The Scientific 7-Minute Workout • Hacker News Board

Re: The Scientific 7-Minute Workout

#51

Post by tptacek » Sat, Oct 25, 2014, 2:41 AM UTC

melling wrote: post #39

jamesaguilar wrote: post #29

I tried the seven minute workout for a little while and saw no improvement in any dimension. This[1], on the other hand, has gotten me some significant results so far, five months in. [1] http://stronglifts.com/

I find it hard to believe that you can do squats more than one day a week. It takes a while for large muscles to recover, especially when you're doing heavy weight.

5x5, 3x per week, bumping up 5# each session (we got a squat rack for the basement). It was rough getting started, but after a week or so, no big deal.

I've had much more trouble consistently increasing weight on bench presses.

In fairness, I probably have a mechanical advantage for squats.

Re: The Scientific 7-Minute Workout

#52

Post by wdewind » Sat, Oct 25, 2014, 2:44 AM UTC

dwg wrote: post #24

wdewind wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Are you still doing it? No offense but it doesn't seem to have had a tremendous effect besides making you feel better, which in and of itself may be totally worth it for 7 minutes of work anyway. Regardless, the only reason I say this is because I don't think that this is a good program, and I think the science around it is short sighted and not very well carried out. The major problem is that the studies are not nea…

True, but I think you should consider another perspective. For most, the problem is getting started and forming a habit. By the time 7 minutes a day gives you diminishing returns, you've probably got a good routine going. Once you have a good routine is very easy to increase the duration or intensity. So, in a sense, it doesn't make people healthy but it does get them on the right track. You seem to get this, because…

> You seem to get this, because you said you wouldn't mind so much if it was being sold as "an intro" instead of a "silver bullet." While it's technically true, it would probably do more harm than good. Seven minutes is something that just about everyone, including very unhealthy people, feel like they can achieve. Which do you think is more likely to get people interested?

I heavily disagree with this. People run these programs and do them as written and don't dig any deeper. They don't achieve results, and that leads them to develop (completely warranted) distrust for the fitness industry. This makes them feel like exercise only works for some people, and they must not be one of those people. People feel like their weight is genuinely uncontrollable.

On the other hand, a realistic approach gives them the tools they need when they are ready by starting out easy and gradually progressing.

Re: The Scientific 7-Minute Workout

#53

Post by cynicalkane » Sat, Oct 25, 2014, 2:49 AM UTC

brandonmenc wrote: post #44

melling wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I find it hard to believe that you can do squats more than one day a week. It takes a while for large muscles to recover, especially when you're doing heavy weight.

Just about every powerlifting or strength/mass program, from novice to expert, has multiple squat days a week. The theory is that because the large areas (ex: leg, back) are actually composed of many muscles, you can hit them more frequently with slight variations (working different parts/ranges/etc.) and still recover.

That's not any theory I've heard of. Programs generally have you doing the same exercises repeatedly. Variations are not usually intra-program substitutes, and "slight variations" as substitutes are an anti-pattern. "Many muscles" also has nothing to do with it either--most leg exercises put the largest component of stress on the glutes, which are one big muscle body. On the other hand, the back is a whole lot of different muscles but I don't think very many people do 3 back days a week.

In particular, the GP was talking about Stronglifts, which has you doing the same old back squats 3 times a week, variations strongly discouraged.

Re: The Scientific 7-Minute Workout

#54

Post by jamesaguilar » Sat, Oct 25, 2014, 2:50 AM UTC

melling wrote: post #39

jamesaguilar wrote: post #29

I tried the seven minute workout for a little while and saw no improvement in any dimension. This[1], on the other hand, has gotten me some significant results so far, five months in. [1] http://stronglifts.com/

I find it hard to believe that you can do squats more than one day a week. It takes a while for large muscles to recover, especially when you're doing heavy weight.

Believe it. I'm not strong though. Maybe when I'm repping 300 it'll be hard to do it three times a week. At 245 it is not a big problem.

Re: The Scientific 7-Minute Workout

#55

Post by gnah » Sat, Oct 25, 2014, 2:57 AM UTC

glibgil wrote: post #45

gnah wrote: post #42

I should be able to do better than this. Presenting The Broscientific 7-Minute Workout: A: 5x Back Squat 5x Weighted Chin-up or Barbell Row B: 5x Deadlift 5x Olympic Press Repeat alternating. Do as many warm up singles as you can fit (max 5) ascending in weight before each heavy set. Increase weight on every exercise as often and as much as possible. Get or make some micro plates to extend linear progress when you ca…

Your workout costs money. The other workout is free.

True. That's the price of pulling 300 pounds.

