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India Orders 32 Websites Blocked, Including GitHub, Archive.Org, Pastebin

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Re: India Orders 32 Websites Blocked, Including GitHub, Archive.Org, Pastebin

#61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As crazy as it sounds some HN users defend ISIS. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=8808630

Saying that ISIS isn't a terrorist organization doesn't mean that user is defending the organization. Terrorist has become a catch-all term that is used way too broadly (seems to cover any armed force motivated by Islam for many people). ISIS can be an awful organization without consisting of terrorists.

They are terrorizing local populations for a political goal. They are not just fighting battles they are slaughtering civilians into compliance. How is that not terrorism?

Edit: He also claimed that it would be better if ISIS was in charge of the area. That is quite ridiculous.

Re: India Orders 32 Websites Blocked, Including GitHub, Archive.Org, Pastebin

#63
post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As crazy as it sounds some HN users defend ISIS. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=8808630

He has a point, you know. His claims are: 1) IS is not a terrorist organization, it is an army. 2) IS is better, or at least not worse, than existing middle east governments. 1 seems pretty obvious to me. Sure, they are terrorizing the local population, but lots of governments do that without being labeled terrorists. 2 is more difficult to swallow. Many ME governments are pure garbage, but IS looks a lot worse.

Exactly. His point is well stated too, and ironically the grandparent in this thread fell victim to the mode of thought the author of the linked comment cautions against.

Re: India Orders 32 Websites Blocked, Including GitHub, Archive.Org, Pastebin

#64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Saying that ISIS isn't a terrorist organization doesn't mean that user is defending the organization. Terrorist has become a catch-all term that is used way too broadly (seems to cover any armed force motivated by Islam for many people). ISIS can be an awful organization without consisting of terrorists.

They are terrorizing local populations for a political goal. They are not just fighting battles they are slaughtering civilians into compliance. How is that not terrorism? Edit: He also claimed that it would be better if ISIS was in charge of the area. That is quite ridiculous.

Would you define US drone strikes as attempts at terrorizing the target populations?

Re: India Orders 32 Websites Blocked, Including GitHub, Archive.Org, Pastebin

#65
post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As crazy as it sounds some HN users defend ISIS. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=8808630

He has a point, you know. His claims are: 1) IS is not a terrorist organization, it is an army. 2) IS is better, or at least not worse, than existing middle east governments. 1 seems pretty obvious to me. Sure, they are terrorizing the local population, but lots of governments do that without being labeled terrorists. 2 is more difficult to swallow. Many ME governments are pure garbage, but IS looks a lot worse.

> Sure, they are terrorizing the local population, but lots of governments do that without being labeled terrorists.

...including the US government, let's not forget.

Drone strikes aren't "local" to the US, but they are conducted against US citizens in countries that the US is not at war with[0]. Moreover, if any middle eastern country did to the US what the US does in Pakistan, you'd bet the US would call it "terrorism"!

The word "terrorism" is inherently subjective; there is no way to define it consistently in a way that doesn't hinge either on race or on political affiliation[1].

I won't defend ISIS, but calling them "terrorists" doesn't mean anything. The word "terrorist" has basically become the government equivalent of playground name-calling. It's a way of saying "we don't agree with the way that that group is using violence, so we're going to use a different word to de-legitimize it"[2]

To borrow an example from another thread, look at the way the label "communist" was used during the McCarthy era. Oftentimes it was just used as a general term for "subversive actor", and in fact the targets were actually being accused of completely different ideologies altogether, many of them completely incompatible with Communism! But the literal meaning of the word itself doesn't matter; what it really represented was a rhetorical way to other a group of people considered dangerous.

[0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anwar_al-Awlaki

[1] Notice that many media outlets were hesitant to label the Boston bombings "terrorism" until after the culprits had been identified (with some even going so far as to say things like, "It's unknown if this was an act of terrorism or not"!)

[2] Whether or not they are correct to delegitimize it is a separate issue; the point is simply that the word "terrorist" is itself a political statement.

Re: India Orders 32 Websites Blocked, Including GitHub, Archive.Org, Pastebin

#66
post #43

If Github is truly blocked, that could be devastating for outsourced work, on both sides of the equation.

VPN outside India. Really easy to get around.

Would circumventing the ban be considered a serious offence? Not that it would be easy to determine who is doing so, or that they care enough to try.

Re: India Orders 32 Websites Blocked, Including GitHub, Archive.Org, Pastebin

#67

"Blocking websites" is a degree-of-freedom national governments simply should not have.

They could, but I strongly hope for a few things:

1. The technical side of things would prevent anyone from blocking easily, making it costly to censor.

2. The sites won't bend much, understanding the full consequences of their actions, that with every demand complied there will be another one. It starts with evil terrorists and pedophiles but never ends with those, going after political activists, whistleblowers and just random things someone in power thought they don't like.

3. Eventually, we'll have less fragile societies, that won't have issues with anyone speaking anything. Governments will adapt and instead of censorship develop educational programs that encourage rational thinking, fact verification and other goodness, so any ill propaganda will be pointless.

Re: India Orders 32 Websites Blocked, Including GitHub, Archive.Org, Pastebin

#68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Saying that ISIS isn't a terrorist organization doesn't mean that user is defending the organization. Terrorist has become a catch-all term that is used way too broadly (seems to cover any armed force motivated by Islam for many people). ISIS can be an awful organization without consisting of terrorists.

They are terrorizing local populations for a political goal. They are not just fighting battles they are slaughtering civilians into compliance. How is that not terrorism? Edit: He also claimed that it would be better if ISIS was in charge of the area. That is quite ridiculous.

By that definition, ANY fighting would be terrorism. Was the Vietnam war terrorism? We definitely terrified some members of the local population. Were the actions by Japan or Germany in WWII terrorism?

By some definitions of terrorism, all of the above would count as terrorism. At that point, the term seems to be pretty useless.

Re: India Orders 32 Websites Blocked, Including GitHub, Archive.Org, Pastebin

#69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They are terrorizing local populations for a political goal. They are not just fighting battles they are slaughtering civilians into compliance. How is that not terrorism? Edit: He also claimed that it would be better if ISIS was in charge of the area. That is quite ridiculous.

Would you define US drone strikes as attempts at terrorizing the target populations?

Drone strikes explicitly try not to hit non-combatants. ISIS slaughter wantonly. Some people have a world view that needs to see the US and ISIS as equivalently evil.

Re: India Orders 32 Websites Blocked, Including GitHub, Archive.Org, Pastebin

#70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I run https://snipt.net , one of the sites listed as being blocked, and I've never received any communication from anyone with the Indian government or ISPs. So they're not proactively doing anything to unblock these sites, as far as I can tell.

"The websites were blocked for hosting content that is pro terrorist group ISIS and not cooperating with government investigations , officials said." For some strange reason I'm inclined to believe you rather than India's government officials.

¯\_(ツ)_/¯

I have no problem whatsoever with removing offending content from Snipt. I regularly remove and ban users who post illegal or otherwise inappropriate content on the site.

If they contact me, I'll happily remove anything even remotely "pro terrorist group ISIS", but as mentioned, I've received no such requests (and I don't proactively review private snippets for offensive content unless it's reported to me).

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