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Inside San Francisco's housing crisis

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Re: Inside San Francisco's housing crisis

#22
post #9
post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[deleted]

While the desire may be rational, believing society can make this desire can come true is probably not rational. At some point, you run out of places to put all the people who want to live in a given place. You have to have some way of deciding who gets to live there, and to be honest, "blood right" doesn't do it for me.

San Francisco does things to make the desire even less rational, in the name of maintaining civic character and political status quo. Not just building restrictions, but management of core services (particularly transit).

It's hellaciously expensive to live in Manhattan, but viable for many low-wage workers with jobs in Manhattan to live in NY Metro.

Re: Inside San Francisco's housing crisis

#23

Loading extremely slowly for me. Google cache: https://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:6m1opf... After reading the article, this quote really jumped out at me: "I was going along, being a good citizen," Todd, now 52 years old, says. "I was a volunteer firefighter, I coached football and baseball, I was saving my money, doing everything you're supposed to do, being a single father, raising my daughter by…

Because this view of reality was the American dream promised (literally and figuratively) by politicians, companies, churches, schools, families and advertisements in the 20th century.

Re: Inside San Francisco's housing crisis

#24

Why don't these people just move to more affordable places?

> Why don't these people just move to more affordable places?

It's not a viable solution to just "go somewhere more affordable" when you don't have the money to leave and there are no jobs where housing is more affordable. What you save in housing costs would be eaten up or exceeded by the cost of just getting to a job.

If you're rich, moving is always an option. If you're not rich or have no financial cushion, you are well and truly stuck.

I just went through a bout of homelessness. What money I did have, I had to spend on gas, food and minimal rent to stay in the area, because the option was going back home where the high-paying job is Walmart or a prison.

And by high-paying, I mean around $28K a year, if you're lucky.

Re: Inside San Francisco's housing crisis

#25

Why don't these people just move to more affordable places?

Because cost are going up across the board throughout the Bay Area, and the transportation infrastructure - both automotive and otherwise - hasn't kept up.

Moving further means increased commuting cost. For drivers this comes in the form of massively increased fuel costs. For transit users this comes in the form of increased fares, since BART practices distance-based pricing.

Commuting daily from Fremont to SF costs $12, that's over 1h of minimum wage. Imagine if you had to pay 10-15% of your total income (pre-tax!) just to get to work. More if you're unable to get a full 8h of work a day.

Moving further also means a large reduction in disposal free time. Free time is a bit of a misnomer when it comes to the poor though - since the time isn't actually free. The article touches on this at a few points - the working poor require a lot of government subsidies and aid organizations for survival, all of which takes time, and most of which are located in SF.

One of the key inhibitors in helping people out of homelessness is, to be simplistic, lining up for things. The basic services they need to survive have huge lines to access them, making a large proportion of their lives idling in a waiting room, waiting for one necessary thing after another. Imagine the DMV, but every day, and multiple times a day.

All of this exacerbated by living far away. Not only are you waiting around forever for basic things, you're now spending more time to get there in the first place.

Even to a rational, completely-informed actor (an unsafe assumption, to say the least), the economics of living further away may not actually work.

Re: Inside San Francisco's housing crisis

#26

Loading extremely slowly for me. Google cache: https://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:6m1opf... After reading the article, this quote really jumped out at me: "I was going along, being a good citizen," Todd, now 52 years old, says. "I was a volunteer firefighter, I coached football and baseball, I was saving my money, doing everything you're supposed to do, being a single father, raising my daughter by…

>I don't think you would ever hear those words coming from a millennial.

I have heard these words coming from a millennial. The thought process isn't related to age, it is related to the mindset that karma is real: if I do good things then good things will happen to me.

People eat it up because nobody likes to see bad things happen to good people.

Re: Inside San Francisco's housing crisis

#27
There is a interesting anti-correlation between this and Prop G.

Prop G will be a retroactive tax applied to anyone who bought a multi unit building in SF in the last few years who would sell it the next few years. Tenants have no problem pushing this bill stating that buying a building does not entitle you to a lifelong contract and that 'things can change' which will negatively effect you. So even though you bought a building a year ago with no hint it could be taxed at 25%, you are now expected to pay that tax if you sell.

Now, on the other hand we have tenants who are upset that they have to leave their homes they (wrongly) assumed they could rent in forever. Either this is from ellis, OMI or other eviction. I feel for these people to a extent- But I am not a believer in the whole "right to stay in your birth city forever" movement. I do not believe anyone has any more of a right to live in San Francisco than they do Malibu or Aspen. It is one of the most expensive metros in the US.

If you are a 90 year old grandmother who was counting on your landlord not evicting the whole building, you should have known that was a risky bet to begin with. If you want to stay in a place forever you should buy the home. Otherwise, you need to be prepared to move should situations change. You need to prepare for all 'disasters' - That could be eviction, fire, death, floods, etc.. If you dont prepare, I will be sorry for you- But I dont think that entitles legal protection either. If you lose your house from a fire with no insurance, you are going to bare that burden alone.

Re: Inside San Francisco's housing crisis

#28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ok. Where?

If you're looking for affordable housing, it would probably be wise to look anywhere other than SF: http://www.businessinsider.com/san-francisco-is-more-expensi... The East Bay is only a 45 min BART ride away from downtown, and considerably cheaper.

Only coming from personal experience, that $1737 number for a 1bed in Chicago is very high and makes me question the rest of their numbers.

Re: Inside San Francisco's housing crisis

#30
post #18

Loading extremely slowly for me. Google cache: https://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:6m1opf... After reading the article, this quote really jumped out at me: "I was going along, being a good citizen," Todd, now 52 years old, says. "I was a volunteer firefighter, I coached football and baseball, I was saving my money, doing everything you're supposed to do, being a single father, raising my daughter by…

These people still remember when you could graduate high school, go to work for GM for a few decades, and have the company pension to depend on in retirement. A suburban house with a white picket fence is somewhere in there too. Nowadays we're much more used to the at-will relationship. The employment only lasts until either the employee or the employer decides that things would be better off if the relationship ende…

Yeah, that's true -- perhaps weird isn't the right word for it; more like foreign (to me). I find the idea of being so dependent on a corporation terrifying, so it's fascinating that some people have just thrown themselves into the arms of the the social contract without any qualms or backup plans.

edit: OK, that sounds harsh. I have no idea what this dude had for qualms or backup plans; I'm just generalizing based on what I read about him. If you're out there, Todd, don't take my comments personally.

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