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If money doesn't make you happy, you probably aren't spending it right (2010) [pdf]

wjh.harvard.edu

21–30 of 152 posts

Re: If money doesn't make you happy, you probably aren't spending it right (2010) [pdf]

#21
post #16

Money may not buy happiness, but it's strange how often it's a factor in things that make you unhappy. The unhappiest I've ever been was during a difficult period with my family. Money was definitely involved, and the center of much of the issue, but it was the troubles in the relationship with people close to me that made me unhappy. If money had never been an issue, I never would have had either trouble and things…

"Money doesn't buy happiness" is something said by either the very rich - who don't have to worry about money - or the very poor - to avoid getting even more unhappy about their situation. Having trouble paying the bills will cause stress, stress causes relational issues and whatnot.

Money doesn't buy happiness, but it does help with the basics of life. Which is why a minimum wage and by extension liveable income if you're unable to work should be a basic human right. That, or a similar form of supplying basic human needs - housing, food, water, clothing, privacy, access to information, hygene, etc.

Re: If money doesn't make you happy, you probably aren't spending it right (2010) [pdf]

#22
post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

His kids would, though.

they may prefer 15 years of quality time with dad to a load of cash PS: I'd love to hear some arguments on this, not just simple downvotes. Is HN turning into a place like: "you don't think like me, so I'm downvoting you and moving along"?

[deleted]

Re: If money doesn't make you happy, you probably aren't spending it right (2010) [pdf]

#23
post #19
post #6

A year ago I stopped spending my money on "things" and start spending it on free time. My life is much better now.

This is indeed so true; yet money doesn't buy time. Unless you are in your dream location there's always inherent costs to visiting relatives / friends, match their schedule, or simply go wherever you feel good. So you end-up with a double need for money ;) Still ... I fully agree!

Problem is, I have to pay for rent, food and health care. So every day I work is a future day I don't have to work.

Re: If money doesn't make you happy, you probably aren't spending it right (2010) [pdf]

#25
There are all sorts of complexities here that's difficult to capture in sweeping statements, statistics, principles or studies.

Money (problems) are the source of lots of unhappiness. Stress and its consequences. Failing to make ends meet is stressful and unhappy. While being a broke and careless 26 year old in love might be fun, in most circumstances being broke sucks. Choosing between a dentist or ballet class for your 5 year old is not pleasant.

There are noncausational correlations between making money and happiness. To a large extent, having money is one big example of successfully functioning in our society. It's therefore probably correlated with all sorts of other types of functioning. Making money is often succeeding at controlling your life. It's similar to other successes at controlling one's life (deliberately and successfully choosing a career or family life). These are related to happiness.

Feeling successful is pleasant in itself. Most of us work most of our lives. Money is the main reason. Not making much money is (with many exceptions) failing to make more money, failure is unpleasant.

My Shtick recently is attempting to be deliberate. There's a lot of romanticism around serendipity, less so about deliberate action. They're not really competitive, but they often feel like they are. In any case, spending your money in a more happiness generating way is being deliberate about being happy. It extends past money. Be deliberate about spending your time, your effort and anything else you spend on happiness and you will probably be more happy.

Re: If money doesn't make you happy, you probably aren't spending it right (2010) [pdf]

#26
Last year I sold some stock from my last startup, a little over $1m after taxes, and I can say it's definitely changed things for the better.

In this period of time, I have been able to:

- Quit my founder position at that startup (thus avoiding potentially being tied to vesting or retention clauses, in case of an acquisition)

- Own my house, and invest in a few other apartments, which turned into a little side business with great margins

- Start a new company investing my own money, and not requiring a salary

- Travel and live in a few different cities as I build the new startup

- Completely forget about the price tag when buying small-ticket things: a taxi ride, asking for an extra plate, an occasional flight, paying a round of drinks

It's not as it money made me happy by spending it, but it did remove a lot of the constraints I had before. It's made me feel like the default state would be to be carefree and happy, and as long as you can keep the worries and the stress away, everything will go alright.

