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Amazon Echo

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Re: Amazon Echo

#281

Post by irishcoffee »

pwnna wrote: post #173
irishcoffee wrote: post #146

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you have a smartphone with Siri or the equiv app on it (Android, Windows) your device is already 'always listening.' I fail to see the difference. People carry around a GPS tracking device with a mic and camera built-in. They use it to post their entire lives on social networks. And they're worried about privacy. Hilarious.

Not everyone is like that. I personally have a build of Android with most of Google stripped out and the rest semi-disabled and it should have a minimum amount of tracking. I also don't install social networking apps, or at least deny them access to my personal data on Android. Yes, people carry smartphones, use social networks. However that doesn't automatically disallow them from worrying about privacy, as they sim…

Maybe my point was unclear.

Anyone who elects to put their personal information in a public forum or any kind has willingly surrendered that information. They made a choice to make private information public.

How then, can they be concerned about privacy?

Re: Amazon Echo

#282

Post by flavor8 »

Someone1234 wrote: post #59
andrewstuart2 wrote: post #4

> With enhanced noise cancellation, Echo can hear you ask a question even while it's playing music. I read: "Our cloud servers can hear you, no matter what." It's a killer idea. It's too bad privacy concerns might lead it to an early grave.

I grow tired of this pathetic baseless fear mongering every single time anything is posted with voice control. You people completely ignore the mode of operation and start making idiotic claims about "well NSA!" In this case, as the website makes clear, you have to say the word "Alexa" for it to start listening. If you had been paying attention to the mobile scene even a little bit you'd know that this is on-chip lis…

> All of this is made possible through the advanced, tightly integrated hardware and software in Snapdragon 800 processors.

https://www.qualcomm.com/news/onq/2013/02/20/snapdragon-wake...

cf. Stuxnet, BadUSB. There may not be a remote exploit for these chips yet, but I will bet my paycheck that intelligence agencies somewhere are working on doing so.

Re: Amazon Echo

#283

Post by Karunamon »

hackuser wrote: post #275
anigbrowl wrote: post #248

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Most people don't care because they're not culpable enough to feel paranoid. Some percentage of people will be unjustly exploited, but probably not enough to offset the economic benefits that technology like this brings to its users. I think your focus on 'the people vs the government' is misplaced, because government is just a sort of social technology which can be used and abused like any other technology depending…

> Most people don't care because they're not culpable enough to feel paranoid. Maybe you didn't mean it literally but it's a popular expression in this context. I don't think a desire for privacy is paranoid; it is normal, healthy behavior. But to address the gist of what you say, I think you assume an understanding of data security that is far beyond most end users. How many even know what "metadata" means, or how '…

A normal, healthy behavior is to be aware of what the devices you own are capable of.

Insane paranoia is hearing "cloud-based audio processing device and service" and instantly jumping to "the NSA" absent a single damned fact to support that conclusion.

Downvotes don't make me wrong or you right.

Re: Amazon Echo

#284

Post by tnguye72 »

chatmasta wrote: post #87

This "internet-of-things" trend coincides unfortunately with the "dragnet surveillance" trend. With every new product launch from a "cloud company," I increasingly feel as if I'm reading the tombstone of modern society. The selling point behind these devices is convenience, but at the cost of security. I don't think I need to explain to HN why an always-on, internet connected voice recording device is something to ke…

How's this any different from Siri?

Re: Amazon Echo

#285

Post by melling »

tree_of_item wrote: post #256
melling wrote: post #158

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah, I was just having this conversation 4 days ago. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=8545144 There's always a guy on HN who wants to warn everyone like we're all a bunch of idiots. It's ok to be paranoid but we should file it under an FAQ. Our time is probably better spent discussing the value of the product itself. Hopefully, we get to that today.

Thanks for dragging me in to this. This is an even better example of the point I was trying to make, yet you're still doing this bland dismissal. You should really stop and think about the privacy implications of this technology for a few minutes.

Thanks, I didn't realize there were privacy implications. How did I miss that. I think I slept through the hundreds of Snowden posts to HN.

Now would it be possible not to turn every post like this into an NSA warning? I'll make my own choices from here.

Re: Amazon Echo

#286

Post by bostonpete »

giarc wrote: post #68
balls187 wrote: post #26

Can I change the wake word? Alexa was the name of a girl I once dated, and would prefer not to call out her name.

In the video, the dad says something along the lines of "We just have to say the wake word we choose."

Unfortunately, the EULA specifies that by agreeing to its terms you are choosing to use Alexa as your wake word... ;-)

Re: Amazon Echo

#288

Post by ccozan »

jchendy wrote: post #66
colinramsay wrote: post #7

Well hang on - doesn't my iPhone already do all this? And presumably so does the Android equivalent? I appreciate this will have much better microphone technology but it still seems a little redundant.

A couple differentiators: -The speaker in Echo is presumably much better -The microphone in Echo is presumably much better -On most Android phones (I don't know about iPhone), you have to wake the phone up before you can talk to it

Well, unless you own a Moto X. The 2014 version lets you also choose a custom hotword.

Re: Amazon Echo

#289

Post by rkangel »

chatmasta wrote: post #87

This "internet-of-things" trend coincides unfortunately with the "dragnet surveillance" trend. With every new product launch from a "cloud company," I increasingly feel as if I'm reading the tombstone of modern society. The selling point behind these devices is convenience, but at the cost of security. I don't think I need to explain to HN why an always-on, internet connected voice recording device is something to ke…

> Yes, transmission is triggered on-chip, but who verifies every chip fabrication is performed using the same imprints? You think governments don't have factory floor managers in their pockets?

If you're willing to accept changed chip silicon as a possible attack vector, then you need to start worrying about a rather large set of devices. Your laptop is internet connected and has a microphone. So is your phone. Your TV is probably internet connected, and if you're fiddling with the production line, why not add a tiny microphone? I could go on.

An attacker with a good budget, influence and capability like the NSA is always going to be able to snoop on an individual if the requirement is strong enough. Some hardware limitations probably set the bar high enough that you don't need to worry unless you're an international terrorist.

Re: Amazon Echo

#290

Post by encoderer »

justcommenting wrote: post #261
tjbiddle wrote: post #254

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Wouldn't it be fairly simple to just monitor network connections to see how often it's sending data to Amazon's servers? Granted - then of course you can have the argument that it's always recording, and then only sending data at the opportune time so that it's a little bit more hidden. And to that - I'd just say you can keep track of how much data should be being sent for the average command.

i would much rather have a device that i can actually control and trust instead of having to spy on a device that's most likely spying on me in ways i might not like.

And what's great is that your personal preference on these things takes absolutely nothing away from the device itself.

I don't think i'll buy one because I have Siri in my pocket at all times, but these privacy concerns aren't absolute truths. They only matter to you because you're sensitive to it.

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