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Ai Weiwei Is Living in Our Future

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Re: Ai Weiwei Is Living in Our Future

#41

Post by brianbarker »

thaumaturgy wrote: post #35
c1sc0 wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Serious question: where do we start when we want to fight this? We made it through the industrial revolution because people stood up for their rights. I'm at a total loss for where to start. (Edit: grammar)

Like with many other causes, you start with yourself -- and that might be enough. These days, not participating in the latest electronics and social sites and whatnot is enough to make people ask you questions. If you think carefully enough about why you're making the choices you make, then you can give pretty reasonable answers. I don't own a smart phone, or have a Facebook or LinkedIn account. I still buy paper boo…

A flip phone doesn't really stop surveillance. They still track where you are, who you call. Sure, maybe no app data, but since you don't use Facebook and such that data wouldn't be there anyway.

Re: Ai Weiwei Is Living in Our Future

#42

Post by cromwellian »

desdiv wrote: post #26
charleslmunger wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What technology is google producing for the military?

Boston Dynamics, a wholly owned subsidiary of Google, produced the WildCat robot for DARPA's Maximum Mobility and Manipulation (M3) program[0]. [0] http://www.darpa.mil/our_work/dso/programs/maximum_mobility_...

Most of that work was done before Google bought the company, and Google is not renewing those contracts.

Google is not a defense contractor. As frequently beaten as a dead horse on HN, Google sells ads, not weapons.

DARPA funds lots of projects that eventually get inherited by the private sector. SIRI funding at SRI was provided by DARPA, does that make Apple a defense contractor?

Guilt by association usually produces bad analysis.

Re: Ai Weiwei Is Living in Our Future

#43

Post by yohui »

desdiv wrote: post #26
charleslmunger wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What technology is google producing for the military?

Boston Dynamics, a wholly owned subsidiary of Google, produced the WildCat robot for DARPA's Maximum Mobility and Manipulation (M3) program[0]. [0] http://www.darpa.mil/our_work/dso/programs/maximum_mobility_...

That's somewhat misleading. Boston Dynamics made those robots for DARPA before Google acquired them. After Google acquired them, they announced that they would not seek further military contracts in the future.

Re: Ai Weiwei Is Living in Our Future

#44

Post by yohui »

sabalaba wrote: post #2

Pretty alarmist writing. "I therefore can’t resist showing a new piece of Google technology: the military robot ‘WildCat’ made by Boston Dynamics which was bought by Google in December 2013". And goes on to show a video of something that was funded by DARPA well before Google purchased Boston Dynamics. Google has already said multiple times that it won't be pursuing any military contracts.

Rather disjointed, too. Even if Google were developing robots for the military, as the author implies, it's a bit of a stretch to jump from discussing Snowden, to Boston Dynamics, and then back to the NSA within the span of a paragraph. I felt a bit of whiplash there.

(Incidentally, Google declined to pursue future military contracts after acquiring Boston Dynamics, along with a host of other robotics companies, so presenting that pre-acquisition video after accusing Google of being ”part of the military industrial complex” is bit of a non-sequitor.)

Re: Ai Weiwei Is Living in Our Future

#45

Post by rasengan0 »

We'll all take the red pill someday, but I swallowed the blue one already. I found the article enlightening, reminding me of the continued complacency and abject indifference in favor of convenience and other affordances of mindless empty rewards (yay, startups!) much like the Radiohead 1997 song, Fitter Happier https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/OK_Computer

I missed the whole Ai Weiwei media storm due to disinterest and made up assumptions about yet another dissenter getting hammered down by the State; like duh? What else is new over "there"? Well on the internets, where is there or here? The article actually made me pause playing FTL to Google Ai WeiWei and watch the streamed Netflix documentary: http://aiweiweineversorry.com/ Wow, here was someone who could have kept his mouth shut and kept kowtowing to rake in the bucks, but instead choose a new "career path" out of politics and got a fat tax bill for the trouble. Gutsy move or sending a message? Let's hope the next generation gives damn.