As a new worry, I now spend a lot of time thinking about how to reinvest it wisely and continue living like this. It's not overwhelming, and it's not very different than what doing my finances felt like before, but doing it a larger scale adds a new dimension to it.

Re: If money doesn't make you happy, you probably aren't spending it right (2010) [pdf]

#27
post #2

I was happiest 15 years ago working as a raft guide and traveling the world. I had very little money then, but I was very happy. I got to do what I loved every day. I usually made two large purchases per year (the opposite of what this article suggests) - a kayak and a return ticket to my next destination. I now sit in front of a computer. Earn OK money but not enough to retire on anytime soon (I am in Spain just now…

Salary is not money. Money is when your "work" is choosing where to invest.

Re: If money doesn't make you happy, you probably aren't spending it right (2010) [pdf]

#28
post #5
post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's probably true to the extent that buying small pleasures vs large pleasures works in this case. However there's another factor they mention, "Buy experiences not things". This was fulfilled for you simply by doing the raft guide and travelling without spending money for it. It's also arguable raft guide means helping others ,but not necessary to explain why you were happier in the old day.s

The problem is that when you "buy" the experience, the experience becomes a "thing". An experience is either something genuine or a product. A product is a thing, and money changes a lot of it's attributes.

Getting ripped to shreds by a lion can be a genuine experience, but that doesn't mean I desire it. If you enjoy something you can buy with money, there is likewise no need to taint the experience bleak simply because it was money that enabled you to experience it. I have no doubt that money changes the attributes of a thing sometimes, but so can any other attribute, including the way you collectively simplify a set of attributes and make a comparison to an ideal.

Re: If money doesn't make you happy, you probably aren't spending it right (2010) [pdf]

#29

Last year I sold some stock from my last startup, a little over $1m after taxes, and I can say it's definitely changed things for the better. In this period of time, I have been able to: - Quit my founder position at that startup (thus avoiding potentially being tied to vesting or retention clauses, in case of an acquisition) - Own my house, and invest in a few other apartments, which turned into a little side busine…

Congrats! It does sound like you are making the most of it. :)

Re: If money doesn't make you happy, you probably aren't spending it right (2010) [pdf]

#30
post #25

There are all sorts of complexities here that's difficult to capture in sweeping statements, statistics, principles or studies. Money (problems) are the source of lots of unhappiness. Stress and its consequences. Failing to make ends meet is stressful and unhappy. While being a broke and careless 26 year old in love might be fun, in most circumstances being broke sucks. Choosing between a dentist or ballet class for…

Money are the source of lots of unhappiness, but as they point out: We adapt.

The research does not support that "being broke sucks".

The research supports that starving and being homeless sucks. The moment you are not starving, and have shelter, peoples happiness level is on average almost as high as the happiness level of a rich person.

> Feeling successful is pleasant in itself.

It may be, but as we adapt to having little money and success, so do we adapt to having lots of money and lots of success. It does not bring substantial added happiness other than shortly after we achieve it. Being given a raise, or promotion, or public praise gives us happiness, but that happiness fades very quickly. Similarly, not making much money, or failing, is unpleasant but the unhappiness it causes is very much temporary unless you keep doing worse.

Avoiding adaption to an improved situation, and ensuring adaption to a worse situation is key to maximising happiness. You are best served by a slow, steady "drip" of improvement than suddenly achieving wealth, fame or success for example. Conversely, if you need to make cuts, you are far better off cutting your expenditure further than necessary, get used to it, and slowly see things improving, than you are making small cuts with the risk of having to cut back further.

Apart from relative effects on adapation, money overall has very little direct impact on happiness other than at the extremes:

If you starve; if you're homeless; if you lack access to mental health services; if you lack access to health services that can prevent or slow a degenerative condition (pretty much any catastrophic health change is subject to adaptation as long as the change is over quickly - e.g. amputees are as happy as most people relatively soon afterwards - but conditions that slowly become worse avoids adaptation).

(See Jonathan Haidt's "The Happiness Hypothesis" for more on this, and a decent chunk of references)

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