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Google News to shut down in Spain

googlepolicyeurope.blogspot.com

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Re: Google News to shut down in Spain

#191

Post by carlesfe »

einrealist wrote: post #189
SiVal wrote: post #183

Earlier quoted context omitted.

According to the article: This new legislation requires every Spanish publication to charge services like Google News for showing even the smallest snippet from their publications, whether they want to or not. This sounds as though it won't matter if Spanish news aggregators move abroad, because the law applies to the Spanish news sources themselves, not the aggregator. Unless I'm misunderstanding (and maybe I am, so…

I guess, the law may also be in conflict with EU law/rulings/contracts. Aggregator companies outside Spain have an advantage over those within the spanish jurisdiction. So those spanish companies can call the European Court to fight the spanish law.

Exactly. And you can even move to a contry where they don't have legal agreements with the EU so that you can't get sued for doing something which is legal in your (new) country

Re: Google News to shut down in Spain

#192

Post by mcv »

SiVal wrote: post #183
carlesfe wrote: post #149

I wrote a bit about this in July, when the law was passed, if you want an opinion from a Spaniard: http://cfenollosa.com/blog/spanish-media-just-shot-themselve... Let's summarize what is happening here: Big media editors AEDE, most of which pro-government, in collusion with the corrupt Spanish politicians have managed a masterstroke which they think will: 1. Get them free money 2. Destroy the discoverability of small…

According to the article: This new legislation requires every Spanish publication to charge services like Google News for showing even the smallest snippet from their publications, whether they want to or not. This sounds as though it won't matter if Spanish news aggregators move abroad, because the law applies to the Spanish news sources themselves, not the aggregator. Unless I'm misunderstanding (and maybe I am, so…

That is exactly the market opportunity I'm seeing here: news sites for Spanish news that are based outside Spain. Reporting on issues abroad is still possible, and they may even be able to hire freelancers based in Spain.

Or to put it another way: with no way to find Spanish news sites online, Spaniards would become entirely dependent on foreign news sites, which creates an incentive for foreign sites to focus more on Spanish news in Spanish.

Re: Google News to shut down in Spain

#193

Post by fwn »

Oletros wrote: post #162
exhilaration wrote: post #93

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Even better: keep the Spanish Google News operating but only link to Latin American news sources. Spanish citizens still get news in their preferred language but no traffic goes to domestic media outlets.

What makes Google News helpful is not only the language, it is the content and Latin American news are not very helpful to Spanish people

I guess it can be expected that the Latin American news sources will adapt and publish Spanish regional content.

At least I see no reason for them not to do it. There is money on the table.

Re: Google News to shut down in Spain

#194

Post by antr »

JetSpiegel wrote: post #188
antr wrote: post #164

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't know where you get the "30%-35% real unemployment" figures, that to me seems absurd given that European economies are known to have large underground economies in the region of 15% of GDP... and in the case of Spain somewhat larger[0]. Albeit, unofficial, the number of jobs created by a shadow economy of €253bn is too large to ignore. Now, 25% of GDP is underground economy, and 25% unemployment seem to have s…

> how can Governments pay for services that a large number of the population uses, but doesn't pay What do you mean by "large number of the population"? Most of the wasted money that Spain, Portugal and Greece pay are the interest on the loans they had to take to bail out the banks. Including having billions sitting around waiting for the banks to fail. Of course the banks say they don't need it, but the interest is…

> Most of the wasted money that Spain, Portugal and Greece pay are the interest on the loans they had to take to bail out the banks.

I don't know how you draw that conclusion. What source are you using? Interest expenditure in Spain is around 3.5% of GDP, just look at the Eurostat numbers. Then, mixing Spain's and Portugal's economic situation with Greece's is just comparing apple and oranges, as both suffer crisis for completely different reasons.

Have a start here: http://epp.eurostat.ec.europa.eu/statistics_explained/index....

Then,

> Those loans provided by the international institutions are simply wealth redistribution, from the poorer southern countries to the richer countries.

If no loans where provided the savings of millions of people would of been wiped out, literary. It seems you would of preferred that.

Re: Google News to shut down in Spain

#195

Post by nly »

jamespo wrote: post #178
pjc50 wrote: post #138

Earlier quoted context omitted.

BBC iPlayer publishes online immediately. Making that globally available would definitely impact ability to sell. An alternative would be allowing people to log in with a TV license number.

I think that would be a very good alternative, some overseas viewers would likely buy a license just for this

Doubtful. Even if we were to offer the domestic rate, it currently works out $19/month. Incidentally one of the best things about iPlayer is that it's frictionless, high quality and ad-free. Introducing TV license login would be a huge bummer.

Re: Google News to shut down in Spain

#196

Post by fpp »

kh_hk wrote: post #136

"the worse the better", I am happy about this. Articles about this have been going around Spanish news aggregators for a while. Now that there's an official statement from Google, message will finally go around the world showing what kind of stupid laws the Spanish government is passing around with the influence of the powerful copyright lobbies. Now, about the recent Spanish Intellectual Property reform. The particu…

Similar (not to that extreme) just happened in Germany during the last 12-24 months.

