Systematizing Sales with Software and Processes • Hacker News Board

Re: Systematizing Sales with Software and Processes

#11

Post by toumhi » Fri, Dec 19, 2014, 7:46 PM UTC

Great stuff there Patrick. Also, I strongly recommend close.io newsletter for startup sales. Steli Efti is to startup sales what Patrick Mckenzie is to startup marketing.

A lot of the SaaS companies out there don't have a proper sales/marketing process in place. In particular regarding free trials, too many of them are doing only two things to interact with a user:

  1- when the user signs up, send a welcome email
  2- when the free trial expires, send a "free trial about to expire" email

And in between these 2 steps, crickets. The new user is left to figure out what to do on his own, and whether the product is even a good fit for him.

Any kind of process to move a user from "just signed up" to "paid customer" is better than no process. How do you move a user on that journey? By identifying the steps that a user has to go to realize the value of the product, and figuring out a way to move from one step to the other.

It can be automated (marketing) with lifecycle emails, in-app messages or with specific UX. It can be high-touch (sales) with a customer success/sales rep assisting the user to go to the next step.

Just don't leave the new users alone.

Re: Systematizing Sales with Software and Processes

#12

Post by philfreo » Fri, Dec 19, 2014, 7:48 PM UTC

lmorris84 wrote: post #3

rather than giving Cindy the quote which she asked for, I should have asked Cindy to hop on a quick call with me to discuss how they were planning to use Appointment Reminder I get this all the time when looking for vendors for various things and have to say I usually do an internal eye-roll when it comes up - sometimes I just want a rough quote in an email that I can look at when I get the chance. Most recently we w…

Many products & services should have clear upfront pricing on their website - no quote needed at all.

Once you get into the realm where a quote is needed though (due to complexity of the deal, level of customization, very high price points, legal work, etc.), then Patrick's advice is especially golden.

Re: Systematizing Sales with Software and Processes

#13

Post by hawkice » Fri, Dec 19, 2014, 8:18 PM UTC

rmc wrote: post #8

patio11 wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm on your side here with regards to that, but this story is exactly why your vendor can't do that to you. You know you have no special requirements. They don't know you have no special requirements. They also don't know whether you're serious yet. For better or worse, asking you to put something on your calendar and show up to it is a great way to verify whether you're serious or not: if you're not willing to make…

> You know you have no special requirements. They don't know you have no special requirements. I presume "The company and the customer have different ideas of 'special requirements'" can also be a factor?

Customers often have no idea whether they want special requirements before they use it (or, of course, someone who knows what questions to ask can drill down on particulars). There's simply no way to have copy detailed enough to trigger a simulation of their business in their mind perfect enough for them to find every problem they are willing to pay to solve.

Your mileage may vary though, my brain may be addled by too much extremely high touch B2B work. :)

Re: Systematizing Sales with Software and Processes

#14

Post by hglaser » Fri, Dec 19, 2014, 8:29 PM UTC

adwf wrote: post #10

This is one of the hidden gems within the article: "Selling to your existing customers is orders of magnitude easier than selling to new customers. We’ve never really strictly enforced the quotas differentiating our tiers from each other, so I had poor visibility into how many people were over quota, but it turns out that it is almost 10% of the user base. I built out capability in our billing system to upgrade a use…

I get so much love from customers when I email them a few days ahead of the renewal and let them know that they're over quota, that I didn't want them to be surprised by the CC bill, and give them an opportunity to pare back down if they want to.

This is one of those areas where "being a good person" is a competitive advantage and drives lots of retention. Plus, after a couple months of this, they'll all upgrade anyway as paring down gets harder and more time-consuming.

Re: Systematizing Sales with Software and Processes

#15

Post by electromagnetic » Fri, Dec 19, 2014, 8:40 PM UTC

adwf wrote: post #10

This is one of the hidden gems within the article: "Selling to your existing customers is orders of magnitude easier than selling to new customers. We’ve never really strictly enforced the quotas differentiating our tiers from each other, so I had poor visibility into how many people were over quota, but it turns out that it is almost 10% of the user base. I built out capability in our billing system to upgrade a use…

I think this is the better approach.

My Cell provider charges me overages, I can't upgrade to a better plan - there is none (honestly, how?) - so they charge me. The result? Last time my contract ended I changed provider.

If a customer is >X% over their limits, you should be selling them something better. If they don't want to upgrade their plan then it's time to start penalizing them for abusing the boundaries of the agreement.

If my cell provider had emailed me with "Your usage has been over your bandwidth limit by >5% we have Plan X for $$$ more that gives you XX% more bandwidth if you're interested, or overage charges will start being charged if plan overage continue."

Heck, I changed internet provider to one that offered sizeable bandwidth caps when I got Netflix, and I purposefully opt to pay extra for unlimited. I've only gone over their highest cap twice in two years, but I've often skirted near the limits. I'd rather pay a little more and be a happy customer, than be price gouged on overages.

