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Rewriting Reddit (2005)

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Re: Rewriting Reddit (2005)

#61

Post by LeafStorm »

sbilstein wrote: post #32
joesmo wrote: post #23

I think you can leverage these criticisms at about 90% of the framework software out there written in just about any language. Most developers like to create complex, complicated software mainly to show off their "cleverness" without thinking through the implications for the people that have to use it. It's as if they think that by cramming in every design pattern they can think of and using many different libraries…

I'm not too familiar with Django but with several other frameworks and I definitely feel like this applies to lots of them out there. In my experience though, I've worked on teams with developers who criticize frameworks for those reasons, choose a minimal or no framework at all, and spend a ton of extra, unnecessary time reinventing a worse version of a framework they decided 'sucked' once they realize they need sec…

I almost went down this route on a project once. As soon as I noticed myself writing an identity map, I slapped myself in the face and just downloaded Symfony.

Re: Rewriting Reddit (2005)

#62

Post by jedberg »

keysersosa wrote: post #57
jedberg wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Keysersosa answered this better below, but basically maintainability. There was no writeup, I guess because doing write-ups about internal software switches wasn't really a thing back then. :)

Yeah I think that post dates from a time where you still heard people refer to them as "weblogs". Edit: Found it. It was the 14th post on our blog a time, but definitely light on the implementation details. http://www.redditblog.com/2005/12/on-lisp.html

I think OP meant a writeup about the switch from web.py to Pylons. I'm not sure we ever wrote that one down.

Re: Rewriting Reddit (2005)

#63

Post by menriquez »

" Another concluded: “some vc suit wants a maintainable-by-joe-programmer product. I hope he pays you millions.”"

so this guy is implying that we should be choosing our programming languages based on how hard and expensive it will be to get other dev's to work on it?

that is the most economically unsound and elitist thing i've heard recently.

Re: Rewriting Reddit (2005)

#64

Post by euphemize »

rdtsc wrote: post #21
mox1 wrote: post #5

web.py is still my go to for lightweight webapps. I won't start a big discourse on the pros and cons vs. other technologies, but I will say it is incredibly easy to setup and use. The current github page is here: https://github.com/webpy/webpy If you are looking to get up and running quickly, I would recommend forking this skeleton: https://github.com/jzellman/webpy-skeleton Finally, the built in database framework i…

Yeah same here. It has the cleanest mapping from REST resources to Python class + method. It just made sense to me: The router block at the top plus: class MyResource: def GET(self,...): ... def POST(self,...): ... def PUT(self,...): ... def DELETE(self,...): ... Looks really nice. Haven't tried serving or rendering templates from it, so never tested that code.

FWIW, many other python web frameworks use the very same pattern.

Re: Rewriting Reddit (2005)

#66

Post by ryandrake »

joesmo wrote: post #23

I think you can leverage these criticisms at about 90% of the framework software out there written in just about any language. Most developers like to create complex, complicated software mainly to show off their "cleverness" without thinking through the implications for the people that have to use it. It's as if they think that by cramming in every design pattern they can think of and using many different libraries…

One of the more simple litmus tests I use when evaluating a framework: Does it provide (and require you use) its own versions of data types already provided by the language (or the language's standard libraries)? If so, it's a big red flag. Not necessarily a reason to disqualify, but definitely cause to apply extra scrutiny.

The thought process is: If I have to spend precious development time converting all my std::strings to and from YourStrings, then I can bet that there is plenty more un-necessary cleverness and complexity waiting to bite me once your framework gets its claws into my code.

Re: Rewriting Reddit (2005)

#67

Post by raldi »

keysersosa wrote: post #58
gprasant wrote: post #28

They say hell hath no fury like a lisp fan scorned. I wonder if they hadn't been acquired, would they have still used Lisp ?

We switched to python about 4 months into the startup and a full year before getting acquired.

And some people still haven't forgiven you.

Re: Rewriting Reddit (2005)

#68

Post by keysersosa »

jedberg wrote: post #62
keysersosa wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah I think that post dates from a time where you still heard people refer to them as "weblogs". Edit: Found it. It was the 14th post on our blog a time, but definitely light on the implementation details. http://www.redditblog.com/2005/12/on-lisp.html

I think OP meant a writeup about the switch from web.py to Pylons. I'm not sure we ever wrote that one down.

Point! I think I found it http://www.redditblog.com/2007/08/its-slow-its-unstable-its-...

Also just as anemic as the last one. Oh well.

Re: Rewriting Reddit (2005)

#70

Post by voltagex_ »

gcb0 wrote: post #48

> "It means readable HTML with the proper HTTP headers." said all the other frameworks's authors a few months before him that are now churning out deprecated headers just like that one will in a couple months, while gallantly trying to protect the user from handling headers.

Huh?
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