Earlier quoted context omitted.
> and he attacked the police officer and tried to take the officer's gun This is disputed by witness testimony: same say this happened, others say it didn't. Other testimony indicates that Wilson may have instigated conflict when making the stop. > Looking at Brown, we see a man who did something really stupid, and suffered pretty much the same outcome that we'd expect for anyone in that situation. This is not at all…
This is disputed by witness testimony: same say this happened, others say it didn't. I didn't downvote (I think there's entirely too much of that on HN) but Brown's blood was inside the police car. There is no scenario that Brown's blood could have wound up inside the car unless he was reaching in through the window for some reason. Can anyone think of any reason other than "reaching for the Officer's gun," even if w…
Einstein: The Negro Question (1946)
191–200 of 308 posts
Re: Einstein: The Negro Question (1946)
#192Earlier quoted context omitted.
> and he attacked the police officer and tried to take the officer's gun This is disputed by witness testimony: same say this happened, others say it didn't. Other testimony indicates that Wilson may have instigated conflict when making the stop. > Looking at Brown, we see a man who did something really stupid, and suffered pretty much the same outcome that we'd expect for anyone in that situation. This is not at all…
You understand pretty much any testimony can be - and usually is - "disputed" and it doesn't mean it is wrong? "Disputed" just means somebody said "no, it is not so". Anybody can say that - just as anybody could have said they saw the police officer shooting Brown in the back, despite the autopsy finding no trace of that. Some did. That doesn't mean the officer actually shot Brown in the back with vanishing bullets.…
It's a good idea to rephrase that.
edit - yes, a lot of black athletes have lower body fat than whites, hispanics, and asians. No, they're not "especially" armed to cause serious physical harm.
Re: Einstein: The Negro Question (1946)
#193"It would be foolish to despise tradition. But with our growing self-consciousness and increasing intelligence we must begin to control tradition and assume a critical attitude toward it, if human relations are ever to change for the better. We must try to recognize what in our accepted tradition is damaging to our fate and dignity—and shape our lives accordingly." Key takeaway, in my opinion, and this extends beyond…
What you quoted above gives credence that another quote attributed to Einstein actually is his . I can even recognise the tone in the segment about Aristotle and his views about slavery. The quote in question? "Common sense is the collection of prejudices acquired by age eighteen." - Albert Einstein Even if it was misattributed, it's still one hell of a motto to live by.
Re: Einstein: The Negro Question (1946)
#194I hope what I have to say is not as controversial as I fear, but I don't think that individual racist beliefs are as big a problem as we have been told. To look at somebody and consciously judge them to be inferior based on their skin color is so outdated and obsolete, that those who do so are fringe members of society who are typically elderly and either changing their mindset or dying out. We elected a black presid…
I disagree with your argument. Here are my thoughts why. We have been 'looking beyond our superficial differences' for a while and it hasn't done anything. I actually think 'not seeing race' is itself a form of racism, because a lot of our racism is subconscious, or cultural. We don't have a racism of segregation anymore. It's a racism of omission. Instead there are pay gaps, unfair justice, stereotypes and erasure.…
As for the justice system, yes it is heavily skewed towards punishing minorities, particularly because of the drug war. I don't know how we fix that, but I do think ending the war on drugs would go a long way.
Your post can be summarized as believing we have not made as much progress as I think we have, but I am a bit more optimistic, and we need to begin converging on a permanent state of affairs, being carful not to over correct, lest we increase racial tension and regress. The only way towards true equality is to learn from our history, but at the same time look to the future while being careful not to make the same mistakes. This means that modern individuals belonging to historically disenfranchised groups should not receive preferential treatment just because their ancestors were mistreated. We need a healing process, not pay-back. It's the quickest, most painless way we're going to eventually reach true harmony as a species.
Re: Einstein: The Negro Question (1946)
#195Earlier quoted context omitted.
