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The Algorithmic Beauty of Plants (1990)

algorithmicbotany.org

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Re: The Algorithmic Beauty of Plants (1990)

#31

Post by ska »

twtwtaway wrote: post #17
alexqgb wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The fault in your logic is your failure to account for the extrordinary difference in timescales involved in the creation of tablets and ferns. It's worth remembering that Charles Darwin was a geologist by training. At the time, geology was a relativly new discipline, and the first line of scientific inquiry that demanded any concept of deep time. Its development signaled the dawning realization that the Earth was a…

So what you are saying is that given enough time and some random events my tablet could actually come to existance all by itself? And who set the whole environment for this to happen?

"So what you are saying is that given enough time and some random events my tablet could actually come to existance all by itself?"

Well, no. But there is nothing in the natural world that we know of that is implausible for development over the time scales involved.

Which is really separate from the point here, that the various fractal and fractal-like structures is that complex looking behavior and structure can emerge from very simple rule or encoding.

Re: The Algorithmic Beauty of Plants (1990)

#32

Post by jordan0day »

gwf wrote: post #19
jordan0day wrote: post #3

For something in a similar vein, but perhaps more approachable, check out The Computational Beauty of Nature ( http://www.amazon.com/The-Computational-Beauty-Nature-Explor... ).

Thanks for making the recommendation for CBofN (I am the author). I should also add that the naming of my book was clearly inspired by ABofP (or ripped-off, depending on your point of view). ABofP was a real inspiration to me.

I really loved CBoN -- it really is a very good book. I felt like each chapter was approachable enough that I could just casually read it and felt like I "got it", but when I sat down with pencil and paper and worked through it I gained a real appreciation for each section.

Re: The Algorithmic Beauty of Plants (1990)

#33

Post by jordan0day »

FractalNerve wrote: post #7
jordan0day wrote: post #3

For something in a similar vein, but perhaps more approachable, check out The Computational Beauty of Nature ( http://www.amazon.com/The-Computational-Beauty-Nature-Explor... ).

Hello Jordan, have you read that book and would you recommend it over "The Fractal Geometry of Nature by Benoit Mandelbrot (1982) [1]? I'm asking because I bought the latter and would like to know if this book provides more recent information on the topic. Thank you. -- [1] http://www.amazon.com/Fractal-Geometry-Nature-Benoit-Mandelb...

I have not read Mandelbrot's book (yet!), so I can't really compare it.

I don't know what sort of depth you're looking for, but I'd call CBoN a "medium"-depth book on the subjects involved. It's possible to read it like a pop-science book and still appreciate it, but you can actually sit down with pencil and paper (or write some code) and gain a pretty good level of insight. You're not going to necessarily gain a complete understanding of all the underlying math, though, just by reading this book.

Anyway, it's a pretty darn good use of $40, IMO. Buy it!

Re: The Algorithmic Beauty of Plants (1990)

#34

Post by bglazer »

foenix wrote: post #2

Another great resource about fractals and l-systems is Jeffery Ventrella's "Brainfilling Curves", which is also available for free online to read and download: http://www.fractalcurves.com/

Oh wow. This is a huge nostalgia rush. Jeffery Ventrella's website absolutely hooked me on programming. The visualizations were totally mesmerizing for me as a 10 year old kid. Especially this: http://www.ventrella.com/Ideas/Fluid/fluid.html. It's a 167kb fluid simulation that ran smoothly on a pc circa 1999.

And Darwin Pond too! Most engaging artificial evolution simulation I've ever seen. http://www.ventrella.com/Darwin/darwin.html

Edit: I've been looking for this forever. Thanks for the link.

Re: The Algorithmic Beauty of Plants (1990)

#35

Post by placebo »

dougabug wrote: post #26
placebo wrote: post #25

I can understand why the algorithm for some fractals can turn out to look like plants. What I don't understand (probably for lack of reading up on the subject) is why do plants look like fractals. I mean you won't find some microprocessor in every plant issuing orders to grow according to a fractal formula so I assume this is a emergent statistical phenomena from constraints within the plant genetics - but is the bri…

Fractals have no inherent dependency on microprocessors. Microprocessors can be used to generate fractals simply because they can execute the generation rules of a fractal, but you could could likewise generate them with anything which can perform a specific affine transformation, for instance a copy machine. An affine transformation is simply a linear transformation together with a translation, for fractals the line…

I wasn't really suggesting that microprocessors are required to generate fractals, but rather that I don't understand how the process that eventually generates the fractal shapes occurs in plants. You have a good point that all that is needed is a relatively simple operation repeated in every part of the system which indeed makes it easier for me to imagine how the shape forms. From what level this operation starts to be expressed is probably something botanists can answer.

Re: The Algorithmic Beauty of Plants (1990)

#36

Post by gwf »

jordan0day wrote: post #32
gwf wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Thanks for making the recommendation for CBofN (I am the author). I should also add that the naming of my book was clearly inspired by ABofP (or ripped-off, depending on your point of view). ABofP was a real inspiration to me.

I really loved CBoN -- it really is a very good book. I felt like each chapter was approachable enough that I could just casually read it and felt like I "got it", but when I sat down with pencil and paper and worked through it I gained a real appreciation for each section.

Thanks. That was an explicit goal of mine, so I am glad that it worked out that way for you.

Re: The Algorithmic Beauty of Plants (1990)

#37

Post by gwf »

evgen wrote: post #28
gwf wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Thanks for making the recommendation for CBofN (I am the author). I should also add that the naming of my book was clearly inspired by ABofP (or ripped-off, depending on your point of view). ABofP was a real inspiration to me.

Great book BTW! Is the Kindle version new? I ask because I could swear I went looking for this a year or so ago before moving and ended up having my copy scanned and pulped so that I could take it with me.

Thanks so much! Here's the funny thing ... I had no idea there was a kindle version until just now (your comment prompted me to go look). I am pretty sure that it's new because -- while I don't follow the sales closely -- I also like to look at the breakdown of sales every year and I can't recall there ever being a kindle or digital category. So, yes, that's my guess.

I am going to go buy a copy now just, well, because I can.

Re: The Algorithmic Beauty of Plants (1990)

#38

Post by evgen »

gwf wrote: post #37
evgen wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Great book BTW! Is the Kindle version new? I ask because I could swear I went looking for this a year or so ago before moving and ended up having my copy scanned and pulped so that I could take it with me.

Thanks so much! Here's the funny thing ... I had no idea there was a kindle version until just now (your comment prompted me to go look). I am pretty sure that it's new because -- while I don't follow the sales closely -- I also like to look at the breakdown of sales every year and I can't recall there ever being a kindle or digital category. So, yes, that's my guess. I am going to go buy a copy now just, well, becau…

So, since you have purchased can you tell me if this is a decent conversion to azw3? I prefer epub/azw3 over pdf since it reflows well on a smaller device (yes, some images/charts will never work on a smaller screen) and would probably buy another copy if it turns out to actually be good version rather than some topaz scan packaged up as a kindle version...
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