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Peter Thiel: Uber is most ethically challenged company in Silicon Valley [video]

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Re: Peter Thiel: Uber is most ethically challenged company in Silicon Valley [video]

#71

Post by moab »

icpmacdo wrote: post #46
moab wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

OP is hinting at the fact that Palantir supposedly does some fairly unscrupulous work for governments. Whether this is true or not isn't exactly 'known', but it's been widely hinted and spread around the valley. Take it with a grain of salt though, some of my former TA's and people that I'd classify as highly ethical work there now, so if they're doing anything dirty they're hiding it from the engineers pretty well.

Cloud you be more specific to the content of the rumours about Palantir?

The hbgary stuff that trhway mentioned was what I was thinking of. It's sketchy, and the higher ups definitely don't seem to be above this sort of underhanded nonsense.

Re: Peter Thiel: Uber is most ethically challenged company in Silicon Valley [video]

#72

Post by 001sky »

jboy wrote: post #56
001sky wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Back to econ 101 for you.

Please elaborate.

please see my comment above. I don't think you have a solid handle on what makes a monopoly exist. Nor on the relation between the existence of a monopoly (earned or granted) and the concept of ethics. The existence of monopoly doesn't imply lack of ethics. Nor does the operation of a monopoly imply lack of ethics. That being said, you can un-ethically aquire a monopoly. And you can unethically abuse a monopoly position. But none of that makes any sense vis-a-vis you're approach. You need more resolution in your framework.

Re: Peter Thiel: Uber is most ethically challenged company in Silicon Valley [video]

#73

Post by 001sky »

thrush wrote: post #45
001sky wrote: post #16

Here's the problem for uber: (1) In many places they are breaking the law and/or want the law changed so they can expand without breaking it. (2) This means they need the moral high ground. They need to have people believe they are acting in good faith when operating outside or in the grey areas of existing legislation and policy. (3) Winning at all costs mentality means operating in ethical grey areas. (4) You can e…

I think you've misinterpreted what Thiel meant about Uber's ethical problem. It seems like Thiel was actually talking about the competition between Uber and Lyft rather than Taxis. The points you bring up are actually no longer huge problems for Uber. Some airports legally allow Uber to stop by. Uber is incredibly better than the previous Taxi service for both the employee (read about Healthcare), and for the consume…

The points you bring up are actually no longer huge problems for Uber

That was yesterday, right?

Re: Peter Thiel: Uber is most ethically challenged company in Silicon Valley [video]

#74

Post by etherael »

famousactress wrote: post #69
meowface wrote: post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Uber's executives are known for making some sexist remarks and just generally being douches. I don't think it's fair to say that Silicon Valley has a misogyny problem, but Uber's hilariously stereotypical "frat boy" culture certainly seems to.

> I don't think it's fair to say that Silicon Valley has a misogyny problem Okay, let's flip it then. What's the canary? What are signs that an industry/organization/culture has a misogyny problem? I'd honestly love to see someone posit a reasonable litmus test that the Valley(slash-our-industry) doesn't qualify for.

Let's flip it again; what are signs that various female dominated occupations have a misandry problem in the same fashion? The thing we were just discussing with avions de chasses, why is that intrinsically misogynistic while the similarly themed ManServant startup is not intrinsically misandrist? Why are the attacks on the former a blaring cacophony and the attacks on the latter practically non-existent?

I don't think it's reasonable to actually claim that something so broad can actually exist unless it's utterly global. It's individuals that make choices on their acceptable behaviours, not the industries in which they are employed.

Some individuals are misogynistic or misandrist, and they might be drawn to industries where their own gender is dominant, but using that as a petard to attack those industries in entirety and everyone involved within them strikes me as missing the problem entirely.

Re: Peter Thiel: Uber is most ethically challenged company in Silicon Valley [video]

#75

Post by moab »

trhway wrote: post #42
moab wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

OP is hinting at the fact that Palantir supposedly does some fairly unscrupulous work for governments. Whether this is true or not isn't exactly 'known', but it's been widely hinted and spread around the valley. Take it with a grain of salt though, some of my former TA's and people that I'd classify as highly ethical work there now, so if they're doing anything dirty they're hiding it from the engineers pretty well.

>Whether this is true or not isn't exactly 'known' There are historic facts for that. Just google "palantir hbgary" and enjoy. >some of my former TA's and people that I'd classify as highly ethical work there now ethical people have been through history participating in evil things, especially in engineering roles. It is peculiar ability of human brain to not notice the dirty smell when it would be very inconvenient…

Yeah, I know about hbgary. They definitely have a tainted public perception - I just question the extent to which people seem to vilify them.

Regarding ethics - absolutely. It's also harder to notice when you're being paid quite a bit. It's a pity our profession doesn't have some explicit oaths along the lines of the Hippocratic oath. While it wouldn't stop anyone out to willfully do evil, it might at least make our the average programmer a little more thoughtful regarding values and morals and how they apply to their livelihood.

Re: Peter Thiel: Uber is most ethically challenged company in Silicon Valley [video]

#76

Post by Immortalin »

001sky wrote: post #52
jboy wrote: post #14

OK, so it's obviously a little transparent of Thiel to say that Uber [a competitor to Lyft, a company in which he has invested] is "on the cusp" of going too far, but Airbnb [another company in which he has invested] has "a different feel" and is OK. But it's also a little ironic that the champion of "Competition is for losers", who says that monopolies can be a good thing for society [0], is against Uber trying thei…

Back to econ 101 for you.

I agree, bribing (sorry, I meant lobbying) polticians seem to be the easiest way for Uber to get out of the situation right now.

Re: Peter Thiel: Uber is most ethically challenged company in Silicon Valley [video]

#80

Post by [deleted] »

famousactress wrote: post #21
jboy wrote: post #14

OK, so it's obviously a little transparent of Thiel to say that Uber [a competitor to Lyft, a company in which he has invested] is "on the cusp" of going too far, but Airbnb [another company in which he has invested] has "a different feel" and is OK. But it's also a little ironic that the champion of "Competition is for losers", who says that monopolies can be a good thing for society [0], is against Uber trying thei…

So, I think you're putting words in his mouth suggesting these comments are anti-monopoly in this sense. I don't think in the abstract he's saying he's against a company like Uber striving for market domination.. he's just saying they crossed a line in that pursuit. As for AirBnB I think the Uber vs AirBnB comparison is a really fair one. AirBnB is a very similar example of a company doing serious disruption and faci…

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