Re: Systematizing Sales with Software and Processes

#16

Post by rrggrr » Fri, Dec 19, 2014, 8:44 PM UTC

lmorris84 wrote: post #3

rather than giving Cindy the quote which she asked for, I should have asked Cindy to hop on a quick call with me to discuss how they were planning to use Appointment Reminder I get this all the time when looking for vendors for various things and have to say I usually do an internal eye-roll when it comes up - sometimes I just want a rough quote in an email that I can look at when I get the chance. Most recently we w…

I am happy to give you information (your rough quote) in exchange for information (learning about your need). That is a fair trade because while I can scale my product or service, I cannot scale my time. If I misallocate my time on customers who are not qualified, I starve. You are uncomfortable with this because you are not serious. When you are serious, when there is a real need and real value, this isn't an issue for you.

Re: Systematizing Sales with Software and Processes

#17

Post by hvidgaard » Fri, Dec 19, 2014, 8:54 PM UTC

rrggrr wrote: post #16

lmorris84 wrote: post #3

rather than giving Cindy the quote which she asked for, I should have asked Cindy to hop on a quick call with me to discuss how they were planning to use Appointment Reminder I get this all the time when looking for vendors for various things and have to say I usually do an internal eye-roll when it comes up - sometimes I just want a rough quote in an email that I can look at when I get the chance. Most recently we w…

I am happy to give you information (your rough quote) in exchange for information (learning about your need). That is a fair trade because while I can scale my product or service, I cannot scale my time. If I misallocate my time on customers who are not qualified, I starve. You are uncomfortable with this because you are not serious. When you are serious, when there is a real need and real value, this isn't an issue…

He specifically say "I had zero special requirements", so you should be able to give him an answer in less than 2 min. That's a low cost for potentially cultivating a lead.

Re: Systematizing Sales with Software and Processes

#18

Post by ianmcgowan » Fri, Dec 19, 2014, 8:56 PM UTC

lmorris84 wrote: post #3

rather than giving Cindy the quote which she asked for, I should have asked Cindy to hop on a quick call with me to discuss how they were planning to use Appointment Reminder I get this all the time when looking for vendors for various things and have to say I usually do an internal eye-roll when it comes up - sometimes I just want a rough quote in an email that I can look at when I get the chance. Most recently we w…

There's a somewhat legitimate case to be made for both points of view here. As a potential customer trying to gauge costs, what's been helpful for me is to ask about license structures and a broad range of per/user, per/server, whatever to make my own order of magnitude estimate. Or you can just come right out and ask "how many zeroes?"

Someone like IBM/Oracle will refuse to tell you boo, because they're planning to tailor the quote to match the value delivered. Just kidding, they need to measure your pockets first ;_)

Re: Systematizing Sales with Software and Processes

#19

Post by aragot » Fri, Dec 19, 2014, 8:59 PM UTC

patio11 wrote: post #5

lmorris84 wrote: post #3

rather than giving Cindy the quote which she asked for, I should have asked Cindy to hop on a quick call with me to discuss how they were planning to use Appointment Reminder I get this all the time when looking for vendors for various things and have to say I usually do an internal eye-roll when it comes up - sometimes I just want a rough quote in an email that I can look at when I get the chance. Most recently we w…

I'm on your side here with regards to that, but this story is exactly why your vendor can't do that to you. You know you have no special requirements. They don't know you have no special requirements. They also don't know whether you're serious yet. For better or worse, asking you to put something on your calendar and show up to it is a great way to verify whether you're serious or not: if you're not willing to make…

The eternal high-touch vs low-touch debate...

Atlassian's whole sales system is to display the prices upfront and have no rebate. Last time I checked, their competitors (resp. IBM Rational and Microsoft Sharepoint) didn't grow by 35% every year for 10 years in a row.

I needed an office for 2 people. With Regus you need to plan a call. I ended up at a coworking space, mildly satisfied with the noise, with a bill 70% higher, but at least I don't have a 90-days commitment and I didn't sit with a salesman.

There are number of situations when you dodge providers who are just a dead weight.

Re: Systematizing Sales with Software and Processes

#20

Post by patio11 » Fri, Dec 19, 2014, 9:15 PM UTC

hglaser wrote: post #14

adwf wrote: post #10

This is one of the hidden gems within the article: "Selling to your existing customers is orders of magnitude easier than selling to new customers. We’ve never really strictly enforced the quotas differentiating our tiers from each other, so I had poor visibility into how many people were over quota, but it turns out that it is almost 10% of the user base. I built out capability in our billing system to upgrade a use…

I get so much love from customers when I email them a few days ahead of the renewal and let them know that they're over quota, that I didn't want them to be surprised by the CC bill, and give them an opportunity to pare back down if they want to. This is one of those areas where "being a good person" is a competitive advantage and drives lots of retention. Plus, after a couple months of this, they'll all upgrade anyw…

"being a good person" is a competitive advantage

I get so much mileage out of the phrase "Don't worry, we aren't the phone company" it is unreal. Sure, we have hard costs associated with providing services, but I'd rather loses a few bucks occasionally on an account than routinely bite the hands that feed me.