> and he attacked the police officer and tried to take the officer's gun This is disputed by witness testimony: same say this happened, others say it didn't. Other testimony indicates that Wilson may have instigated conflict when making the stop. > Looking at Brown, we see a man who did something really stupid, and suffered pretty much the same outcome that we'd expect for anyone in that situation. This is not at all…
You understand pretty much any testimony can be - and usually is - "disputed" and it doesn't mean it is wrong? "Disputed" just means somebody said "no, it is not so". Anybody can say that - just as anybody could have said they saw the police officer shooting Brown in the back, despite the autopsy finding no trace of that. Some did. That doesn't mean the officer actually shot Brown in the back with vanishing bullets.…
Really look at that and think about it: a pale John Boehner turns into a lethal John Boehner just by adding a bit of spray tan. I put on too much bronzer and suddenly I'm a killer (perhaps a killer clown). My multiracial husband is more physically harmful after mowing the lawn in the summer, maybe even more "lethal". (The complexion change is dramatic, certainly.) Hm. The things I never knew.
There's a reason blacklivesmatter is a hashtag that resonates, and that reason is illustrated by your comment. Better go get my bronzer so I can prepare for the fight for justice.
Re: Einstein: The Negro Question (1946)
#196Earlier quoted context omitted.
Garner, from what we know, seems to be a man who did nothing seriously wrong during his encounter with the police. It is quite disturbing that this encounter resulted in his death. It's not even clear that he should have been having an encounter with the police in the first place. We can look at Garner, and see that a great injustice happened to him. Compare to Brown. The police had a very good reason to stop him (wa…
he attacked the police officer and tried to take the officer's gun. I wish this single sentence was underscored and repeated every time this issue comes up. Physical evidence confirms this sequence of events: http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2014/11/24/ferguso... There would not be blood inside the police car if Brown hadn't been reaching into the car. In what scenario was it reasonable for Brown to reach in…
Re: Einstein: The Negro Question (1946)
#197Earlier quoted context omitted.
> and he attacked the police officer and tried to take the officer's gun This is disputed by witness testimony: same say this happened, others say it didn't. Other testimony indicates that Wilson may have instigated conflict when making the stop. > Looking at Brown, we see a man who did something really stupid, and suffered pretty much the same outcome that we'd expect for anyone in that situation. This is not at all…
This is disputed by witness testimony: same say this happened, others say it didn't. I didn't downvote (I think there's entirely too much of that on HN) but Brown's blood was inside the police car. There is no scenario that Brown's blood could have wound up inside the car unless he was reaching in through the window for some reason. Can anyone think of any reason other than "reaching for the Officer's gun," even if w…
Ok. How about the cop grabs and yanks a teen that's near his window starting off the struggle. Teen struggles, pushes and or punches cop to break free as cop grabs gun and lets off shot or two while Brown continues to punch/struggle/push to break free, in the course of which Wilson suffers horrible injury that looks like a razor bump. Breaking free, Brown runs approximately 100 feet. Wilson, enraged that he was not immediately obeyed as ordered, starts firing, chasing brown and hits brown in some way. He fires 11 more shots as he fears for his life even though he is armed and pursued him for at least 150. Brown finally turns around, shot at least twice already. He faces a hail of bullets from Wilson, fatally struck on the top of the skull and dies. Wilson, knowing that officers always get the benefit of the doubt with the law and there is no objective evidence of the encounter and that dead people cant testify is somewhat assured his version of events are going to be believed. And he is right. Plausible, if not convinced?
Re: Einstein: The Negro Question (1946)
#198Earlier quoted context omitted.
I share deep concern about police militarization and police brutality. These problems have been raised for years, particularly in the context of War on Drugs, but also in larger context of alienation of population from the government, and were largely ignored by the wide public, happy to be "tough on crime" and laughing at those libertarian idiots with their obviously exaggerated concerns. It is good thing that the t…
> But when I read recent reports about arson, looting, windows smashed, trash cans overturned and lit on fire, businesses destroyed, police officers assaulted with rocks, explosives and firebombs, millions of damages caused, when I read about "burn that bitch down" - I think maybe this particular instance is not what I want to be part of at all. Maybe associating with this wouldn't do as much to combat either public…
>>> The current wave of protests are not those riots
This was this monday: http://www.foxnews.com/us/2014/12/08/violence-erupts-at-berk...