Re: Ai Weiwei Is Living in Our Future

#47

Post by desdiv »

thaumaturgy wrote: post #38
kingkawn wrote: post #34

In the efforts to improve surveillance they have given us the tools to subvert it. Yes, they can watch us all, but we can also all watch each other. Yes, we have nothing to be ashamed of, and they no longer control the ability to spread ideas about what is shameful. When they are abusing one person, everyone can know. Ai Wei Wei would not still be in communication with the world without the same technology that is pe…

> Yes, we have nothing to be ashamed of I'm going to mostly side-step the de facto response to this ("surveillance isn't about shame, it's about control, etc. etc."), because the more interesting thing here is that there's a good chance your point of view is going to become the predominant one in future generations. Generations like mine were taught that privacy was important for freedom (e.g. 1984), and even though…

I disagree. Public opinion polls clearly show that the younger generation is more intolerant of the NSA mass surveillance[0][1], for example.

Sometimes the difference can be startling:

Once again, there was a significant relationship between age group and support for monitoring everyone’s online activity. Only 15% of Canadians aged 18 to 29 believed that the Canadian government should monitor online activities if officials say it might prevent future terrorist attacks compared with 34% of those aged 30 to 44 and 43% for those aged 45 to 59.[2]

That's almost a three fold difference between the 18 to 29 group and the 45 to 59 group.

[0] http://www.people-press.org/2013/06/10/majority-views-nsa-ph...

[1] http://www.people-press.org/2013/06/17/public-split-over-imp...

[2] http://abacusinsider.com/politics-public-affairs/nsa-snowden...

Re: Ai Weiwei Is Living in Our Future

#48

Post by courtf »

"According to him, we have allowed efficiency thinking to optimize our world to such an extent that we have lost the flexibility and slack that is necessary for dealing with failure. This is why we can no longer handle any form of risk."

This rings true to me in many ways, particularly in the way we treat our children. I may have to read Anti-fragile.

Re: Ai Weiwei Is Living in Our Future

#49

Post by thaumaturgy »

desdiv wrote: post #47
thaumaturgy wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Yes, we have nothing to be ashamed of I'm going to mostly side-step the de facto response to this ("surveillance isn't about shame, it's about control, etc. etc."), because the more interesting thing here is that there's a good chance your point of view is going to become the predominant one in future generations. Generations like mine were taught that privacy was important for freedom (e.g. 1984), and even though…

I disagree. Public opinion polls clearly show that the younger generation is more intolerant of the NSA mass surveillance[0][1], for example. Sometimes the difference can be startling: Once again, there was a significant relationship between age group and support for monitoring everyone’s online activity. Only 15% of Canadians aged 18 to 29 believed that the Canadian government should monitor online activities if off…

Thanks for the studies. That's good news.

I'd nitpick though that there's a substantial difference between "government surveillance to stop terrorism" and "volunteer my personal information everywhere because I get cool things for it". For instance, most Snapchat users are between the ages of 13 and 25 (according to http://www.businessinsider.com/a-primer-on-snapchat-and-its-...).

Re: Ai Weiwei Is Living in Our Future

#50

Post by desdiv »

thaumaturgy wrote: post #49
desdiv wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I disagree. Public opinion polls clearly show that the younger generation is more intolerant of the NSA mass surveillance[0][1], for example. Sometimes the difference can be startling: Once again, there was a significant relationship between age group and support for monitoring everyone’s online activity. Only 15% of Canadians aged 18 to 29 believed that the Canadian government should monitor online activities if off…

Thanks for the studies. That's good news. I'd nitpick though that there's a substantial difference between "government surveillance to stop terrorism" and "volunteer my personal information everywhere because I get cool things for it". For instance, most Snapchat users are between the ages of 13 and 25 (according to http://www.businessinsider.com/a-primer-on-snapchat-and-its-... ).

most Snapchat users are between the ages of 13 and 25

Isn't that an argument for the younger generation being more privacy-conscious? I.e. that they're willing to forgo the convenience of a message history in exchange for more privacy in their communications?

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