How to write a developer resume that will get you hired • Hacker News Board

Re: How to write a developer resume that will get you hired

#181

Post by DigitalJack » Mon, Nov 10, 2014, 6:42 PM UTC

talmand wrote: post #148

DigitalJack wrote: post #137

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The GP is giving helpful advice here. It takes stages to get to the people who will have some idea if your side project is really something or a bit of fluff. Recruiters don't have the experience to know, so it is your job to help them out with your CV. They are looking at many applicants and can't research them in depth and get through the stack at the same time. I believe this is essentially true for hiring manager…

It is helpful advice, to get a job from that recruiter. But what I'm saying is that this is an example of the games that job seekers have to play with different recruiters that have their own methods and agendas. It's also possibly a difference between Europe and United States hiring methods, which could be a misunderstanding on my part. But you've mentioned part of the problem, "Recruiters don't have the experience…

There is nothing magic about it. It's common sense. You first make it through a basic keyword search, then someone sifts through those results for basic relevancy, then you get an interview.

You are the one seeking something here, lost in a pile of other seekers. Why wouldn't you do everything you could to make it easy for the person looking at your CV to pass it on to the next stage of vetting.

Why would someone bother googling some obscure reference on your resume when they have dozens or hundreds of others that fit the bill? The key is learning what it takes, in general, to get to the next stage. While there are always horror stories about oddball reasons for not getting selected, they aren't the norm.

Understand the job you are going for, understand the expertise and expectations at the different stages, and you'll do fine. It is basically a numbers game at that point.

Re: How to write a developer resume that will get you hired

#182

Post by robalfonso » Mon, Nov 10, 2014, 6:50 PM UTC

jackmaney wrote: post #157

robalfonso wrote: post #77

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I work at a very casual office, when I've interviewed I've seen just about everything from jeans/t-shirt to a suit. My take away is "look nice" regardless of what level of dress you have chosen. I've been impressed by candidates that wore suits. It shows they understand their appearance is important, however, it is not a deciding factor in the job, just a nice to have. Also had people show up in a suit that is 10 yea…

> Also had people show up in a suit that is 10 years out of style or with hideous tie,etc. And a sense of fashion is relevant to the job...how, exactly?

Actually, I don't care...but for me what it speaks to is self-awareness. Many developers get caught up in their own little world. If they can't be bothered to think about how others perceive them it also points to all kinds of other things they neglect to consider.

This is RTFM for life type stuff. Seriously its two seconds to google for "rules of the interview" or some other such thing. Do you know any Good devs who wouldn't reference the docs for an api they are working on? Same type of thing, read the docs goes along way with a lot of things.

Its not a deal breaker, but when you have limited time in which to evaluate someone you learn to have lots of little things add up to a picture of someone. That's what I mean by that.

Re: How to write a developer resume that will get you hired

#183

Post by JoeAltmaier » Mon, Nov 10, 2014, 6:51 PM UTC

kasey_junk wrote: post #158

JoeAltmaier wrote: post #131

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I thought interviewing was a negotiation, you trying to get the best deal, them trying to convince you to work for peanuts. You meet in the middle, or you both walk away. All the talk of respect and time wasting and efficiency is missing the point. Arrogance is a tactic and if it works for you at your level, then more power to you.

When I'm on either side of the desk, I don't assume that it is the employers job to get a candidate to work for peanuts. The marginal cost difference between what a good candidate is worth to me, and what I can effectively negotiate is tiny in comparison to getting the candidates I want. That is, it is much more expensive for me to get the wrong candidate, than to pay a little too much for a good one.

But do you offer what they're worth? Or do you have some plausible equation of position and experience. Then you tell the candidate about pay ranges and bonuses etc. Then you pretend to haggle over a 1% bump and some one-time perks.

If we're being honest, early Engineers on a project can create millions in wealth for the investors. That they're paid a few percent of that is where the 'peanuts' come in. It all seems reasonable the way its laid out.

As a consultant, I charged many times what I'd earn as an employee. And they paid - because they were in a tight spot, and the only way to get the job done was to pay what it was worth. And that's arguably what their own Engineers are worth too, but have been negotiated down from.

Re: How to write a developer resume that will get you hired

#184

Post by grecy » Mon, Nov 10, 2014, 6:51 PM UTC

Guvante wrote: post #173

grecy wrote: post #154

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I second the question. I have a bachelor of Software Engineering (certified Engineer) with First Class Honors, and I know I'm usually competing against people with a Comp Sci. degree, or even just a diploma. I think it's important to highlight my education, as it puts me a cut above. Am I being a little stuck-up?

I for one would never consider a Software Engineer better than a Computer Science degree. I check to see if you have a degree in software and assume whatever label you use is just due to the random selection by your college. Having no experience and no experience is killer, but once you have some experience lack of a degree isn't a big deal.

Interesting, thanks for the perspective.

My degree was an extra year on top of Comp. Sci. and included fields like compiler theory and design, real time programming, digital electric design and engineering math 1-4 which comp. sci. didn't.

I'm also a certified Engineer (in Australia, anyway), which I always thought counted for something.

I have about 5 years experience now.

Re: How to write a developer resume that will get you hired

#185

Post by logfromblammo » Mon, Nov 10, 2014, 6:56 PM UTC

ryaniscool wrote: post #26

izolate wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why are you perpetuating the myth that frequent switching of jobs is somehow detrimental to your career? Maybe that's true for corporate megacorp, but in the startup world I feel it's par for the course. At least all the best engineers I've worked with never stuck around long.

