believe with how central food is to every culture I've ever been exposed to. In fact you are seen as odd if you choose NOT to partake when others are. If this is common knowledge to you it is certainly not for me, whic…

I am not sure what OP had in mind about fasting, but I recall studies done on lab mouse related to this subject. Studies were about increasing average life expectancy. The results were that the only meaningful increase of life span was gained by limiting food ration. I don't think it was fasting, but amount of food consumed does seem to have significant effect. They claimed life expectancy increased up to 30%.

I remember that study. It was the basis of the intermittent fasting/restricted calories movement. Unfortunately they were unable to replicate it when they changed animals (I don't remember if the subsequent study was on primates or humans).

Re: Fasting triggers stem cell regeneration of damaged, old immune system (2014)

#127

I've been eating once a day for the past 3.5 years and I'd read about the supposed immune system benefits. I've not had a cold/flu since then and I used to get 3-4 a year, so I'm sticking with it and I've become used to it anyway.

This is called intermittent fasting (one way to do it), and there is some very interesting research (on mice) that suggests caloric restriction to a few hours a day has positive effects on obesity and diabetes. Science Friday episode with one of the researchers: http://www.sciencefriday.com/segment/12/05/2014/you-are-when...

Re: Fasting triggers stem cell regeneration of damaged, old immune system (2014)

#128

Earlier quoted context omitted.

for the sake of argument let's assume there is a God. and let's say He was better than all the things He created. better than that awesome sunset that you saw that took your breath away; better than that favorite meal you love -- you know the one. love is giving the object of your love the best... the best you've got. what if God giving Himself was Love defined? just for argument's sake...

That's a bad assumption to start with because there is no evidence of such a thing. "just for the sake of argument, let's assume there are invisible horses everywhere. (followed by explanation of how these horses are responsible for love)"

Your epistemology and categories are already flawed, as if there's an analogy between a thing (like a horse) and the Ground of Being (classically called "God"). God in classical theism is not a "thing" among things. If you think classical theism posits deity the same way people posit horses, of course you'll want "evidence" that is empirical.

So wouldn't it be helpful, for the sake of the thought experiment proposed by shawndumas, to at least see where his reasoning leads? The premise ("There is a God") might not be true, but an a priori exclusion of such a being seems no more based on logic than the counter claim. What is helpful, I think, is if by looking through those lenses we see if God gives the world more explanatory power than by not looking through those lenses.

Re: Fasting triggers stem cell regeneration of damaged, old immune system (2014)

#129

I recognize this as completely empirical evidence, so take it as that. I am a Mormon. As part of our religious observance, we fast for 2 meals on the first Sunday of every month. Also, I have fasted for the entire duration of the Muslim month of Ramadan twice now. For Mormons, food and drink is abstained starting Saturday night after dinner until Sunday night's dinner. By the time dinner rolls around Sunday night, I…

Is there any study comparing observant Mormons vs. a similar population showing better health?

Likewise, is there any study comparing observant Muslims vs. a similar population showing better health?

It would be interesting to see either. I'm skeptical (because I feel like every religion claims that their particular diet has health benefits) but open to seeing a study.

Re: Fasting triggers stem cell regeneration of damaged, old immune system (2014)

#130
post #98

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Mormons claim Christianity and espouse some Christian principals (i.e. blood atonement for sins of the world), although many of their beliefs (i.e. God is an evolved man and through adherence to Mormon doctrine men can become Gods after death) put them well outside the realm of what is considered mainstream Christianity. I'm not sure these additional beliefs necessarily disqualify them as "Christian" though as they d…

> i.e. blood atonement for sins of the world That was never a christian belief to begin with. The atonement was (supposedly) because of God's own incarnation as Christ, our of love, not because of some blood offering to God (i.e. the crucifixion, which was not even meant as such, anyway).

I realize modern religion has tried to blunt the concept (it's all about love etc)... but blood atonement figures very prominently in the doctrine presented in the bible...

Romans3:25, Hebrews9:22, Rev1:5 for instance. There are plenty more. Very prominent concept. Which is why up until recently there was plenty of talk about being "washed in the blood" in Christian churches.

(I believe the manifest brutal cruelty and outright ridiculousness of the concept was one of the primary things leading to my rejection of Christianity at a very early age.... no offense to anyone's particular faith... just my point of view)

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