I have doubts the same people have changed in a week and would be completely benign now.
>>> Moreover, your approval means nothing while those lives are still destroyed and dominated by unjust systems and institutions.
It is true, that my approval means nothing to them. I'm just explaining why myself - and I suspect, many others - while supporting the overall goal of lowering police brutality - and actually having been supporting it way before current events - would not take part in these protests, as the top comment suggested. I think it is still relevant to the discussion.
>>> while those lives are still destroyed and dominated by unjust systems and institutions.
If you want to convince the silent majority the police is going too far and ends up hurting innocent people (or hurting not-so-innocent people way more than it is acceptable), making their TV show them pictures of fires, destruction and general mayhem may be not the most effective way to achieve it.
Re: Einstein: The Negro Question (1946)
#199Earlier quoted context omitted.
he attacked the police officer and tried to take the officer's gun. I wish this single sentence was underscored and repeated every time this issue comes up. Physical evidence confirms this sequence of events: http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2014/11/24/ferguso... There would not be blood inside the police car if Brown hadn't been reaching into the car. In what scenario was it reasonable for Brown to reach in…
They all were killed because police had the right and executed it at will, not because it was necessary. That execution being allowed by the law to go unpunished is what infuriates people. If somebody is guilty of minor offense, to use it as an excuse to execute them that is what infuriates. Remember video of Oskar Grant executed in cold blood? Minor excuse - oy! I thought it was taser - allowed to avoid murder charg…
Let's put it this way. Now, I'm not saying this version of events happened. I'm saying, please bear with me and seriously consider the question: You're a cop. You have a gun and nothing else. Someone has just leaned through the window of your cruiser and tried to grab your gun while beating your face. Adrenaline is pumping through you as a natural consequence of this. You defend yourself. He runs. You run after him to apprehend him, because it's your job and your duty to the community to apprehend someone brazen enough to attack a police officer. If they're willing to attack you, an officer, then obviously they're willing to attack anyone else in the community.
As you run after him and catch up, he turns around and charges towards you. The gun is in play, now. You know it, he knows it. You've seen videos of how this has ended for other officers, where other criminals have grabbed the officer's gun and murdered them with it. You have two seconds to decide what to do.
How would you react? What would you do? I don't know what I would do. I wouldn't want to be in that situation. But the officer certainly didn't either.
Would you run away? Would you let him come up to you and try to punch him, and risk him wrestling the gun from you? Would you try to aim for his legs, even though every hour of gun range training in your life has always hammered into your instincts to aim for the center of mass, and never to point your gun at anything you're not willing to kill? What do you do in that scenario?
My only point here is that the above scenario is the one which physical evidence has most closely corroborated. In particular, the bullets did not enter Brown from behind.
Obviously, it was a huge failure of the police department on two counts. One, that every officer wasn't armed with a taser and pepper spray. Two, that every cruiser wasn't equipped with an audio and video recording system which was turned on at all times. That happened because the Ferguson police department is seriously under-funded. Other police incidents have experienced intentional coverups or other malicious intent, like destroying evidence or erasing video/audio tapes, but this wasn't one of them. The lack of equipment was a factor of funding. No one wanted a video more than that officer, whose life as he knew it is now essentially over. He has to live in secrecy the rest of his life, along with his family, friends, everyone he knew. He has to either cut ties with them or swear them to secrecy about his new identity and location.
Re: Einstein: The Negro Question (1946)
#200Earlier quoted context omitted.
You understand pretty much any testimony can be - and usually is - "disputed" and it doesn't mean it is wrong? "Disputed" just means somebody said "no, it is not so". Anybody can say that - just as anybody could have said they saw the police officer shooting Brown in the back, despite the autopsy finding no trace of that. Some did. That doesn't mean the officer actually shot Brown in the back with vanishing bullets.…
uh... "most physically fit males - especially ones of Brown complexion - are armed to cause serious physical harm" It's a good idea to rephrase that. edit - yes, a lot of black athletes have lower body fat than whites, hispanics, and asians. No, they're not "especially" armed to cause serious physical harm.