The conservative party massively expanded the copyright of publishers (German legislation: Leistungsschutzrecht - English http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ancillary_copyright_for_press_p... ) and some of the larger publishers then started to demand payments from Google for including snippets in its news services. Google reacted by removing all those publishers from their news indexes and services.

Somewhere down the line even the dumbest of those publishers must have realised (they've been receiving 80%+ of their traffic via Google) that the laws pushed through by their sock puppets in Berlin did not give them the additional extra risk free payments they had expected (for the work of others - in this case Google). Hint to the publishers: Understand how the (distribution) medium works before you write yourself some dreamy business plans.

To my know by now almost all of those publishers have paddled back and have given Google free licenses so that they again will be included in the index - Question: Will they provided the same free licenses to other search engines or web sites? - looks like this should be another example for an overall review of the legality of these publisher friendly regulation vs fair use & censorship. It will then be another change of legislation pushed through for "special interest groups" by the current government and it's last 2 predecessors that has been declared unconstitutional.

The latest step in this play was the EU Parliament vote on breaking up Google (http://www.theguardian.com/technology/2014/nov/27/european-p...) - I wonder who paid for that vote.

Re: Google News to shut down in Spain

#197

Post by JetSpiegel »

antr wrote: post #194
JetSpiegel wrote: post #188

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> how can Governments pay for services that a large number of the population uses, but doesn't pay What do you mean by "large number of the population"? Most of the wasted money that Spain, Portugal and Greece pay are the interest on the loans they had to take to bail out the banks. Including having billions sitting around waiting for the banks to fail. Of course the banks say they don't need it, but the interest is…

> Most of the wasted money that Spain, Portugal and Greece pay are the interest on the loans they had to take to bail out the banks. I don't know how you draw that conclusion. What source are you using? Interest expenditure in Spain is around 3.5% of GDP, just look at the Eurostat numbers. Then, mixing Spain's and Portugal's economic situation with Greece's is just comparing apple and oranges, as both suffer crisis f…

3.5% of GDP is a large part of the cuts being applied now. The main disagreement is that when the richer countries ignored the deficit limits to increase investment in their economies had no sanctions, while the smaller countries are forced into signing treaties that forbid public investment, in economies that are highly dependant on the public sector. Germany also benefits from being in the common market by having a larger market for their goods, but denies borrowing money for the entire EU as a whole, benefiting selfishly from their lower interest rates. They get the benefits of the EU with no downsides.

> If no loans where provided the savings of millions of people would of been wiped out, literary.

The amount of money in low risk investments and deposits it's a small fraction of the bailout. Not just that, the European Central Bank guarantees 100k€ for each person, no questions asked. It's the investment banking that creates massive losses.

Re: Google News to shut down in Spain

#198

Post by eitally »

KobaQ wrote: post #105
batiudrami wrote: post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Of course they don't want to create their own content. They're a search company! Their entire business is aggregating and linking to other sources.

I think in this case it's a blurred line. In the case of Youtube even more. True, they don't want to create their own content, but when they republish it and making money by doing so, we're in the middle of the copyright discussion. The question to answer in each of Googles (or others) businesses is, when is Google presenting it's own work (search results, etc.) or the work of others.

See, this is what I don't really get. Sure, they can make money by selling ads on the content they're indexing (which is the primary reason their ranking system has to stay egalitarian, or roughly so with a few exceptions), but publishers are by no means obligated to purchase display ads from Google, or to host using Google's platforms (Youtube, Blogger, etc). Imho, it's only a blurred line iff a publisher chooses to make it so.

Re: Google News to shut down in Spain

#199

Post by crucialfelix »

yaeger wrote: post #161
kh_hk wrote: post #136

"the worse the better", I am happy about this. Articles about this have been going around Spanish news aggregators for a while. Now that there's an official statement from Google, message will finally go around the world showing what kind of stupid laws the Spanish government is passing around with the influence of the powerful copyright lobbies. Now, about the recent Spanish Intellectual Property reform. The particu…

This sounds almost exactly what the GEMA is doing in Germany in regards to music. They get to collect money for songs being made public. Prime example in the digital age is now youtube. And they also have something called the GEMA assumption. They do not even need to check if the author or general right holders to a particular song are represented by them. They do not even need to check if the song in question is pub…

My other comment has been down voted, but let me reiterate that you are factually incorrect. Its not a matter of opinion.

> In essence, if I were to write a song, record it and put it on youtube and it gets enough exposure, the GEMA will find it and make youtube to block it because they did not pay the GEMA for this use.

Completely and utterly false.

Re: Google News to shut down in Spain

#200

Post by tankenmate »

crucialfelix wrote: post #199
yaeger wrote: post #161

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This sounds almost exactly what the GEMA is doing in Germany in regards to music. They get to collect money for songs being made public. Prime example in the digital age is now youtube. And they also have something called the GEMA assumption. They do not even need to check if the author or general right holders to a particular song are represented by them. They do not even need to check if the song in question is pub…

My other comment has been down voted, but let me reiterate that you are factually incorrect. Its not a matter of opinion. > In essence, if I were to write a song, record it and put it on youtube and it gets enough exposure, the GEMA will find it and make youtube to block it because they did not pay the GEMA for this use. Completely and utterly false.

And it is false because?
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