Re: The Scientific 7-Minute Workout

#56

Post by jamesaguilar » Sat, Oct 25, 2014, 3:03 AM UTC

brandonmenc wrote: post #44

melling wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I find it hard to believe that you can do squats more than one day a week. It takes a while for large muscles to recover, especially when you're doing heavy weight.

Just about every powerlifting or strength/mass program, from novice to expert, has multiple squat days a week. The theory is that because the large areas (ex: leg, back) are actually composed of many muscles, you can hit them more frequently with slight variations (working different parts/ranges/etc.) and still recover.

I have never heard of that. To my understanding, the important elements are:

    - Recovery doesn't take seven days.
    - Squats target the biggest muscles.
    - The biggest muscles produce the most testosterone, enabling you to make gains in other muscle groups more easily.

Given those and the constraints of safety and putting up the most weight you can for a decent amount of volume, you want to squat as often as possible. Not just for your legs, but because it enables you to do more elsewhere.

Re: The Scientific 7-Minute Workout

#57

Post by Alex_MJ » Sat, Oct 25, 2014, 3:04 AM UTC

tptacek wrote: post #51

melling wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I find it hard to believe that you can do squats more than one day a week. It takes a while for large muscles to recover, especially when you're doing heavy weight.

5x5, 3x per week, bumping up 5# each session (we got a squat rack for the basement). It was rough getting started, but after a week or so, no big deal. I've had much more trouble consistently increasing weight on bench presses. In fairness, I probably have a mechanical advantage for squats.

Seconded.

I'm a relatively experienced lifter - heavy squats 3x per week is brutal for the first week or so and then your body adapts to it.

I've found that I'll actually stick with a ~hourlong workout, 3-5x a week that I believe in and have goals for over anything quick with no discernible aim. And it's amazing how time magically appears to actually show up at the gym when you prioritize it.

A "scientific" 7 minute workout with no discernible goals is an admirable thing but honestly it's a cheap novelty at best - I've never heard of anybody actually sticking to one, "doing the bare minimum" is just not motivating at all. Scientific according to whom? To what end? Why am I doing this?

Exercise science is inherently a little bit voodoo. Motivation and consistency are much more important than the time requirement.

If somebody's had any success with vague goalless 7-minute workouts, or has even stuck with them consistently, I'd love to hear differing opinions.

Re: The Scientific 7-Minute Workout

#58

Post by Gracana » Sat, Oct 25, 2014, 3:09 AM UTC

l33tbro wrote: post #8

I'm building a site like this at the moment and things like this made me happy we chose video and real humans - instead of vector images. Showing people how to exercise in 7 minutes is easy - but motivating them to exercise is a totally different thing. I get that this is probably for people on the go, but at least having a voice telling you what you're doing and giving you tips would make this so much better. Also,…

This is just the page for the exercise, the article (with link to the science) is here: http://well.blogs.nytimes.com/

Re: The Scientific 7-Minute Workout

#59

Post by hkmurakami » Sat, Oct 25, 2014, 3:10 AM UTC

gnah wrote: post #42

I should be able to do better than this. Presenting The Broscientific 7-Minute Workout: A: 5x Back Squat 5x Weighted Chin-up or Barbell Row B: 5x Deadlift 5x Olympic Press Repeat alternating. Do as many warm up singles as you can fit (max 5) ascending in weight before each heavy set. Increase weight on every exercise as often and as much as possible. Get or make some micro plates to extend linear progress when you ca…

Fitting all that into 7 minutes will likely lead to injury for someone who is in the audience for any kind of short N minute workout, IMO. I concur with your general sentiment and good intentions though. :)

Disclosure: at my peak I back squatted 350 and deadlifted 400.

Re: The Scientific 7-Minute Workout

#60

Post by hornd » Sat, Oct 25, 2014, 3:10 AM UTC

gnah wrote: post #42

I should be able to do better than this. Presenting The Broscientific 7-Minute Workout: A: 5x Back Squat 5x Weighted Chin-up or Barbell Row B: 5x Deadlift 5x Olympic Press Repeat alternating. Do as many warm up singles as you can fit (max 5) ascending in weight before each heavy set. Increase weight on every exercise as often and as much as possible. Get or make some micro plates to extend linear progress when you ca…

This is a good start! When you say olympic press, you are referring to the clean and press, right? I'd try to fit bench press in there and maybe some hyperextensions in also.

I think there is one key that needs to be stressed to people starting to work out: anything* is better than nothing. You may not see great gains by doing only 5x5 dumbbell curls every day, but you will start to generally feel better.

* With good form. Bad form will do more harm than good (I know from experience, having pulled a back muscle trying to speed through a warm-up set of squats). Having someone to give you form advice is another important aspect.