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Why Is Google Blocking Inbox on Firefox?

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Re: Why Is Google Blocking Inbox on Firefox?

#151

Post by pcwalton »

skywhopper wrote: post #106

Any time you see a comment like "With some more man hours, it seems trivial for Google to get the application to run in Firefox", you know the author either doesn't know what they're talking about or just hasn't thought about it very much. Anyone who's done any serious web-app development in the past decade knows that cross browser compatibility at the bleeding edge (ie, past what the JS frameworks have worked out) c…

> At the early fast-iteration stage of a limit-seeking webapp like Inbox, it makes sense to focus on the app itself and limit yourself to just one browser. For Google, obviously they will choose Chrome. Once the app reaches some stability, and major changes are coming far more slowly, then it makes sense to start working in cross-browser compatibility.

Would you also agree that it would be OK for Microsoft to create products that only work in IE, then, and to advertise IE whenever you try to use those products?

Re: Why Is Google Blocking Inbox on Firefox?

#152

Post by techrat »

eloisant wrote: post #49
custardcream wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes. It's now Microsoft circa 2001.

Considering Microsoft is now Open Sourcing dotnet and releasing it for OSX and Linux, at what point did Google and Microsoft crossed each other?

Google still open sources their apps. That's why there's almost always two versions of each app on Android. Messenger versus Hangouts. Google also allows you to remove ANY AND ALL information they have on you that is used to target advertisements. Google also allows you to export ANY AND ALL data you use in their services and to import it to any other service you choose.

Really much ado about nothing here.

Re: Why Is Google Blocking Inbox on Firefox?

#153

Post by SimeVidas »

Kalium wrote: post #137
SimeVidas wrote: post #78

A $400B company cannot get their app to work securely & performantly in Firefox, so they’re blocking access via UA sniffing. Seems legit.

Release early, release often, iterate fast. Google's doing these things. Just because you have the resources to do something doesn't make it a wise use of resources.

Achieving web compat with Firefox (and possibly other browsers) is not a wise use of resources? What?

Re: Why Is Google Blocking Inbox on Firefox?

#154

Post by Kequc »

msandford wrote: post #128
TeMPOraL wrote: post #111

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think that most of those comments stem from Google-hating, which is currently a big fashion here. Were it Apple doing it, they'd be lauded for their attention to user experience. Was Inbox a product of a random startup, it'd be praised for good business approach and proper prioritizing of developer time. But it's Google, so it must be some evil plan.

I'm sure that there's a lot of that going on, yes. But Google has the legacy of their "don't be evil" company motto to content with. Which is to say that people expect (foolishly) for them to at least try not to appear evil. The difference between Google prioritizing Chrome vs anyone else is that Google owns Chrome whereas Apple doesn't, and some random startup certainly doesn't. It smells of Microsoft's "we'll only…

Google Chrome is the only browser running Google's own V8, a very bleeding edge piece of technology. Google is working on things like browser-based material design and persistent connections. Things which Inbox uses.

Providing backwards and parallel compatibility is a secondary concern.

Re: Why Is Google Blocking Inbox on Firefox?

#155

Post by mark_l_watson »

Key quote from article: ""It's slow, a lot slower than Google Chrome.""

So, InBox (which I really like by the way) is a rapidly developing project and the team only wants to optimize for their own Chrome browser during rapid development -- this seems really reasonable to me.

If InBox does not run well on Firefox and Safari a year from now, then the author of the article would have a valid complaint.

Re: Why Is Google Blocking Inbox on Firefox?

#156

Post by pcwalton »

res0nat0r wrote: post #140
ppereira wrote: post #117

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That is a great technical argument, however, the reason this has attracted so much attention is because this product is about email. Email plays such an important role in our modern lives that any announcement hinting that Google is moving towards vendor lock-in for email access is going to attract scrutiny -- regardless of whether it is by innovative features, enhanced performance, or browser lockout.

Adding innovative features is now considered vendor lock-in? Interesting.

The "innovative feature" in question here (that they're depending on in Chrome) is performance of sparse arrays with enormous indexes. That's not an "innovative feature" in my mind; in most languages that would be considered an abuse of the built-in array type.

Re: Why Is Google Blocking Inbox on Firefox?

#157

Post by diggan »

skywhopper wrote: post #106

Any time you see a comment like "With some more man hours, it seems trivial for Google to get the application to run in Firefox", you know the author either doesn't know what they're talking about or just hasn't thought about it very much. Anyone who's done any serious web-app development in the past decade knows that cross browser compatibility at the bleeding edge (ie, past what the JS frameworks have worked out) c…

> Anyone who's done any serious web-app development in the past decade knows that cross browser compatibility at the bleeding edge (ie, past what the JS frameworks have worked out) can consume as much time as the rest of the application put together.

Sure thing. As a web developer, I also know that I NEED to follow CSP on every application I do. Something Google doesn't seem to do when running in Google Chrome.

I also know that adding two prefixes along with another prefix, isn't that hard to do.

If you want to be early, fast and get feedback, make sure your application works for more browsers than your own in-house browser. Because when you release it, people will surely use other browsers than your in-house browser.

Re: Why Is Google Blocking Inbox on Firefox?

#158

Post by res0nat0r »

normloman wrote: post #144
res0nat0r wrote: post #140

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Adding innovative features is now considered vendor lock-in? Interesting.

Yes it is. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Embrace%2C_extend_and_extingui...

What are they doing to extinguish competitors?

Re: Why Is Google Blocking Inbox on Firefox?

#159

Post by freehunter »

pritambaral wrote: post #121
freehunter wrote: post #90

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They literally just said Visual Studio 2015 will run on Linux and Mac. --As people pointed out, this isn't true. I was confused by Ars Technica's headline declaring VS to be "cross platform". http://arstechnica.com/information-technology/2014/11/visual...

Are you confusing "Visual Studio 2015 ... uilding applications that run on platforms including Windows, Linux, iOS and Android." with "Visual Studio 2015 will run on"?

I was confusing "cross-platform" with "runs on", yeah. I thought that as Ars says Visual Studio is cross platform, that it would mean it runs on multiple platforms. A closer read indicates that may not be true.

http://arstechnica.com/information-technology/2014/11/visual...

Re: Why Is Google Blocking Inbox on Firefox?

#160

Post by Kalium »

SimeVidas wrote: post #153
Kalium wrote: post #137

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Release early, release often, iterate fast. Google's doing these things. Just because you have the resources to do something doesn't make it a wise use of resources.

Achieving web compat with Firefox (and possibly other browsers) is not a wise use of resources? What?

For an initial beta release on a product with no revenue gains? Yeah, probably not. For later releases? Sure.
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