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Co-founder or employee?

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21–30 of 30 posts

Re: Co-founder or employee?

#21
Trust me, there's no win-win situation in your case. just give him salary, if he's really good than give him a really good salary. That's it ;)

As soon as you start giving shares away, the one who's taking them will get greedy and ask for more. How does that end ?

You'll stop being friends ( trust me ), he'll get way much more from something that you've built than you will,

If you want to work 'in percentages' with him anyway, than do it with new projects and businesses.

Re: Co-founder or employee?

#22
post #10

this post is the reason programmers shouldn't be business guys. There is no dilemma here, the guy is offering to rape you over a barrel and you are actually thinking about pulling down your pants and bending over. Anyone who takes advantage like that is no friend to you. Want some real numbers? At this point there are two choices: a) Full Salary + 1-2% equity. or b) 8-10% equity vested over 4 years and minimum wage s…

I upvoted you, but i think you underestimate many programmers.

People who can't code but want to earn big bucks on development projects always do :)

Re: Co-founder or employee?

#23
Some points to noodle on:

1) The emotional side of not wanting to call him a founder is something for you to get over. His title won't matter to you if he helps you become a billionaire.

2) He's part of your founding team at the very least.

3) 5-10% equity is very generous. More than I'd offer.

4) If he's the right guy, do what it takes within reason to bring him in. If he wants to call himself a founder, let him. The real story is known by you and that should be enough.

5) If you do bring him on board as a founder, you need to internalize it or you'll constantly struggle every time you see his name alongside yours in print or on the site and it will be a source of conflict.

Re: Co-founder or employee?

#24
How much stability are you asking for him to sacrifice in order for the deal? ownership of the company should be thought of in cash terms, it can then be traded off directly between salary and equity. Give him a generous full package of what you honestly think he's worth, keeping in mind his current position + stability of that position vs potential stability of the position in the new organisation, and then let him pick out the details of how he wants to split it between investment in the company and raw salary.

The results should be pretty illuminating into what he really thinks of your venture.

Re: Co-founder or employee?

#27
post #10

this post is the reason programmers shouldn't be business guys. There is no dilemma here, the guy is offering to rape you over a barrel and you are actually thinking about pulling down your pants and bending over. Anyone who takes advantage like that is no friend to you. Want some real numbers? At this point there are two choices: a) Full Salary + 1-2% equity. or b) 8-10% equity vested over 4 years and minimum wage s…

You are right, I am not very business savvy, but I am learning along the way. >Want some real numbers? At this point there are two choices: >a) Full Salary + 1-2% equity. or b) 8-10% equity vested over >4 years and minimum wage salary. I have actually offered something roughly similar to option a) to several other promising candidates, but nobody was interested. I really need to hire another engineer, and I have alre…

One thing worth considering is the relationship between you two, mixing friendship and business relationships can in many ways destroy you both and whatever you're building. Be sure of your roles. Be very clear with what your roles are.

Re: Co-founder or employee?

#28
I understand where everybody is coming from when they say that salary + 5% is very generous. Really, I do. However, I would caution OP to consider the following two (which it sounds like he has, at least for item 2 below).

First, biggest reason to go over 5-10% + market salary: if you think he will bring in that much additional money. Say you pay him $100k + 10%. Suppose your current profit is $50k / year (you said you were mildly profitable). If he ramps this profit from $50k to $200k, you're still ahead of the game. Yes, it is possible: with only 1 founder, OP is stuck doing a lot of overhead work, which would take less time of a second guy. Plus, there's: 2) The emotional support. Fresh blood can definitely help the weariness and solitude of running your own company. Sure, employee #2 may not bring in another $150k, but he could help you increase what you bring in due to more enthusiasm (and, more impt, quality of life).

If you ever want to take a vacation, you will need a second in command. Higher percentage means more (emotional) ownership, so this guy is also less likely to treat it as another job. He probably doesn't want to work for someone else ever again (a common thought), so he wants more ownership.

Re: Co-founder or employee?

#30
If he is really that good, make him an offer that he cannot refuse. In the end , if he is really gonna make a difference , do not hesitate. Why not make him a cofounder/employee and offer him say 20% . U can also tell him to start as an employee and he will be promoted once u start making more money and need to grow.
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