As someone who has done a lot of interviewing and hiring, I can say that frequent switching of jobs is a negative and a red flag in general. If you had a business, would you want to hire someone who is probably going to jump to another job in a few months?

If you hire me "at will" then I won't ever stop sending out resumes.

I have had my job eliminated, regardless of my personal job performance, a grand total of four times. I have been forced out via office politics once, and voluntarily left a job once.

If you had a family, would you want to work for someone who is probably going to sell or eliminate your job well before retirement?

The loyalty from employers is gone. If you don't want me to leave in a few months, offer me an actual contract, and one that binds you to the relationship as firmly as it binds me.

Re: How to write a developer resume that will get you hired

#186

Post by opendais » Mon, Nov 10, 2014, 6:59 PM UTC

vinceguidry wrote: post #155

opendais wrote: post #151

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That doesn't work in the real world for most people. At my Day Job, I use Language X with version Y for everything. I use Library Z and T only. Oh, and I can use ancient language B as well but I cannot use any 3rd party code with B. You will use version control method G. Any attempt to deviate from that is not permitted because it leads to compatibility issues with the rest of the codebase & it reduces the ability of…

I mean, if your job comprises only tasks and no responsibility, then your job then is to either demonstrate enough value so as to convincingly ask for responsibilities or hop around until you find someone that will give you the latitude you need. I've worked three jobs in the last year where I had a lot of flexibility in this regard. And I enjoyed it when I was freelancing too. The world's a lot bigger than the littl…

> I mean, if your job comprises only tasks and no responsibility, then your job then is to either demonstrate enough value so as to convincingly ask for responsibilities or hop around until you find someone that will give you the latitude you need.

> I've worked three jobs in the last year where I had a lot of flexibility in this regard. And I enjoyed it when I was freelancing too. The world's a lot bigger than the little bit of it you're seeing now. Get out there and see some of it.

Ah, the patronizing tone of someone without a clue. Some of us enjoy working on large, important things that need standards. I'm responsible for millions of dollars of revenue and financial transactions. That means I'm going to be conservative 'cause, y'know, money.

Many, many people work in situations like that.

The majority of programmers aren't web developers with one-off projects they mostly do by themselves.

Re: How to write a developer resume that will get you hired

#187

Post by johnchristopher » Mon, Nov 10, 2014, 7:21 PM UTC

spindritf wrote: post #16

alistairjcbrown wrote: post #14

"Your CV should be about three pages" - I had always been told, keep your CV to two pages, so you can print it on one sheet of paper (both sides). I like it as it ties back into the main message of these slides: "reading CVs is a chore" so keeping it condensed helps me to focus with showing only the most valuable information.

I have been told that it should be one page unless you have had a really long career. Was this bad/outdated advice?

It really depends where you live. In the US it seems you list every significant position you ever held. In Western Europe I have always been told the CV should never takes more than one side. I don't know about other continents or culture.

Re: How to write a developer resume that will get you hired

#188

Post by vinceguidry » Mon, Nov 10, 2014, 7:32 PM UTC

opendais wrote: post #186

vinceguidry wrote: post #155

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I mean, if your job comprises only tasks and no responsibility, then your job then is to either demonstrate enough value so as to convincingly ask for responsibilities or hop around until you find someone that will give you the latitude you need. I've worked three jobs in the last year where I had a lot of flexibility in this regard. And I enjoyed it when I was freelancing too. The world's a lot bigger than the littl…

> I mean, if your job comprises only tasks and no responsibility, then your job then is to either demonstrate enough value so as to convincingly ask for responsibilities or hop around until you find someone that will give you the latitude you need. > I've worked three jobs in the last year where I had a lot of flexibility in this regard. And I enjoyed it when I was freelancing too. The world's a lot bigger than the l…

Are you seriously trying to tell me that for some people it's impossible to have career goals because your job won't let you?

Re: How to write a developer resume that will get you hired

#189

Post by learnstats2 » Mon, Nov 10, 2014, 7:38 PM UTC

dpweb wrote: post #114

peteretep wrote: post #2

I wrote this. It's a tiny bit Perl/UK-centric, but I think you could easily apply it to other markets. Happy to answer any questions...

Great slides - thanks. One surprise "leave off education". Would like to hear some more thoughts about that - haven't seen that before. 18 yrs experience so I'm sure its not too important (I did nothing spectacular in college, but did graduate) - still leave it off completely?

If you graduated college, it might be worth 1 line - a few decision makers will filter you out if you don't explicitly say it.

Or, it's worth 0 lines if you think that's not the kind of company you want to work for.

I once had a hiring manager ask why my K-12 education was not on my resume... he said he had wanted to filter out my CV on that basis; then I filtered his company partly on that basis.

Re: How to write a developer resume that will get you hired

#190

Post by Guvante » Mon, Nov 10, 2014, 7:43 PM UTC

UK-AL wrote: post #84

Tyrannosaurs wrote: post #78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I see where you're coming from but I disagree. I accept people leave when their salary diverges more than a certain amount from the market rate but that would normally - even in a good market - take time. Personally I wouldn't expect a major pay rise within the first 12 months of a job (if you do then you've probably not negotiated your starting salary properly). Add to that a couple of months after that to find anot…

It's simple logic, people move because they can better deal somewhere else otherwise there would be no point. So if people move, the benefits aren't keeping up with other jobs they can get. Most employees are not loyal, because they know companies are not. If they think companies are loyal, they are probably new to the job market. Once a project ends, and there's nothing else to work on they will get rid of you. Ther…

You are completely ignoring being laid off, that is a major reason to look at job duration.